Gender: Female Location: WheRe JacK is I'M There By His Side
^^ I do have to admitt though that Kiss between W/L on the ship in the midst of Battle is pretty hot! but i agree JacksSweet....i can so imagine Jack and Liz sharing a kiss like that and it would be WAY Hotter!!!! LIKE ON FIRE HOTT!!
also the "I was nothing more than an almost innocent bystander." line was said to be cut out from the part when Jack is explaining to Norrington about how its really Will's fault that he became a pirate, u no, when they're on the roof, but they had to cut it out.
__________________
"Get that out of my face." "It's not in your face, it's in my hand." "Get what's in your hand out of my face." <3 set by yours truly
yeah PirateDiva i know, it isnīt so so boring kiss as always but because they gave them much better situation for that kiss... but W/L kiss will never be too good to at least pay attetion for...but yeah that they gave too good situation for THEIR kiss is what worries me the most...i am not afraid of w/l ending coz i actually really donīt believe it...but ...well i hope there wonīt be jack in this scene....coz poor jack it would be terrible feeling for him to see it....
Gender: Female Location: at the second star to the right
"but well i understand....some people simply love W/L kissing or just scenes between them mean "true love" to them...i didnīt mean you willo... but my friends they love W/L and aaalways say that it is surely couple for the ending coz they love eachother and with jack it canīt be love and blah,blah...."--------jackssweet
Ha ha, no offense taken! Just to clarify, when Will and Liz kiss (just in AWE, not the other movies), I say it's beautiful from a cinematic standpoint. I think it is a beautiful scene, very picturesque and dream-like and it really captures the passion that's behind the spirit of the movies. But I am far from converted into a W/Eer. They just aren't soulmates, imo. I hardly see them interact with each other and I really think it was a shame we didn't see their relationship evolve from COTBP to DMC. I think a year was too huge a jump. Will and Liz ended COTBP as this cute little couple that had just admitted they loved each other. Well, one admitted he loved the other, but that's not the point. And the next thing we know, their WEDDING is interrupted. I think some J/Eers, and possibly myself, would have been more supportive of the W/E relationship had we seen it develop. I just don't buy into it and even though, yes, they work well as a team, I don't see the union between them. I see a boy half starstruck, half just going along with his first girlfriend, and a girl who is way too immature to commit to marriage yet.
Gender: Female Location: at the second star to the right
Well said, ditte3. I think again if we had seen them between COTBP and DMC, we would get a clue as to whether or not they really were meant for each other. Speaking from experience, being engaged is a really trying time for a couple. It's the first time the two of you are really planning and going through the same stressful thing together. Even for Will and Liz who had an adventure before, planning a wedding is a completely unique experience. All we know about them is that Will taught her to fight (yay!) and they have both remained sexually pure...although I'm not 100% sure Will's a virgin, ha ha ha.
i'm totally there with ya. it's irritating to me that the writers/makers think that by throwing in a cinematic kiss, they can totally discredit everything that happened in film 2. I'm slightly annoyed. Cause yeah, the kiss on the ship looks fantastic, really beautiful and will be a great moment. but it's like they are trying to bury the end of film 2 with it or something. you can't create chemistry between characters by pure scenic imagery alone.
and no matter how much Will and Liz's relationship "develops" and "matures" by surviving the rough times, I just don't think I'll be able to fully enjoy them ending together, with film 2 still sitting on my bookcase, evincing a whole different direction they trilogy seemed to be taking.
Gender: Female Location: at the second star to the right
I haven't seen AWE, obviously, so I don't know what T&T have in store for us, but I can say that if I were writing it, and I wanted to break rules be unconventional and all that, I would have stuck with the COTBP dynamic in which it was obvious that Jack and Liz had chemistry, but neither really wanted to go any further than a friendship/respect relationship. As far as bumps in the road go, Will and Liz have plenty already. Their WEDDING was interrupted because they were arrested and sentenced to death for goodness sake. There was no need to bring Jack into it and stir up all this lust, guilt, etc. Really, if T&T get mad at people for being into J/E, they should have thought of something for the two of them to do on the way from Tortuga to Isla de Cruces. Why not do some exposition, or backstory, or a small subplot? Why play with this idea that Jack could have her on his mind for an entire year without ever even seeing her and then hardly knowing what to do with himself when he finally did see her again? And why have her go for it? I don't understand that. There had to have been another way for their characters to develop without throwing any romantic feelings in.
I fully agree. Well said. Bravo.
And I suppose, if there is no other logical conclusion, it was the money that clinched the deal. Controversy and love triangles are wonderful ways of making money.
