So you admit that it's a good thing if they are not a city buster? I see.... so then it must be a bad thing if they are right?
Yknow.... Roshi vaped a moon... at a power level that was dwarfed by Goku's the 2nd or 3rd time he entered the Worlds MA tournement?
The only reason Goku wouldn't be a "city buster" is because he actually cares about bystanders... that by no means indicates he can't do it... Especially when a teenage goku made a blast so big it dwarfed the city of the island he was on, and then the island, and then caused catostrophic tsunami's as a result....
You're being ludicrous, as stated before.
No it's not the same, it's much more impressive actually.
They had a massive exchange of blows between themselves involving acrobatics, flips and leaps across the stage, spitting at one another AND still had time to play a childrens game (of what was it? Rocks papers scissors I think) all before landing the final exchange.... and all this... in an instant.... In a flash that no one could follow. That's not even a 1 second feat.. it's a nano or micro second feat... and this is from the characters at some of their weakest stages in the Manga.
This isn't a case of just sheer hand speed at work, it's a feat of complete maneuvarability. You need to understand the difference; They can think, comprehend, communicate and fight at such a speed, and they are literally NO CONTEST weaklings compared to the Goku who fought King Piccolo.
Again, no it's not.
It's one thing to be unable to be tracked by human beings or canon fodder... but when it comes to other superhumans on a Dragonball level? It's another story.
Power scaling... you need to apply it to anime characters and DBZ is no different.
We have the Roshi/Krillin feat, which is one thing, but in Draganball alone there are at the LEAST 4 times where characters faster than Roshi as described earlier, too fast for HIM with HIS SPEED to register are further outstripped by Goku to the same Degree...
What's more impressive being too fast for a regular human to see?
Or being faster than Ultimate Quicksilver could comprehend?
Uh yeah, he does we just went over some of them, so basically this is a nu-uh argument from you and I'll be apt to ignore it.
It doesn't matter if you think Goku's faster or not (well he IS faster but I'm begining to grasp just how thick you can be) because Ken being within Goku's personal bubble is going to go quite badly for him. Ken can send waterfalls upwards with his aura? That's nice.... Goku can shake planets with his...
Again... hand wave> City.... How do you imagine Ken will close any gap on this type of power?
Also....
What exactly do you think this attack is going to do?
Show me. Please.
I know what pressure points are... Yes... actually I'm intimately familiar with them, 20 some odd years of MA experience will do that.... And the only way pressure points work is if they manage to land on a vulnerable area, too bad Goku doesn't have any. As stated earlier you won't be able to pressure point someone under plate armor and that's basically what you're suggesting here.
And yes his insides are just as strong as he his, this is proved when he transferred to 10x Earth's gravity and his body could still function without issue.
You're arguments are getting weaker and weaker....
Bottem line?
Goku's too damned durable for pressure points to work in the first place.
He's too damned fast for Ken to T off on him in the second.
And, he's too damned (speaking collaterally) powerful for Ken to close in on in the third...
Pressure points.................... Possibly the lamest anti-Goku argument I've seen yet.
What I'm reffering to isn't a "technique" though which is the difference. It's just sheer strength.... Not even powered up at that...
And if you think all Goku can do is knock people away you're only showing off your ignorance yet again... The person he tossed was Chichi as if he'd try to hurt her.
Again King Piccolo... Seismic winds.
That you're ludicrous beyond reason perhaps...
Ken being > Nappa? No..... that's just fail.
Actually Goku did... so that's that... and yeah intangible... show me...
Show me that being an effective offensive...
again... running away is not a win here.
__________________ "damn jinzin, you're a real trooper, you provde fact after fact and pages and pages of proof and these wanton miscreants just keep at it"~MERC
Kid Goku's speed and durability aren't any better than Ken's and I'm talking about FOTNS Ken.
During Ken's first fight with Raoh, they both jumped real high in the air, exchanging blows before hitting the ground. Also, I didn't say Kenshiro could win against SSJ1 Goku. I said he could be more of a challenge, as I don't think base form Goku stands a chance against Ken.
