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The Big Bang Fizzle
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Blakemore
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Wonder Man
You know how an octagon forms. It takes 3 steps higher than carbon.
So not only the Big Bang but all the heiarcial with it.
An octagon is an 8 sided shape. What are you talking about?


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Old Post Jul 27th, 2020 08:18 AM
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Carbon chain is 5 sided. 8 fingers proves 3 higher.


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Old Post Jul 27th, 2020 11:58 PM
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what?


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Old Post Jul 28th, 2020 05:34 PM
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Archaeopteryx
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Big bang bad, invisible man in sky ,,,,,,uh


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Old Post Jul 29th, 2020 01:00 AM
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eThneoLgrRnae
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Go away, monkey wannabe troll. You believe that a friggin 'rock changed into all the life forms on the planet lmfao. Evolution and Big Bang are the two most stupid a** religions in the history of the world.


I believe in the eternal God and dumbasses like you believe in the eternal dirt lol. laughing out loud


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Last edited by eThneoLgrRnae on Jul 29th, 2020 at 01:36 AM

Old Post Jul 29th, 2020 01:29 AM
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eThneoLgrRnae
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"Dur hur, but it's not religion, it's science her derp."-- typical dumbass Darwinist's reply lol.


Science, my ass.


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Mr. Biden, Ben would like a word with you:

Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.-- Benjamin Franklin

And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth till the end shall be saved.--Matthew 10:22 (Jesus speaking)

Last edited by eThneoLgrRnae on Jul 29th, 2020 at 01:52 AM

Old Post Jul 29th, 2020 01:49 AM
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Badabing
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I seriously have to respond to reports and nonsense in the Religion Forum now? no expression


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Old Post Jul 29th, 2020 03:24 PM
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eThneoLgrRnae
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Sorry, Bada. I'll keep it more civil. Shoulda just put the troll on ignore instead of taking his mocking "invisible man in the sky" bait.


Won't happen again, don't worry.


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Mr. Biden, Ben would like a word with you:

Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.-- Benjamin Franklin

And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth till the end shall be saved.--Matthew 10:22 (Jesus speaking)

Old Post Jul 29th, 2020 08:03 PM
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Badabing
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I wasn't singling out any one person. thumb up


I've never understood the issue with the big bang vs creation. I guess I've always been able to separate science from Faith. Imo, science is necessary to learn the mysteries of the universe. Faith is necessary for the same reason to me.

Anyway, the science of the big bang always leads to either a paradox or infinity. Science has taken us to these conclusions. Either the universe popped into existence from nothing or our universe is part of an infinite multiverse. Neither sits well with me. It's either a chicken and the egg paradox or an infinite singularity.

As for life. Darwinism work great, and is proven, for small changes. See domestication of animals. But on a grand scale it falls apart badly. To say a single celled microbe evolved into complex, self aware life is not realistic to me. Most life is more complex than any machine that's been built. Let's say we find a fully functioning watch on another planet. Would you think it just occurred naturally or was it built by something intelligent?

Disclaimer: I'm not a physicist or biologist. So my opinions are that of a laymen. But I think both science and faith have a place in discovering the deeper mysteries of the universe and life.


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Old Post Jul 31st, 2020 12:19 PM
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Many of the statements I'm seeing stem from a lack of understanding on the Big Bang model of the universe. Big Bang Theory doesn't state everything came from nothing. It states everything already existed, but was in a hyper dense and hot state before expanding outward over time.

Yes, there are unresolved problems. As science discovers more about things like dark matter/dark energy, anti-matter, and the horizon problem, the model of the universe may change. It's why science uses "theory" instead of "law" nowadays: it's arrogant to assume no new knowledge could ever be gained that alters our understanding of the observable world.

Regardless, the Big Bang Theory is not the only proposed model of the universe, but it's where the current evidence points to. Current evidence doesn't point to a god or gods. I have no problem if people believe in gods. If faith enriches your life in some way, then have at it. We can't pretend they are equally supported in objective data though.


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Old Post Jul 31st, 2020 03:39 PM
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Badabing

I've never understood the issue with the big bang vs creation. I guess I've always been able to separate science from Faith.

As for life. Darwinism work great, and is proven, for small changes. See domestication of animals. But on a grand scale it falls apart badly. To say a single celled microbe evolved into complex, self aware life is not realistic to me. Most life is more complex than any machine that's been built. Let's say we find a fully functioning watch on another planet. Would you think it just occurred naturally or was it built by something intelligent?

thumb up Science in the science classroom and theology in the theology classroom. Not too hard to separate for most folks.

On the watch thing, the problem there is we already know what a watch is. We know, with certainty, that humans make watches. Or make machines that make watches. We've got no evidence they occur naturally either.

Finding tons of watches on an uninhabited planet might lead to discovering some weird natural process I guess. Or a watch-fruit bearing tree if there is plant life. We'd really have to investigate before making conclusions either way though.


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Old Post Jul 31st, 2020 04:13 PM
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Wonder Man
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Your own reason is flawed. Thatís like saying all projection is bad because of people who project on to others.
Chicken and egg isnít a problem at all.


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Old Post Jul 31st, 2020 07:23 PM
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eThneoLgrRnae
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Badabing
I wasn't singling out any one person. thumb up


I've never understood the issue with the big bang vs creation. I guess I've always been able to separate science from Faith. Imo, science is necessary to learn the mysteries of the universe. Faith is necessary for the same reason to me.

Anyway, the science of the big bang always leads to either a paradox or infinity. Science has taken us to these conclusions. Either the universe popped into existence from nothing or our universe is part of an infinite multiverse. Neither sits well with me. It's either a chicken and the egg paradox or an infinite singularity.

