What makes me say it? Are you kidding? It's the fact that morality has so long been professed to be the side-effect of a greater being (read: God) Well, it's just not ****ing true! You want to say that the world would be raping children and eating puppies if there were no god, but it's just not true. And the real issue is that you profess that morality is a result of an all-knowing god that has imparted knowledge, but once a person realizes that god, as well as morality, are a side effect of the human existence, not his actual existence, then we can all get past this idiotic notion that all of the good things in human existence come from god. (or your explaination of god in relation to those good things)
If you want to really understand why the god delusion has any merrit, it's because 99% of those who don't subscribe to your lunacy are actually engaging in a debate with you; despite the reality that the arguments are soundly and profoundly different. Your only real footing is based on people who have the sense to finish crawling out of that evolutinary sludge pond actually entertaining your stupidity. I'm guilty of it as much as the next guy. I just hope that one day your religious beliefs will be yours alone and not a method for swaying others to be cupbeares for your particular brand of stupidity or the gerbil footpedal-slapping ignorance that has allowed your type to have a say in intellignet dissent for the last 10,000 years.
You should be ashamned of your effect on human existence and you should be begging the forgiveness of every rational human being that has existed from Aristotle to Jefferson and beyond. Personally, I hope your god impales himself on his own stupidity and hypocrisy. You scoff at the existence of every divine human construct from Ra and Horus and Osiris to Zeus to Ptah to Jupiter and Apollo to Buddha and Muhammed and Santa Claus and the Easter bunny and the Brothers Grimm, but assume the same delusion suddenly means legitimacy. Pick up a ****ing book besides the bible and you'll see there's nothing new in your particular delusion. And beyond that, pick a god that actually serves your needs, because that's really all you're doing: picking a god. You're choosing a religion the way most people do a political candidate or sitcom. Get over yourselves. Your religion is a wonderful thing...for you. But keep your imaginary friends off my shoulders. Not only can you keep them to yourself, but you can shove them squarely up your own ass.
__________________ "If I were you"
"If you were me, you'd know the safest place to hide...is in sanity!
"ID is not based on religion, it's based on science" <--- official stance of ID
Though it's odd that all it's major proponents strictly hold the belief that the "intelligence" in question could only be God when you boil it down; not any god mind you, but the one and only "Christian God". Hallelujah, praised be the Lord Jesus!
Edit: You do have to wonder how they "scientifically" came to the Christian God conclusion though.
But you really don't know that, do you? The concept of hypothetical history is dumb, because there's simply no way to know. If the wheel was never invented, would we be flying in hovercrafts right now? If the South won, would they be a world superpower? What if the Allies lost WW2? What if electricity was never put to technological use? And I can go on and on. The point is that you don't know what you're asserting; that we would have morals without god.
__________________
Last edited by Quiero Mota on May 7th, 2008 at 10:05 PM
Of course there is no difinitive way of knowing that, but logic dictates that is it so.
There are Atheist who don't go around raping, stealing and killing, there are Atheist who in fact help complete strangers, while expecting nothing in return, because it's the human thing to do.
Also, not all cultures had a "be good or you'll be punished after you're dead" set of religious rules, yet anarchy wasn't present in their societies.
Because most people of faith are trying to save people from a terrible eternity. I feel this is a noble cause, though displaced. The more noble cause is to mention it once and then let it go. Let the person think for themselves and if interested in what you're saying do their own research on the topic. If they decide to take on your views then good for them. However, anyone who makes any major changes in their views to life or after life should make a thorough study of any topic, not just a religious one.
__________________ Deja Moo: The feeling that you've heard this bull before.
You're certain that your understanding of god is a valid one. You're also certain that your devotion to god is the result of his existence. However, there are any number of religions that exist in the past where the devotion of their followers was as great or greater than your own, and they had morals. Buddhists have morals, despite having no god in which they invest. There are any number of atheists, on this board even, that have morals.
And it is nothing akin to hypothetical history. I'm not guessing what would have happened, I know full well that killing would still be considered wrong if the myth of Jesus being divine had gotten out of ancient Palestine or not.
So, if I'm just being dumb, I'd like for you to explain why christian morals are superior to the morals of a buddhist or my own morals, or the morals of a hindu. You have to understand the argument your are really making is that humanity would still be clubbing our mates over the head and driving rock cars with their own feet if god hadn't descended from on high and told Moses what to write or became flesh himself and was crucified for our sins.
I would also venture the opinion that once one really reads the bible, they will see that it imparts no real morals, other than live your life on your knees being afraid of an ancient jewish desert myth. There are fossil remains of early humans, well before god decided to come down here and get his G.E.D. in humanity, that have been placed in graves and cared for by their family and scenes on cave walls of families that illustrate their concern for each other. It wasn't until they started looking for answers and being led by the fear exterted by their religious leaders (read: the guy who made it up in the first place and then also felt the need to spread his myths at the end of a sword or stone axe, etc.)
__________________ "If I were you"
"If you were me, you'd know the safest place to hide...is in sanity!
KMC Community Forums
May 7th, 2008 06:08 AM
