First, Ragnos (possessing the body of Tavion) did get his ass kicked by "a neophyte Jedi." He was in full command of Tavion's abilities, armed with a powerful Sith weapon, and present on a world imbued with Sith power. The aforementioned neophyte had already hacked his way through a small army of dark side adepts and had already battled Tavion herself, so he -- unlike Ragnos, who was in hibernation for millennia -- was quite possibly not at full strength.
Second, even if it were a slanted statement, it (in no way) mitigates the fact that yours was a slant of exponentially greater proportions. They did not fear Ragnos and you know better.
He obliterated an AT-AT and imploded a rancor's head with it. It is special.
Simple explanation. He was a spirit and even as a spirit, he entered the body of a relatively average or weak dark jedi, further diminishing his abilities.
Off the top of my head, when Exar Kun merged with Kyp Durron, he enhanced Durron's latent abilities and allowed him to overcome Skywalker. And when Obi-Wan's spirit possessed Luke during the events of Splinter of the Mind's Eye, he enabled the neophyte to best Vader in single combat.
Ragnos's spirit isn't special and Tavion was certainly far more skilled, if not necessarily more powerful, than either a neophyte Luke Skywalker or a neophyte Kyp Durron.
He (again) was armed with a powerful Sith weapon, possessed the body of a skilled dark Jedi, was the beneficiary of millennia of rest, and fought on a dark side imbued planet.
See, I see it differently. Tavion had to use his scepter to resurrect Ragnos. Kun shed his body using a sith ritual. I don't think the properties are the same.
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Some where along the bounty hunter wars, acstyles has the exact source but he doesn't post here anymore.
Your used to ramble how ub3r nadd is solely on the fact that he pushed vodo from lightyears away, i'm simply stating vader did the same.
Watch the scripted gameplay carefully, vader deflects a massive pillar and the second he does it, he gets knocked down and then the ownage begins.
And how many people do you think would survive such a brutal beating like that without the aid of the force? Put traya in that position and she wouldn't even survive the intial impact of the 3 pillars collapsing on her let alone survive the entire ordeal.
Hell put dooku, exar or almost anybody else in that exact situation and they would have ended up dead, vader still survived and had enough strength to get back on his feet mere minutes after getting his ass handed to him(and even give starkiller another long duel in the DS ending).
So more knowledge = more power?Galen isn't a force scholar and look at his command of the force.
Last i recall vader has demonstrated superior command of the force while andeddu did nothing but get his ass wiped for him.
Luke feared him simply because they had no idea what he was capable off, not because he was an ub3r god going to pawn luke.
Yeah, 3 people that vader would have easily crushed with the force(crushing massive structures!) and she killed a dozen sith marauders while being empowered heavily by malachors dark side energy.
Good try.
Bringing down an ATAT and shocking the shit out of a giant sarlacc and being a force titan that put vader on his ass and went toe to toe with sidious.
Tavion was storing Force energy within the scepter to resurrect Ragnos; to give him a new corporeal body and the works. As we've seen from whatever-the-hell comic it is that he interrupts the duel between Qel Droma and Kun, Ragnos is able to project his spirit for limited amounts of time to other places. But his spirit is anchored to his tomb in Korriban, which is why he either needed to be resurrected or possess the body of another.
Both are spirits; the Essential Guide to the Force makes it very clear that Kun, Ragnos, and Palpatine are all Sith spirits and possess the same properties. The only fundamental difference is that Palpatine's was not bound to a specific area.
Yes, it was one of the things that made him leet, because he was doing it AS A SPIRIT.
Vader put up a good fight against Marek but he really didn't have much of a chance.
I think Traya would long destroy Vader with her drain.
highly debatable.
Yes.. More knowledge=more power. Marek had a ridiculous raw command of the force. Had he learned from sith holocrons, his command would have even been greater.
What superior command of the force? Andeddu returned from being a spirit for thousands of years and managed to put the most powerful sith in the One Sith on his ass.
Prove Vader would have killed them. Not to mention, the sith marauders were just as empowered by malachor's dark energy. This is a retarded attempt at trying to prove your point.
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And the interesting thing is that a spirit isn't bound to any one place, we have seen nadd pop his spirit on several different locations and the same can be said for ragnos, his actual spirit lies in his tomb yet he projected himself on cinnagar.
So maybe nadd didn't attack vodo lightyears away after all....
But surviving an ordeal like that is a further testament to vaders beastly command of the force.
Substantiate. Because it worked on 3 nobodies it it would work on vader.
And its hilarious how your claiming she is going to wtf pwn vader(i'm assuming she is going to do the same to yoda, mace windu, revan and pretty much every one else) without even formulating any logical argument and backing your ridiculous claims.
Really? If her drain was so hideously powerful i still question myself why she couldn't have saved her own ass when sion and nihilus turned on her.
Its extremely funny despite her phenominal cosmic force powers that a simple force push by darth nihilus knocked her out. You can argue that he some how "drained" her force power(and his technique doesn't even do that) but you have nothing to substantiate your claims.
