This will probably open up a whole new can 'o' worms, but it's true that Hitler was functioning far more from the antisemitism of Christianity than secularism.
That much is clear, you know, with the whole "we need to eradicate all the Jews" thing...
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Gender: Male Location: The Proud Nation of Kekistan
My religious pursuits have made me a morally better human being, and I could explain that morality without citing the authority of God. And I know plenty of people like that for whom their religion has helped them grow into more kind, loving, and humble human beings with a good sense of right and wrong, which again is something that could be conveyed through a conversation on moral value without debating the existence of God.
It's one thing to admit there's bad things that have come out of religion, it's another thing to say nobody has ever benefited from it and that it's not worthwhile to have deep moral conversations between good atheists and good religious people.
I actually agree, which is why I'm a universalist who believes everyone gets redeemed and gets into Heaven.
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Shadilay my brothers and sisters. With any luck we will throw off the shackles of normie oppression. We have nothing to lose but our chains! Praise Kek!
THE MOTTO IS "IN KEK WE TRUST"
Again, holy books like the Bible and Koran are filled with some very conflicting moral imperatives and guidelines it is ridiculous to say that good morals come from religion. So people becoming more loving and kind human beings is a result of their own pursuits and concerns and an improving human community that has more immediate concerns than what happens in the afterlife. It's good that people focus more on the great moral truths like the Golden Rule, "DO UNTO OTHERS AS YOU WOULD HAVE THEM DO UNTO YOU." That's great. But to say you know religious people that are loving and moral is not proof of religion's role in morality because atheists are capable of love and kindness also. The point is the books are not needed and in fact they can get in the way of moral progress: like the discrimination of homosexuals and women.
What I never understood is why we should follow the teachings of God, and not those of Bhudda for example. Personally, I would rather build my moral on the strange teachings of Bhuddism, and not the rules of a pro-rape, pro-genoicide serial killer.
Gender: Male Location: The Proud Nation of Kekistan
Oh I see, so you have this weird double standard that when religion motivates people to good morality it can't be given credit but when it motivates people to bad morality it's all religion's fault. Got it, makes sense. Totally not a double standard.
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Shadilay my brothers and sisters. With any luck we will throw off the shackles of normie oppression. We have nothing to lose but our chains! Praise Kek!
THE MOTTO IS "IN KEK WE TRUST"
^ That's not what I said. I said it's not always religion doing the motivation towards good. It's people's own innate nature and society playing and modifying religion.
And yes, it is undeniable that bad things have been the direct result of religion. Inquisition, burning of witches. I'm not saying that religion hasn't brought some good also, but it's not needed to do good in the world and it actually causes a lot of harm that wouldn't be there otherwise.
There's nuance to most of these that a meme format will never capture, so I think this is an inherently flawed way of approaching debate, which is how it's being used by some. But that one about the universe needs little outside context, imo. I saw some documentary about the stars and someone I was watching with had a similar comment, along the lines of "the sheer vastness of space makes any religion of man seem small by comparison." I think it's an issue that should be seriously grappled with by theists, but one that is too often pushed aside or not seriously considered.
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Oct 30th, 2017 05:18 PM
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