Gender: Female Location: WheRe JacK is I'M There By His Side
Amen to all of the above!
i agree with Kate....i got annoyed of the kiss between Will and Liz in the middle of the battle....yes the Kiss is actually very Romantic stopping in the Middle of Battle and Kissing with a Million things going on around u and danger lurking everywhere...it's beautiful, but i got the same feeling as if they were trying to out do the passion of the Jack/Liz kiss!
But then i got to thinking the Jack and Liz kiss was still way better, they didnt need the "stopping in the middle of a battle" drama to add passion to their kiss. Their Passion came Natural...it came from within, it came from the feelings they had to offer....the Feelings they have for each other!! and that was Beautiful...because there was nothing in that scene except THEM...ONLY JACK AND LIZ!!
as oppose to the Will and Liz kiss in the midst of Battle....they needed all that drama, of stopping and taking in one another to add the passion...cause honestly thats what makes this Kiss so HOT! not Will and Liz, it's the scenery and where this kiss is taking place and when!
Gender: Female Location: at the second star to the right
I think you're onto something, piratediva. I can be a romantic at times, but kissing in the middle of a battle as intense as this one looks just doesn't...I don't know. It doesn't "ring true" if that makes sense. It's beautiful and cinematic and I know I'll probably want to stand up and cheer when I see it onscreen, but when compared to the last kiss we saw, it looks forced. It looks like they have to try to make it look passionate, whereas the DMC kiss seemed so natural and was filmed very simply.
__________________
"Get that out of my face." "It's not in your face, it's in my hand." "Get what's in your hand out of my face." <3 set by yours truly
Gender: Female Location: on the dingy with dear ol' Jacky
AAAAAAAW! I'd heard it before but I'd never thought to apply it to this situation.
BTW a source I REALLY trust told me the firts draft ending! SQUEEE I know!!! It's not what's gonna happen EXACTLY so I'm not sad that I know but it still gives a sense of what will. VERY bitter sweet! I'll cry if it happens but fortunately it won't.
If anyone wants to know PM me!
__________________ My hats off to joanjoan
Freedom...
Gender: Female Location: on the dingy with dear ol' Jacky
BTW to all the ppl I have or WILL tell what I know I'm sorry if u guys go to the movie and it turns out to be NOTHING like what I've told u. As I said I fully trust the source BUT u can never be sure who to trust these days maybe he's just playing a joke but I doubt it.
Anyways this is one case I hope I've been screwed over cause even though the same person says that it's not gonna be exactly like what he's told me and that it's just a draft. I didn't fully like what I read..too bittersweet for my taste.
__________________ My hats off to joanjoan
Freedom...
I have to thoroughly disagree about the kisses, and passion.
For one thing, passion is subjective. When I look at the Kiss of Death, I see no passion. There is NOTHING there except that Elizabeth is trying desperately to distract Jack, and Jack is puzzled but interested in what Elizabeth is doing.
The only time I see passion is when the kiss finally breaks apart, and right as Elizabeth chains Jack up, she gets this LOOK on her face that says how she's really feeling, and I can tell you she has never once looked at Will that way. It definitely was NOT a loving glance.
Besides the fact that the kiss was used as a betrayal, it was hardly 'appropriate'. They were being chased by a sea monster that they can't kill, and they're trying to escape. In the background of J/E's kiss, is a shattered ship filled with the broken, dead bodies of Jack's crew.
Yeah, that's REAL romantic. And appropriate. Please, take a moment and think about that before you fuss about how unrealistic the W/E kiss is.
Back to the Kiss of Death. Remember why it's called that? Elizabeth possibly did feel some stirring in her body when she kissed Jack. Who the heck wouldn't? But the fact is -- It's called the Kiss of Death because she left him to die. Again, I am not sure how you can feel right in justifying that Jack should EVER be with the person who killed him. It's almost like saying that a person should remain with their abuser. It doesn't make sense.
Back to the Battlefield Romance (Terry's phrase, not mine) Kiss between W/E. This kiss is all about each other. It is a moment of pure, absolute passion where NOTHING matters to them except each other. There is no hidden agenda, there is no betrayal. There is only pure emotion from both participants.
They fight together, love together, and I'd wager they'd die together if necessary. What did Elizabeth ever give to Jack that even remotely compares to what she gives to Will?
Again, it's just an opinion, but it's still as valid as any of yours.
__________________
~Banner made by JES, avatar made by Veronica_Rich. Thanks, girls!!~
Gender: Female Location: at the second star to the right
It's very valid, Surreal, and I do see your point. It's the bottom line of all the kiss scenes so far. And I think we're all in agreement the W/E kiss has a lot of passion. I guess this is just the movie maker wannabe in me, but in movies, if they're going to have a kiss, the hottest, most passionate ones are filmed very simply. There's barely any focus on the background and the best, ultimate best kisses ever, actually further the plot. The story doesn't stop so the couple can share a kiss. This is very rare, but it can happen.
