the evidence says otherwise you delusional person.
your projecting
these paragraphs are filled with only claims and no reasoning or evidence. furthermore,these claims have been refuted with evidence. i rest my case
grammer nazis are pathetic.
i have, and now your admitting it, and also admitting that you personally make bizare distinctions in your desperate bid to sound like you have an argument. thats a good boy
older, maybe, experienced, doesnt seem like it. and yes you are, because people older, wiser, smarter and more experienced than you have made better arguments than you to the contrary.
I'm well aware of predisposed genetic consequences as a result of our birth, and what that means. Thing is it has nothing to do with this at all. You are just trying to sound smart.
The two smokers in your scenario both knew the risks and dangers of smoking and they both went ahead with it anyways. They tried that first smoke on their own, no one forced their hand. They could have said no. So yes they are each responsible for their own outcome. If one gets cancer and the other doesn't then that sucks but that's how it works. They don't know before hand that they will or will not be the one who lucks out and lives a full life, they make the decision knowing what could happen and they are responsible for that decision.
Frankly you just strike me as an incredibly weak willed person who is trying to dance with pretentious philosophical terms and ideas to take the blame off of yourself when you do something stupid or harmful. You don't want to sit there and say "I did this, it was stupid. It's my fault" you are trying to pass it off as something you weren't in control of because you are a coward. I don't think your argument goes much deeper than that, you just want to make yourself feel better and excuse your weakness with something irrelevant.
but it has EVERYTHING to do with it since you never had the ability to decide the things you were inherently born with.
but you didnt answer my question, if both are 100% responsible for the affects then it only goes to reason that the one who got cancer did sumthing far WORSE than the one who DIDNT. thats how responsibility WORKS!!!
dude, ur usually cool, but are you friggin BLIND?!?!?!?! i was NEVER denying my rolse in my taking up smoking, form the very beginning, until two very flambuyoant young gentlemen cam into this thread with a bone to pick with me, referencing{without provocation} our previous exchanges on choice and free will and namecalling{again without my provocation as it started} and degenrating the discussion into a debate about cigerrete smoking and free will. i created this thread for people to tell their anecdotes and their struggle through it, it wasnt MY idea to hijack it for personal vendetta and off topic debates. i just wasnt in the mood to back down today, against my better judgement, but it seems clear which side you support today, so watever.
No one is inherently born with a gene that doesn't allow them to say 'no' when offered a smoke. Other than maybe stupidity. Some people are born with addictive personalities though, so it's their responsibility to recognize that and avoid even trying things that could become harmfully addicting, like smoking.
No, the one who didn't get cancer simply got lucky, and the one who got cancer got unlucky. They both could have gotten cancer and they knew this when they first started smoking. They are both equally responsible for themselves.
You never denied you are responsible for taking up smoking until someone said something you didn't like, and then you did decide to deny that responsibility? Makes no sense.
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Last edited by BackFire on Apr 7th, 2009 at 03:00 AM
WTF, I go to the gym for a few hours and you still can't answer a simple question? Not sure how you want ME to YOU a sample answer for YOUR own opinion.
I asked repeatedly, 'tell me in your own words how smoking is not a choice', either simply state your reasoning as to why it isn't or just say you can't answer, this dancing is akin to trolling
It started when I told Leonheartmm that I agree that smoking was an addiction but then asked him how it wasn't a choice(I believe it is a choice). He then proceeded to argument ad clownium.
Dunno where you live, but I had no say in smoking. I was threatened by terrorists and had no choice. Now I don't know if they're looking or not, so I continue smoking.
Could you BE anymore wrong and insensitive. God.
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في هذا العالم ثلاثة أشخاص أفسدوا البشرية : راعي غنم , طبيب و راكب الجمال , و راكب الجمال هو أسوأ نشال و أسوأ مشعوذ بين الثلاثة
While I did leave the clause of "unless you were literally forced to", that would still be a choice in your case, as you could not smoke and take the repercussions instead, though the smarter choice would be to smoke.
Yeah, you say that about me, cos you never met my mother. She's like the fountain of guilt, money management and the likes...
....
I find it strange that anyone would say smoking isn't a choice. I remember choosing to buy packet of cigarettes. And lighting a smoke. I just don't get why that was a 10 page conversation.
I am sure any smoker will tell you that it is a choice. I find it somewhat offensive and patronising if someone would tell me I had no choice in smoking.
It's like with the obesity - ooo they have no choice. Of course they do - eating a celery.
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في هذا العالم ثلاثة أشخاص أفسدوا البشرية : راعي غنم , طبيب و راكب الجمال , و راكب الجمال هو أسوأ نشال و أسوأ مشعوذ بين الثلاثة
True, as addicts can make the choice to resist the addicting urges.
Don't worry, only one person in here can't realize that their smoking habit was a choice they made and perpetuated. I believe this person who is now an ex-smoker wants to believe that they were forced to do something not healthy, but then had the willpower to stop and now want admiration for doing something probably millions have done before him.
there is nothing wrong with empowerment and seeing one's shortcomings, however, that isnt the same as having to take full responsibility for all the outcomes of your chosen path.
but you are waving away a very serious contradiction based on LUCK. if it was LUCK then it wasnt due to the CHOICE the person made dont you see???? you can only blame as much on a person as their CHOICE is directly responsible for {in this case, you cud say, it was a reckless thing to do because there was a CHANCE that cancer cud follow}, you CANT however, say that the cancer was the direct responsibility of the person who got it, simply because it was his MISFORTUNE more than his knowing/intended CHOICE that was responsible for the cancer in this case.
yes i didnt. because i dont think thats a helpful way of going about living your life in any case. but the people with their agenda in question, forced a fusing of the ULTIMATE questions of free will with the question of smoking and i wasnt going to let them force me into saying that i beleive, at its core, that complete unconditional free will exists. now, obviously, your fond of rob and AC, but your inability to see faults in their way of debating and their plain rudeness is well..... your fault.
but i think your simply hiding behind that pretence like jia and some of the other posters. i think the reason you cant give me a sample answer is because it was never your intention to accept any answer i gave you, irrespective of how valid its reasoning was.
the trolling and self righteousness of two members with an older vendetta in my thread who continue to mix philosophic free will with practical choices and smoking and me being unable to back down from replying to their non arguments in spite of my better judgement.
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Apr 7th, 2009 02:31 AM
