Questionable? That is the only "official" powerlevel given to the GT saga and it was from a source that has rights to Dragonball series. But you would take fan made powerlevels over it?
It is an alternate universe. I guess they are just not as powerful in that universe.
You will, of course, provide this "official" source
And it's an AU in the sense that it belongs in Toei's anime continuity while having nothing to do with the manga, which still means GT is absurdly powerful, even if I think it's bland at the best of times
The only GT power levels given where from Bandai. Who have shared rights to the series with Toei and Funimation. So what say say is cannon unless corrected by the Writers or Toriyama. Which will never happen because Toriyama is doing all he can to remove GT.
But in the end that power level has far more credibility than fan made power levels.
There are been no actual power levels given to a series since the freeze saga.
also Toryiama disproves the mulitplier. He says "that Super Saiyan 2 and 3 are nothing more than powered-up variations of Super Saiyan. After the fight with Beerus, Goku realized that mastering his normal state and Super Saiyan would raise his level more and sap less strength, so I think he probably won’t become Super Saiyan 2 or 3 any more."
Shows how power ups are not relative at all.
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Last edited by bbrem123 on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 09:21 PM
What that means is Goku simply found a way to get the multipliers without the higher forms.
Just as GT Goku figured out how to raise his base form a lot in between series.
It doesn't mean multipliers don't exist/don't count, or that SSG and godly ki is not a multiplier itself.
And that is also something specifically only the case at the end of the movie. Since what we're doing is simply judging SSG's strength by comparing it to known multipliers when he *did* use them, the fact that he will stop using them doesn't make them not a good basis of comparison.
SSJ4 is on a different level. Stop saying that as if it's an advantage to SSG.
And power level numbers are not needed, we have the comparisons of how different known individuals fight.
So, you are speculating that SSJ2 Vegeta, shortly after Z, massively improved over how he was in the Buu saga, with no indications of any massive power up being mentioned at any time? That is unsubstantiated speculation.
It is not speculation that GT base Goku is significantly stronger than Perfect Cell, who is equal to SSJ2 Gohan, who is close to SSJ2 Goku/Vegeta in the Buu saga. It is not speculation that SSJ gives a big multiplier over that better-than-Perfect-Cell base form (he's able to fight people stronger than Buu in SSJ1), or SSJ2/3 over that, or that SSJ4 gives one at least 10x above the user's powers. That's all confirmed information.
I do believe you are highly misusing the word speculation.
Sure, which is something that will be the case after BotG. Doesn't change that during the movie itself they used all those forms and they thus illustrate Beerus's, SSG's, and Goku's post-SSG level by way of comparison. Comparison, mind you, specific on-screen comparison. A SSJ2 can, barely, hurt Beerus, who is above SSG Goku who is above SSJ Goku with godly ki.
GT and BotG Goku went different routes. Doesn't change that GT Goku's shown, non-speculative power advantages add up to more than BotG Goku's.
And it definitely doesn't change that SSJ4 Gogeta's blows them out of the water. While one could argue SSG vs SSJ4 a bit, the power of the fusion is so much above even a basic SSJ4 that there's no contest.
We really don't know his strength in relation to Beerus and SSG Goku. Unless he completely blows Beerus out of the water, though, that's still not going to be enough against Gogeta. Not based on what we've seen.
Because GT goes through a lot of powerups.
SSJ2 BotG Vegeta could harm Beerus, if only a little. GT fighters have gone through a lot more significant power ups than SSJ2 BotG Vegeta.
Heck, in the Baby Saga alone, Vegeta- who, like Goku, has shown to have an improved base level in GT (and notably BotG has not shown this)- started out as around an even match for SSJ3 Goku, upgraded two more forms above that (by absorbing the power of first Gohan/Trunks/Goten/Bra, and then the rest of the Earth), and even then after absorbing all that power, SSJ4 kicked his butt... and then when he went Oozaru, multiplying all that massive power by 10x, he still was merely a close fight for SSJ4.
And then Omega Shenron blows away even a SSJ4, and Fusion-Gogeta SSJ4 blows away Omega Shenron....
Still we have a canon source saying Omega Shenrons power level was 1.9 Billion. I wonder why they didn't use the multiplier method to get that number. Maybe because they are only fan made power level. hmmmm
And that the method has been disproved. As shown by vegeta amping beyond gohan and goku.
That right there is the best physical feat ever shown within any Dragonball series. Destroying planets like that from wasabi. North Kai said it right. Beerus can destroy a cluster of galaxies when gets angry. Feats to actually back up his power.
And whis crushed him...
Yet again showing how much more superior Beerus and Whis are.
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Last edited by bbrem123 on Dec 23rd, 2014 at 01:14 PM
Power levels listed in video games are not 'canon' unless they coincide with PLs listed in canon sources. For example, that same game(Scouter Battle Taikan Kamehameha) had the Cell Juniors power levels at ~47m. Given that the Cell Juniors could stomp ASSJs like fodder, they were obviously not several times weaker than Freeza. That same game also has Kid Buu decisively more powerful than Fat Buu(pre-split), which there is no evidence to support. The same game also states that SSJ4 is only 10x> a base SSJ, which is complete BS. Etc., etc., etc...
I can point out a LOT more inconsistencies if need be. The point, however, is that said power levels are absolutely non-canon. You cannot just cherry-pick a single PL because you think it better-suits your argument, without looking at ALL the context surrounding it.
*sighs*
a.) Those planets were tiny--I've pointed this out to others before. Them being referring to as 'planets' doesn't denote large size, btw, as even King Kai's world(which SSJ3 Goku punched a hole through) is classified as a planet as well.
b.) The "clusters of galaxies" statement is an English-dub only line, and as such, is non-canon. The most canon Jap-dub said no such thing.
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The only canon source of power level was stopped at the Frieza Saga. So the games should be taken into account. They are made by the creators of DB series. Powerlevels not making sense with feats is the problem with every power level presented to support GT. I will take the games power level created by the makes of DB series over fan made levels.
This just further proves my point that power level don't multiply the way you think they do. And how irrelevant they are post Frieza Saga.
They don't look that tiny when you see them in the background of a shot while beerus and whis are at the temple. Or when they fly by them on there way to King Kai's planet. You can also tell they are not tiny because you would be able to see objects on them just like you can on King Kai's planet. They clearly look similar to planets in our solar system showing they have atmosphere's and what not. They have all the properties of a larger planet. Unlike King Kai's.
It is quite clear that the 3d effects made every seem close together. Even when they were zooming in and out of the universe itself.
Which is why Whis was so serious on stopping him.
I always find it interesting how differently people(including myself) interpret things like this.
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Last edited by bbrem123 on Dec 23rd, 2014 at 04:45 PM
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