You'll just blame the J/E in me, but I thought it was very smart of T&T that after making the decision Jack and Liz would kiss, it would have to be in a way that would further the plot, still including Will. It's so perfect for the triangle, and the plot doesn't stop. Even though these movies have so much supernatural elements in them, they are grounded in reality- relationships, decisions, guilt, "what one can do and what can't do." To stop what looks like a climactic battle just so our established couple can kiss looks very forced. If they're in love and are the soulmates (which they very well could be and I'm fine with), why do we have to see this? It makes me wonder if they kiss any time before or after this. Maybe when I see the whole thing it will flow much better, but it looks forced and the plot stops. Time stands still. While that's how a kiss should feel to the two participants, that's not how it should feel to an audience.
I do blame the J/E shipper in you. I honestly think that the problem here is that it's a kiss between Will/Elizabeth, and nothing more or less. The kiss between J/E is no more appropriate than when W/E kiss and it seems more random and actually not very well-done. It's more plot-devicey and an excuse to have J/E kiss, and to me, THAT kiss was more forced and strange than two people who are in love sharing a kiss in the midst of danger.
In fact, the kiss between Will and Elizabeth, I suspect is them sealing their wedding vows. Therefore, the plot is not interrupted. It is them choosing their fates. Binding their souls together. That kiss not only furthers the plot, it will cause complications with said plot.
And the thing about the kiss is, the battle DOES NOT stop. It is on-going. In one shot, you see Will and Elizabeth kissing, and there are more people swinging on-board the Pearl. This kiss is absolutely vital to what happens in the rest of the film.
And again, I disagree about the hottest and most passionate kisses, simply because the J/E kiss was not hot and it was not passionate, at least not in the sense of a loving, fulfilling relationship. Also, a lot of kisses that I have enjoyed watching in films have something happening in the background (fountains, planes taking off, birds taking flight, rainbows, them stopping in the middle of a dance floor to kiss...)
What makes a kiss best, in my opinion, is the feeling behind it. Again, Jack and Elizabeth's kiss is filled with deceit, betrayal, possible lust but absolutely no love. Will and Elizabeth kiss, and you can feel the longing, the joy...the NEED. Kisses don't have to be long and drawn out in order to be sexy and beautiful.
__________________
~Banner made by JES, avatar made by Veronica_Rich. Thanks, girls!!~
There's no point really in debating which kiss is hotter. That's like trying to compare apples to oranges. There are some people who really like the tasty tang of a fresh apple and some who find oranges refreshingly sweet.
There are people who are allergic to apples, and allergic to oranges. You can't persuade them otherwise on which fruit is better because they'll passionately disagree or have a catastrophic allergic reaction.
And a small quibble Surreal, as always.
Yes, there might have been deceit, betrayal in the kiss between J/E but there's nothing to suggest that there was no love involved. Quite the contrary; Jack's feelings border on love, and there are two sides to every kiss. Elizabeth's emotions are rightfully conflicted because let's face it, who says that you have to choose between apples and oranges?
It's your personal opinion that there was only lust and betrayal involved--we won't find out ALL the repercussions of DMC until the end of AWE.
That's my two cents. Now I'm going to find myself a whole barrel of apples.
Jack might have felt a little love, but Elizabeth's choice is quite clear. She doesn't love Jack. Do you think for one moment that she would have left him behind if she did love him?
It's not just opinion, it's fact, based on what we know about Elizabeth's character. What Elizabeth wants, she gets. If she wants to save you, she will do everything in her power to do so.
We saw none of that with Jack. Not until after, when the guilt was eating her up. Does she love Jack then? Could be. But the kiss did NOT have love in it. Even Jack doesn't show love. He seems confused, a bit wary, but he's enjoying the kiss (as any man would ).
And I agree, it's only opinion as far as what's hot, but it cannot be disputed that if Elizabeth had had such deep feelings for Jack that she didn't do more to save him.
__________________
~Banner made by JES, avatar made by Veronica_Rich. Thanks, girls!!~
KMC Community Forums
LIKE ON FIRE HOTT!!
Apr 24th, 2007 10:17 PM
but W/L kiss will never be too good to at least pay attetion for...but yeah that they gave too good situation for THEIR kiss is what worries me the most...i am not afraid of w/l ending coz i actually really donīt believe it...but ...well i hope there wonīt be jack in this scene....coz poor jack it would be terrible feeling for him to see it....
I honestly think that the problem here is that it's a kiss between Will/Elizabeth, and nothing more or less. The kiss between J/E is no more appropriate than when W/E kiss and it seems more random and actually not very well-done. It's more plot-devicey and an excuse to have J/E kiss, and to me, THAT kiss was more forced and strange than two people who are in love sharing a kiss in the midst of danger.
). 
