In my opinion, I just can't see Vader being able to kill Gandalf. Here's why:
Gandalf is a Maia, basically a demi-god. He was sent by the Valar to unite the free peoples of the world, and to give them Hope and Courage. The Astari were given power by the Valar, power to cleanse the evils of Elves and Men, were they willing to heed him. Hence, in Rohan, he was able to drive out the curse of Saruman from Theoden King. It's not so much that he was attacking Saruman, more that he was cleansing Theoden's spirit and mind of the evils they were gripped by. That power was given to all the Istari by the Valar, before they were sent forth from Valinor.
My point is, Vader isn't pure evil, he's just corrupted by the Dark Side. Therefore, Gandalf would wield power over Vader, and (in essence) drive Vader out of Anakin.
However, if somehow the fight was forced, I still wouldn't count Gandalf out. If he can block a blade made entirely of fire, wielded by an ancient demon that is equal in power to the Dark Lord Sauron himself, he could probably block a lightsaber. Plus, Gandalf does how power over light, which he can summon against evil beings, blinding and dismaying them. Also, it would seem that he holds power over lightning, which he is said to have summoned twice. (Once on Weathertop [book only], once while fighting the Balrog of Moria. Personally, I think it's entirely plausible that Gandalf would have some power of weather and thunder, seeing as he was chosen to become Istari by Manwë, the Valar of the Skies. This also explains why the Eagles were allies of Gandalf, as well.)
So, I think it would be a damn close fight. Force Lightning and Force Choke would be of little avail against one so strong of body and mind as Gandalf. Honestly, I'd still have to put my money on Gandalf. He's the White Wizard, yo.
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Yeah, Demi-God sounds good on paper, but that has close to no impact on the fight whatsoever. Even if Gandy is a spirit, if his physical body dies he will lose the match.
Also, Vader, as well as other force wielders have been able to block lightning with almost no effort. Gandalf simply having lightning attacks doesn't guarantee him the win.
Thirdly, I find that the Baelrogs fire is more of a magical fire then a physical heat, and besides even if the Baelrogs heat is pretty intense, it's got nothing on a weapon that is hotter then a miniature sun.
And, finally, will means nothing as Vaders force choke is not magical in a sense. He's basically just closing your windpipe. I have a feeling that if Gandalf were to choke on a stringy piece of chicken he would probably die...
I believe Vaders suit is flame retardant, at least to a point. I didn't think it could block lightsabers however. Also where is this that Gandalf can just set things, let alone people on fire at will? That is some display of power and it is one Gandalf just doesn't seem to have, unless I can find/see otherwise.
__________________ Yet the making of things is in my heart from my own making by thee; and the child of little understanding that makes a play of the deeds of his father may do so without without thought of mockery, but because he is the son of his father.
Thats quite interesting, was Lukes saber in the film more powerful than others or was maybe Vaders protection something to do with the force and thus if he doesn't keep it up or sustains enough hits he succumbs.
__________________ Yet the making of things is in my heart from my own making by thee; and the child of little understanding that makes a play of the deeds of his father may do so without without thought of mockery, but because he is the son of his father.
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No, its the samr for Luke.
If you rememebr, in TESB (Empiroe strikes back) when Luek and vader fight Luek manages to hit Vader in the shoulder, however Luke's saber doesn't go through the armor, but just puts a deep cut in it.
__________________ Yet the making of things is in my heart from my own making by thee; and the child of little understanding that makes a play of the deeds of his father may do so without without thought of mockery, but because he is the son of his father.
gandalf could liek wisper a spell and have vader dancing and singing for him.
either that or he'd be all like " help me out valar" then vader would be a smouldering pile of leather.
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The Valar didn't directly get involved especially not in individual conflicts. Apart from them sending the Istari there is really no great involvement. I doubt Tulkas is going to come over the Sea just to kick one leather clan psycho's ass for Olorin/Gandalf. Plus the spells in Tolkeins world arn't like that, they are more subtle they do not have the same offensive kick, its not D&D.
__________________ Yet the making of things is in my heart from my own making by thee; and the child of little understanding that makes a play of the deeds of his father may do so without without thought of mockery, but because he is the son of his father.
Partly metal yes, although if you see Blax X's post he quotes about Star Wars
"Also, Vader, as well as other force wielders have been able to block lightning with almost no effort. Gandalf simply having lightning attacks doesn't guarantee him the win."
So whilst Gandalf could give him a shock, I doubt it would be enough to kill him.
__________________ Yet the making of things is in my heart from my own making by thee; and the child of little understanding that makes a play of the deeds of his father may do so without without thought of mockery, but because he is the son of his father.
Yes...yes he is...sorry I'm not quite sure which side of the argument you're on here Cool.
__________________ Yet the making of things is in my heart from my own making by thee; and the child of little understanding that makes a play of the deeds of his father may do so without without thought of mockery, but because he is the son of his father.
It's very hard to say what gandalf can or can not do. He sure makes some trees burn in the books, while getting attacked by wargs in FOTR. But I don't think he can burn people because of that. If he could why not burn the wargs instead?
I don't know if gandalf can make these lightning beams that he makes in the films, and games. can't remember that ever happening in the books..
I don't think he can just draw out the evil out of Vader like he did with Theoden. It's not the same situation at all. Sidious doesn't control Vader in the same way as Saruman did. And even if he would try to do it, Vader would of course resist and fight back. Gandalf cand just stand there "humming" like he did with Theoden.
Now tell me. How is Gandalf supposed to parry force push, pull (his staff for instance), choke, speed and so on.. ???
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Nov 1st, 2006 10:42 PM
