I'll look over the evidence presented in the thread and give an official ruling, but as a precursor so that you can get a feel for my reasoning for allowing Cogliostro, it was due to id explaining to me that Cogliosto no longer posessed his hellspawn powers, and that the Crown of Hell, and the Throne of Hell, are independent power sources that Cogliostro simply has access to, not his own personal power, so it would fall under the precedent of the Brainiac/Miracle Machine ruling I made in an earlier match (using a powerful artifact available in a prep site to upgrade members of one's team), rather than the Lex/Armor ruling, as the Crown and Throne, per id, are not actually being brought to the battlefield.
At this point I haven't seen any evidence that Cogliostro has the hellspawn powers himself, but that he has utilized these artifacts in Hell to generate effect (akin to Thanos with the Infinity Gauntlet or Heart of the Infinite). The issue then becomes whether these items should be considered standard equipment for Cogliostro which would put him at 30 points or likely over the cap, but given that Cogliostro doesn't really have many showings with these powers (that I've been made aware of), or shown, to my knowledge, using these items outside of Hell, or at all, I couldn't make an informed ruling on that, and would need more evidence.
Gender: Male Location: Planning to take over the WORLD!
and you may not GET anymore evidence as conveniently he's not had any other appearances. inferential evidence should be more than enough in this case, and likewise he can't prove the crown IS an independent source of power. again, i'd ask for proof that the previous kings of hell NEEDED the power of the crown to keep their power.
wait, so you could draft a butt nekid Tony Stark for 5 points and then have your prep base take place at Tony's armory...whereby he gets access to all his armors? since Tony isn't bringing his armor but rather accessing them from a prep site its ok?
sorry if there is a distinction that I'm missing here
From what I was told, the Crown/Throne aren't being brought to the battlefield, they are magical artifacts which reside in Hell that are being used in prep to upgrade Spawn and his teammates (using a power source/implement located at the prep site to enhance the team, and then leaving the source of the amp at the prep site), which is parallel to the Brainiac/Miracle Machine ruling.
Drafting Tony for 5 points is fine, and yes, you'd have access to his armory, but putting on his armor and bringing it to the battlefield would be illegal as you drafted an unequipped character, so you couldn't bring the weapon/armor itself to the battlefield.
From my understanding, neither the Crown nor the Throne themselves are being brought onto the battlefield, their powers are being used during prep to amp/alter id's team, and then the artifacts are being left at the prep site.
However, if they are bringing the actual Crown or Throne to the battlefield it would be illegal.
No, you couldn't bring any armors. You could only use the equipment at Tony's armory to enhance your team. You couldn't put one of the armors on and bring it to the battlefield.
Gender: Male Location: Planning to take over the WORLD!
wait, wait--the issue is whether he brings the actual crown in?? this gets more . . . all the time.
in his prep he somehow . . . "internalized the power" of the crown THEN came to the battlefield. he may not have brought the ACTUAL crown into battle, but he certainly brought it. be like if he swallowed it--he still has it, just in a different form.
and again, how on earth does a crown not count as standard equipment for a king? and how on earth does a completely powerless king command the armies of hell?
I don't really read Spawn, so I'm not sure how the story develops, but from what has been said and what I've read so far, it appears, at least to my understanding, that Cog's possession of this Crown is fairly new and just part of the current arc, like Thanos with the IG, and it's not his "standard equipment" per se.
Either way though, I did miss the part about the Crown being internalized. That would denote the Crown itself being brought to combat and would in fact be illegal. I was under the impression that id used the Crown to upgrade Spawn during prep, not that he brought it with him (within him) to the battlefield.
Its not a new novelty that Cog came into possession with the Crown. That took place in issue 120. We are affirmed of the possession of it, in issue 142ish. To this date (current issue 186), this has not be refuted, or changed in the comic.
KMC Community Forums
Nov 22nd, 2008 02:55 PM
all the time.
