I already know that, I should have typed "even though its non cannon". That was just the first thing that popped up in my head. Well thor has commented a lot on hulks speed, is that better, its cannon.
Sure, if Thor’s actually said that. But there’s a difference between faster than one expects you to be and actually being fast. The Hulk is fast for someone his size, and he does appear to have some minor super-speed, but it’s nowhere near as fast someone like Superman. Comparing the Hulk’s speed to Superman’s speed, is like comparing Spider-Man’s speed to the Flash’s speed. There’s just too big of a difference.
I understand that part but the only thing that superman said about doomsday is that he was fast, he didnt say how fast just that he was fast. People base booster gold comment on doomsday speed, he might would have said that same thing about spiderman if he blitzed him. For doomsday to be so fast he sure as hell was getting thrown around by maxima until superman arrived. I agree, doomsday does have speed but the things to thing about is how many people have superman complimented on there speed.
I agree that superman is faster then hulk but I can also see hulk going blow for blow with superman. If you say other wise I would need to ask this question again, do you think that mimic would walk all over hulk since mimic does fly 93000 miles per sec?
The issue is really not If Superman is faster than the Hulk. No Hulk has ever moved at running speeds Superman has been clocked at (vs Flash for instance). And for obvious reasons (Hulk can't Fly) Superman is capable of traveling at FTL speed - beyond what Hulk is capable of.
But where is really comes down to is a few things no one has been capable of proving:
1. Superman is very vulnerable to Hulk level assaults: Dispite the denial of Superman fans, he taken severe beatings by the likes of Mongul, Grundy, Titus, Graak and obviously Doomsday. All of which are easily under Hulk's strength level both in history and feat-wise. Not only that, but Hulk's powerset is constantly GROWING strength.
And we are actually talking about WWH here...who in world breaker mode was ripping up the seaboard with a footstep (not even trying) - this is still beyond anything any of Superman's opponents were ever capable of.
There is no doubt WWH is more powerful than those guys....and even if you dont think so, you can not deny that he would surpass them due to dynamic strength over the course of a fight.
2. Hulk always responds well to speed attacks. He generally either directly counters speed assaults, or takes them full on and then counters. He has taken the best shots in comic from the likes of Abomination Gladiator, Juggernaut, Sentry, Thor, the Silver Surfer, and Thanos ....and none have even so much have been able to effectively harm him whatsoever.
And again thats Savage Hulk.....WWH is a different animal.
This may be due to his enhanced reflexes or enhanced senses but a pissed Hulk has stunned opponents who consider him a slug time and time again. Speed Blitz vs Hulk = fail. He responds very well to speed attacks and counters with nothing but growing levels of devastation.
3. Superman has a poor record of avoiding a toe-to-toe fight, which I attribute to his fighting style. If he can't take enemies down with flight, HV and freeze breath...he generally resorts to going toe to toe. There is simply no great battle speed advantage really shown when it come to dealing the kind of blows needed to effect Hulk types.
If he is truly faster, he should never get hit ever by the likes of Mongul and Grundy. But it happens all the time so yes speed wont be a factor with Hulk either.
Superman will eventually have go blow for blow with World War Hulk and try to hold his own. This will be his undoing. World War Hulk who is already on his level would only get stronger, angrier, and with his growing endurance will eventually take Superman down.
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Last edited by horrorwolf on Jun 20th, 2008 at 05:49 AM
It was said that he was faster than the Flash, who at the time could move at super-sonic speeds. Guy Gardner also commented on his speed.
She punched him twice...I don't exactly see that as getting 'thrown around', but to each his own, I guess.
And even she asked how Doomsday could move so fast. Also, Maxima too possesses a degree of super-speed.
Not as many as you would like to believe. Sometimes Superman is surprised at how fast his opponent is, but he doesn't often claim people who aren't fast, are fast
I never argued that the Hulk was considerably weaker than Superman. I even gave the majority to WWH.
You're completely missing the point. People claim that Superman will use his speed against the Hulk, because Superman has used his speed during battle on several occasions. People aren't going to claim Mimic will do the same to the Hulk, unless he too has been shown to use speed during combat.
I understand - that was unrelated to your comment Rorschach. My point to you was just that speed doesn't really come into play often with Superman and powerful opponents - if we go by purely by track records with the enemies I mentioned.
I can post numerous and numerous of scans where mimic used his speed during combat but I can also post scans where he has fought street levelers and failed. With mimic short career, I might can post as many combat speed with him then you could with superman post crisis era. Even though mimic blitzed hyperion his other showings have him trading blows with captain america. Even though mimic blitzed some robots, his other showings have him going h2h with namor. Thats why I think things should go by average showings. Even though mimic is very fast, his average showings have him fighting like a brick. Even though superman possess is very fast, his average showings have him fighting like a brick. Even though quick silver is fast he is shown fighting like a speedster on average. Even though flash is fast he is also shown fighting like a speedster on average.
I think crossovers are crap, but in the Superman/Savage Hulk fight, Superman claimed that, not only did he consider Hulk Fast, but far Stronger than anyone he has ever fought at that point.
(He came to this conclusion after one of Hulk punches knocked him into orbit.)
Because he wasn't using his speed in those battles?
Well, all this time you've been claiming that you could count with your fingers how many times Superman has used his speed during combat, so I'm not expecting to see more than ten instances.
So he used his speed against Hyperion, and some robots but not against Captain America, and Namor.
No, you're simply trying to ignore the full capacity rule.
No need. I was just referring to when you said you could post Mimic using his speed as many times that I could post Superman using his speed during combat, which isn't going to happen.
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Last edited by Rorschach on Jun 20th, 2008 at 07:09 AM
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