As for Freiza, that really depends on the situation. If Freiza decides to get serious, Ken would lose obviously but if Freiza toys around too much, it may not ever get to that point.
Yes they are in multitudes and Ken being "anime fast" doesn't change that one bit...
You think he could take..... Frieza......
Casual planet busting, stronger faster more durable than the Ginyu team combined Frieza?
less than 1% power = over a million Frieza?
You are completely and utterly delusional.... that's all there is to it, you are stone cold ****ing NUTZ. This isn't even amusing anymore.
__________________ "damn jinzin, you're a real trooper, you provde fact after fact and pages and pages of proof and these wanton miscreants just keep at it"~MERC
So show me where Goku can throw just as many punches as Kenshiro.
Goku may have been stronger than Roshi by the second tournament but I wouldn't say his power "dwarfed" Roshi's. And if you think that means something, think again because there are many ways to be stronger than somebody.
As you stated already, that was teen Goku and he did with a Kamehameha.
Okay, first think about this again. Throwing a hundred punches in just a few seconds is more impressive than you think and that's with constant movement too. Even though what Krillin and Roshi did was fast, they really didn't do much compared to Kenshiro.
Also, this may be just me but I don't even take the Krillin and Roshi part seriously, as it seemed like a joke/parody moment.
Superhumans have been unable to track Kenshiro too, not just common thugs. Shin, Ambia, Ughur, Sachi, heck even Raoh can't see him at times.
Those feats were nothing, dude.
Didn't Goku shake the planet when he went SSJ3, something we're not discussing? And again, Musou Tensei allows him to go intangible.
You would have a point here if Kenshiro was just a normal human, in which he's clearly not. As you should know already, it doesn't take much force to hit pressure points and Ken did this to many people on superhuman levels. As for the gravity, what does that got to do with someone's insides? It may work for their physical appearance but his insides are still vulnerable.
I really don't see what you're trying to say here, as it really didn't mean that Goku doesn't knock people away.
Oh let me guess, he can destroy a city. That's gonna help against a guy that can go intangible. Cut the crap!
Actually, Goku didn't. Both when he fought King Piccolo and Nappa, he escaped (the former was when he needed help).
Kenshiro simply can't be hit when he's intangible. Why should I go into detail about that?
I would say there's more than a "possibility" of it. Maybe the Saiyans could be debatable (they can crossbread with humans after all), but Freeza is radically different and I would be very surprised if his physiology was even close to a human's.
Seriously, the dude's a friggin changeling as it is.
I don't think I need to give a counter argument at this point...
Your entire debate revolves around putting Ken on the same level of power, durability, speed and strength as Goku up to a god damned super saiyan... if that isn't delusional I don't know what is.
Bottem line:
You lost whatever credability you could have possibly had in this thread the moment you said Ken could beat Freiza... that's as stated before... Bat shit INSANE... and if you honestly believe he stands a chance in hell of beating Frieza no amount of PROOF (yknow the stuff myself and carver are ACTUALLY USING) I bring to the table is going to convince you that he can't beat DB goku...
Not to mention: it doesn't help that you think Ken's going to be intangible the entire fight, OR that you understand the difference between a second and a split/nano/micro second. But whatever... you're crazy and that's that.
__________________ "damn jinzin, you're a real trooper, you provde fact after fact and pages and pages of proof and these wanton miscreants just keep at it"~MERC
Last edited by jinzin on Sep 27th, 2010 at 04:30 AM
Start the film at 1 min and 51 seconds... durability feat.
Go to 6 minutes and 30 seconds... Ken have no way of countering this if Goku speed off this fast.
6 minutes and 53 seconds Goku is punched through a brick wall and bounce up immediately without anyone noticing it.
Goku is>junior and look at the blasting power junior created... 9 minutes and 15 seconds.
Remember, Goku and Picollo are pretty much equals in all sense during this fight... fast forward this to 5 minutes and first look at the pure power of Goku's blast and Picollo TANKED it.
Fast forward it to 2 minutes and 19 seconds, picks up picollo and slams him...
Now this is the impressive part... fast forward that same film to 4 minutes... not only is picollo huge as hell but he literally steps on Goku and use his leg strength to try to crush Goku... not only does Goku push against this with his own strength vs Picollo strength, he lifts him up off the ground and toss him while again, Picollo was trying to crush him.