No it isn't. Put an old woman(traya) in vaders position(he was completely defence less) and her frail old body would have been crushed the moment galen toppled 3 pillars on her.
Vader had absolutely no defence when the ownage begun, no physical or force defence at all and he took a shit hell of a beating and even got back on his foot and was unharmed by galens most powerful attack(teh ub3r suicide bomb).
Prove it. Luke's knowledge of the force is far inferior to lord sidious yet his command of the force surpasses. Your wrong.
And this means what? That his ridiculous power was based on the fact that he had broad knowledge of the dark side of the force?
You contradict yourself unknowingly.
He simply would have a wider range of powers, he would have become more powerful due to the fact that as of TFU, he is NOT at his full potential, NOT because he would have studied more holocrons.
Yeah and the most powerful sith in the one sith got back up and put him on his ass and permanently sent him into oblivion.
Really, andeddu has done almost nothing with the force and your putting him above vader, hell this is coming from an admitted ancient sith fanboy so thats VERY understandable.
Oh please he destroyed a massive barrier on the wookie homeworld with one force wave(the same wave performed by bane that would have turned an organic being into a pulp), he pwned a jedi that tore a space station apart(and this jedi has done far more than those 3 nobodies ever did in he force), he choked xizor over a damn hologram(light years
!) , he destroyed a massive hut that was stated to be as durable as steel and he ragdolled and brutally raped galen mareks father.
I see vader shitting on those 3 guys in a force fight.
This is also the same vader that was stated to have been able to "defeat kar vastor" easier than mace windu did(don't take my word for it, ill check this with gideon as he brought it up, i just damn hope he replies when i PM him).
Yeah anything to prove that? I didn't see ventress getting empowered on vjun when ironically dooku did and proceeded to pwn her by lifting a finger.
He projected himself because his spirit was bound to the amulets. Nadd was free to roam the galaxy. Not that any of this matters.
Now you're arguing against the comics. Hilarious.
HOW
Prove they're nobodies. And then prove Vader has ANY defense for it. I'll accept your concession on this point because you're just sounding ridiculous.
No, I just said that if her and Vader were to face off, Vader doesn't have a technique to stop the force drain. You went off on a tangent as usual.
This is your question? Looks like you're about 5 years behind this star wars forum. Nihilus' power was greater than Traya's.
ROFL. The desperate "simple force push" theory has been debunked time and time again. She was drained of the force as she ADMITTED it, and was exiled. You wouldn't sound so ridiculous if you didn't argue against known facts.
You have no idea of Traya's power or command of the force, so speculation is irrelevant.
.....
His force knowledge, not his command.. Once again, irrelevant and wrong.
Nope, that he had raw power.
I haven't contradicted myself once. And this line of thought is hilarious. How do you gain power and reach your potential? Come on, even a 3rd grader knows this. Yes that's right, knowledge. From Holocrons, from his master, etc.
Right. Which means Andeddu's powers had atrophied since the last time he used them.
Really, andeddu has done almost nothing with the force and your putting him above vader, hell this is coming from an admitted ancient sith fanboy so thats VERY understandable.
You've yet to prove any of this and the only facts here don't put Vader in the top tier categories.
Good for you.
uh, no?
I don't have to prove it. In fact YOU have to prove that Traya was empowered by Malachor V. Traya herself stated that these sith marauders gain power when they near a force sensitive. You lose.
Oh I strongly dislike this. It's like religious people telling me to prove that God doesn't exist. How can you prove that something doesn't exist?
Like here, how can you prove that they are nobodies except for saying that they have nothing to support their strength. I can't ask you to prove that Darth Plagious his lightsaber abilities are unknown, you should prove that he has them, just like you have to prove that these 3 Jedi are somebodies.
__________________ Imagination is more important than knowledge.
Um what? I don't think you understand. He called them nobodies so he must prove it, especially since they were all on the jedi council and by definition, can't be nobodies. This is NOT equivalent to the religion debate.
Then you shouldn't make the statement that they're nobodies. It's a poor attempt to diminish characters to prove your argument.
Beg your pardon, but there's nothing to suggest this.
Ask yourself, why would Andeddu start a fight if he wasn't in tip-top condition? That would be completely out of character for him, seeing as he's a big chicken.
The only way he'd ever fight is if he's at full strength.
Last edited by chilled monkey on Aug 17th, 2009 at 10:04 PM
Do you have anything to corroborate that theory? Anything at all to suggest that this is the case? That Andeddu was not in fine form during his battle with Krayt's flunkie?
Let's make something abundantly clear, because my patience for the "lawl older sith r teh better sith" is pretty much nonexistent. It's an outdated, obsolete, disproven, and entirely worthless notion. Older does not equal better, and it doesn't mean that Andeddu was on the verge of death simply because he got his ass kicked by a newer Sith. It means that:
[SPOILER - highlight to read]: There are "new" Sith that are more than capable of handing "old" Sith their asses.
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Turgon aran Gondolin tortha gar a matha, i vegil Glamdring gud dae lo, dam an Glamhoth.
Aug 17th, 2009 03:27 AM
