Well, if he was, why bother with all this stuff. If he knows everything and how everyone is going to react to everything he sends out into the universe, then he is basically God. Why does he need Anakin?
And from a story point of view: why are we left out from the identity of this guy? Why isn't it made more clear that it's Palpy who pulling the strings? And HOW he is doing that.
Palpy/Sidious is the only ACTIVE character in TPM. The rest only RESPONDS to what he does. But the movie doesn't tell us WHAT he's doing and WHAT he's trying to achieve. Yes, in ROTS in his rubber monster face he says the Sith will once again rule the universe. (I didn't know they once did... ). But it's also the steps we need to get involved in... Just like we see Frank Underwood work his way to the top, step by step by step.
We don't see Palpy doing that. We only find out what he was planning right before he reaches his goal. Again: bad storytelling.
Oh no... I don't. I love All the President's Men, JFK, House of Cards, West Wing... but the SW PT is very far removed from that level when it comes to political drama.
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Last edited by queeq on Jan 18th, 2016 at 06:42 PM
That's because it wasn't trying to be a political drama. But it was showing how politics played an important part in the rise of the Sith. But Ultimately it was about the rise of the Sith.
No, it was about Jar Jar Binks, young Annie and midichlorians.
__________________ "Your mother was a venereal disease-ridden prostitute who was raped by the father you never knew and killed herself when she saw what an autistic phaggot you are.
So what about my comments made your ass so sore? Was it me calling you a phaggot? I think not." - Nemebro
It tried to be a lot of things, INCLUDING a political drama.
- It starts with a dispute about taxation of trade routes.
- The bad guy uses political manipulation to reach his goals
- The Senate and them being bogged down ind beats is a crucial element
- There are committees appointed to find out is there's an invasion
- There a motions of no confidence to battle it out in the Senate
- Senators are manipulated
- Vote for military activity is called and voted upon
- There are bureaucrats actively involved in the workings of the Chancellor
- There's lobbying going, advisory meetings with wise advisors
etc. etc... I mean, I see all that in House of Cards too. Except... there it a) makes sense and b) I get what Underwood is doing and how he's moving step by step to his goals.
So yes, the PT tries very hard to be a political drama (as well) and fails miserably.
kinda make me think the PT might have been better if sidious was unhooded to the audience from the start. might have made for a far more interesting character in all 3 films, instead of half of one. and justify more screen time for the baddies, which was also completely deficient. the whole mystery sith lord angle was weak as hell.
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Your Lord knows very well what is in your heart. Your soul suffices this day as a reckoner against you. I need no witnesses. You do not listen to your soul, but listen instead to your anger and your rage.
I presented both scenarios you talked about (that you said were contradictions). I showed you where they definitely were not contradictions and had the same exact outcome for Palps.
And why does he need Anakin? The Son of the Force?
Are you really asking why would an evil, power-hungry, very magically powerful, megalomaniac, desired the potentially strongest person in the Force to be his servant?
Your problem with that desire is nonsensical. If it is a problem you have with the Emperor, then you have to also have the same problem with the Original Trilogy because he tried to get Luke to be his servant, as well.
Whenever we argue about how poor you think the PT is, we almost invariably end up where I'm telling you your criticisms equally apply to the OT, which you hold in a much higher regard than the PT. The only thing I desire from these conversations is for you to acknowledge that most of your complaints are not legit and you're holding an unequal standard for the PT that you don't hold for the OT.
So you have a problem with the author keeping a "big reveal" from the audience until the Revenge of the Sith? Why...what? Why is that even remotely close to an issue? Now you have problems with telling stories with lots of foreshadowing, character development, and big reveals?
Do you even buy the arguments you make? I don't believe you actually buy into that argument.
So you hated the big reveal of Vader being Luke's father? Did you hate Leia being Luke's sister? If you hate big reveals, that's fine. I have no right to tell you how you should feel about the stories.
But any fan of Star Wars...ANY fan...knew that Palps was the emperor. It was only a very casual viewer that would be surprised with the "big" reveal.
And how he is pulling the strings? What do you exactly mean? Are you wondering how he has power over people like Nute Gunray? Because, in that case, why does he have power over people like Darth Vader? From whence commeth is power to be over people? Your complaint equally applies to the OT as it does to the PT. Where does any evil dictator get their power over other people? You criticize the story for a very common human theme where dictators rise to power over people.
I don't see a single legitimate complaint, from a logical perspective. You just don't want the story to work. Everything you complain about, here, is either malformed or requires a huge amount of the movie to be ignored. You have a problem with an evil, manipulative, and magically powerful dictator...manipulating people to rise to power. And state, "the movie doesn't tell us what he's doing and what he's trying to achieve." I mean, damn...it literally shows us exactly those two things. He's manipulating the trade federation, the senate, the Jedi, and the Naboo people from the background so he can rise to power. I mean, what else do you want? The movie gives you exactly what you say it doesn't.
"Right before" huh? Yeah, the span of about 1 hour happens in TPM before we get a hint that he's gunning for the Supreme Chancellor's position and when he actually becomes the Supreme Chancellor. The movie is over 2 hours, of course, but it is not "right before" like you suggest.
And you think no shitting out the entirety of a plot, right at the beginning of a film, is bad story telling? Cool. I can't tell you what you should enjoy. But some people enjoy a slow build. They enjoy a bit of intelligent plot and world building as character motivations are slowly revealed and culminate in a story-telling climax.
Honestly, I enjoyed the crap out of TPM's political elements. It was very fun. Due to the time, George Lucas couldn't really shit out his political messages (or anti-political messages, depending on who you talk to) in the OT. He had less restrictions with the PT so his political ideas and anti-political ideas are a lot more fleshed out. He didn't have to hold back. Maybe that's part of why I like the PT, in general, more than the OT...GL didn't have to hold back as much.
I also agree attacking the same villain of the ot is pretty silly. It's the same guy. He's an evil, manipulative, power hungry guy who did what he needed to in the circumstances he had. It turned out well for him but he wasn't all knowing. Vader kind of proved that point in Rotj.
Your Lord knows very well what is in your heart. Your soul suffices this day as a reckoner against you. I need no witnesses. You do not listen to your soul, but listen instead to your anger and your rage.
Your Lord knows very well what is in your heart. Your soul suffices this day as a reckoner against you. I need no witnesses. You do not listen to your soul, but listen instead to your anger and your rage.
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Jan 18th, 2016 06:22 PM