As for life. Darwinism work great, and is proven, for small changes. See domestication of animals. But on a grand scale it falls apart badly. To say a single celled microbe evolved into complex, self aware life is not realistic to me. Most life is more complex than any machine that's been built. Let's say we find a fully functioning watch on another planet. Would you think it just occurred naturally or was it built by something intelligent?

Disclaimer: I'm not a physicist or biologist. So my opinions are that of a laymen. But I think both science and faith have a place in discovering the deeper mysteries of the universe and life.



I as well certainly believe in small changes which is mistakenly called "microevolution" by many people. When I refer to Darwinism though as being wrong I'm talking about the theory overall. Which says that those easily provable small changes eventually add up to big, crazy changes like a land creature turning into a whale lol or a monkey/ape turning into a human (yes, that's quite a big change despite what Darwinists may think).


As for the Big Bang, I certainly don't think of that as being actual science. Yes, I believe the universe was created from nothing but I don't believe God used a big bang like event. I believe in the literal interpretation of Genesis which says that God spoke everything into existence (except for man, which He actually took the time to mold with His hands; which is why we are special to Him) and He didn't do it all instantly, though He certainly could have.


He created the universe over the course of 6 days and then rested on the seventh for our (humans) benefit. It is where our 7 day week truly comes from.



I'm not against science at all. I actually love science because it proves the existence of an omnipotent intelligent designer or at least suggests that there is one. It's certainly much more logical to assume there is one than to think pure randomness created all the order and natural laws we have in the universe.


The Big Bang and Darwinian macroevolution and abiogenesis are NOT science though.


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Mr. Biden, Ben would like a word with you:

Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.-- Benjamin Franklin

And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth till the end shall be saved.--Matthew 10:22 (Jesus speaking)

Last edited by eThneoLgrRnae on Jul 31st, 2020 at 08:03 PM

Old Post Jul 31st, 2020 07:50 PM
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take light for instance. If early light was found not from stars you might believe in something totally new.


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Old Post Jul 31st, 2020 08:22 PM
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Blakemore
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Badabing
I wasn't singling out any one person. thumb up


I've never understood the issue with the big bang vs creation. I guess I've always been able to separate science from Faith. Imo, science is necessary to learn the mysteries of the universe. Faith is necessary for the same reason to me.

Anyway, the science of the big bang always leads to either a paradox or infinity. Science has taken us to these conclusions. Either the universe popped into existence from nothing or our universe is part of an infinite multiverse. Neither sits well with me. It's either a chicken and the egg paradox or an infinite singularity.

As for life. Darwinism work great, and is proven, for small changes. See domestication of animals. But on a grand scale it falls apart badly. To say a single celled microbe evolved into complex, self aware life is not realistic to me. Most life is more complex than any machine that's been built. Let's say we find a fully functioning watch on another planet. Would you think it just occurred naturally or was it built by something intelligent?

Disclaimer: I'm not a physicist or biologist. So my opinions are that of a laymen. But I think both science and faith have a place in discovering the deeper mysteries of the universe and life.
Science is applying mathematical truths to matter. Faith is trusting something which cannot be proven.


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Old Post Aug 1st, 2020 04:30 PM
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It's possible scientists are wrong about how the universe began, but that doesn't mean it was God. It could have been through some process we have yet to understand.

I'd want evidence before saying it was willed into existence.

And then what willed God into existence and also if you will say God has always existed why is that possible but it the big bang is not?


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Old Post Aug 1st, 2020 04:50 PM
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the big bnag theory was disproven by Hawking himself. It was bosons, positrons and electrons creating a lot of fire and rapidly expanding. The universe has been expanding and contracting for all eternity.


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Old Post Aug 1st, 2020 04:57 PM
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Blakemore
the big bnag theory was disproven by Hawking himself. It was bosons, positrons and electrons creating a lot of fire and rapidly expanding. The universe has been expanding and contracting for all eternity.


But then the question from someone of faith will be where did those things come from


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Old Post Aug 1st, 2020 05:04 PM
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Surtur
But then the question from someone of faith will be where did those things come from
It's eternal.


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Old Post Aug 1st, 2020 05:05 PM
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eThneoLgrRnae
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Surtur
It's possible scientists are wrong about how the universe began, but that doesn't mean it was God. It could have been through some process we have yet to understand.

I'd want evidence before saying it was willed into existence.

And then what willed God into existence and also if you will say God has always existed why is that possible but it the big bang is not?



I've said many times, Surtur, that special Creation is a religious belief. I've never said it was scientifically provable. I just think it's far more logical than the Big Bang theory. I know you disagree and that's fine.


However, I think that the burden of proof is on the proponents of the Big Bang and Darwinian evolution because they want taxpayers to pay for it being taught in our schools, which we've all been doing for a while now. I think that's unfair and one reason I'm a strong advocate for home schooling.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Surtur
But then the question from someone of faith will be where did those things come from


Someone who believes in the Big Bang and/or Darwinian evolution is also a person of faith despite what some scientists may say. In fact, I'd say that everyone on the planet has faith in something. Leftists, for example, have faith in big government being able to fix everything, which is stupid but they are leftists, afterall. When people constantly use a certain news source they are putting faith in that source to tell them the truth. We all put faith in things that history books tell us are true. We weren't there to experience for ourselves what the books are claiming. Everyone to some degree or another is a person of faith.


We all have very strong faith that the sun will come up tomorrow. We have faith that if a person walks off a mountain that they will die a horrible death because we all have faith in gravity always working.


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Mr. Biden, Ben would like a word with you:

Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.-- Benjamin Franklin

And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth till the end shall be saved.--Matthew 10:22 (Jesus speaking)

Last edited by eThneoLgrRnae on Aug 1st, 2020 at 08:33 PM

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