Fast forward this to one minute and 53 seconds. Goku basically survives a nuke without a scratch on him.
Punching 100 times in a couple of seconds, that aint nothing... look at tiens hand during this scene and he is much weaker than the Goku that I posted above. Fast forward this to 2 minutes and 20 seconds.
You and Carver aren't using any proof. All you mostly do is use the typical A>B>C logic that most DBZ supporters do.
Also, where did I put Kenshiro as the same level of durability, strength, speed, or power as SSJ1 Goku? Or is reading posts before you respond is too much for you?
As for the the Freiza part, yeah, I don't know why I asked you that last question because all you're crying about is "OOH YOU SAID KEN CAN BEAT FREIZA" without actually reading what I said.
Just look at Kenshiro's fight with Ambia. He too moved so fast he couldn't be tracked. Plus he was right infront of Ambia. He would definitely track Goku if he was moving that fast.
Also, I already admitted Kenshiro's blasting power isn't on par with Goku's.
Should I remind you that Kenshiro also fought and killed a giant "demon"? And early in the series at that?
I'll be honest, that was impressive but I wouldn't call that a nuke.
As for the tornado part, you know darn well he wasn't fighting and that would be a bad thing to do in a real fight anyway.
Except, how do you know that was a hundred hits? That was never stated or hinted. Also, I guess I should remind you that before Kenshiro became the successor, he punched 17 times in less than a second and during his fight with Han, he was punching so fast his hits weren't even seen.
So how much did Piccolo weigh?
All because he runs around doing his afterimage technique? Sorry, it's gonna take more than that to beat Ken.
No... he didn't just get hit by one blast... he got hit by numerous of blast while hitting concrete head first from cloud height and he tanked all of it.
How would he track goku moving that fast? Show me ken tracking someone moving at invisible speeds like that.
I know kenshiro power blast isn't on par with goku and there is nothing to suggest that he could tank a blast from goku. This is the same guy that has been hit across the face with a boulder and left scars on him. This version of goku could literally punch a hole in him.
Ken might have fought a giant but I know he didn't outmatch him strength wise and I also know that ken wasn't tossing this giant around like goku did.
Why wasn't it a nuke... it leveled the entire island and again this feat put goku durability as a teen over kens.
All of your speed feats still fail and isn't close to even master roshi and krillin showing. Punching 17 times in one sec isn't sh**.
It doesn't matter how much picollo weighed... look at the damage he caused just by throwing him.
You could be right about the last vid I showed but the only thing that you have showed is that ken can move his arms and legs fast... that's not that impressive either. Do you have one showing of a maneaver combat feat instead of him standing in one spot kicking and punching?
Don't bother Carver, this ignoramous thinks Kenshiro can beat Frieza... that the possibility even exists.... There's no need to argue with that kinda thickness.
__________________ "damn jinzin, you're a real trooper, you provde fact after fact and pages and pages of proof and these wanton miscreants just keep at it"~MERC
No he wouldn't. Also, like I said before, Kenshiro was able to fight with Han whose punches are literally like the wind. And there were at times Han couldn't see Ken's fist.
But that means nothing unless you can tell me how much he weighs because as we found out later, Goku couldn't lift 40 tons. Also, the giant was probably more durable than Ken too but that doesn't change the fact that Ken was able to hit his pressure points. That just shows you that your insides aren't as durable as your skin.
Did it look like that in the manga?
Explain why?
It kind of does. We already know he doesn't weigh 40 tons so how much did he weigh?
I could show you him keeping up with a teleporter but that only occured in the anime (unless we're using non-canon sources). I'll once again refer you to his fight with Ambia where there was hardly any trace his movement. Though I don't see why all of that is necessary, since Goku would get in close to hit Ken, in which point, Ken would hit his pressure points.
KMC Community Forums
Sep 26th, 2010 07:56 PM
"damn jinzin, you're a real trooper, you provde fact after fact and pages and pages of proof and these wanton miscreants just keep at it"~MERC
Cut the crap!
