I've been to both. Most pro-choice sites address things like woman's rights, etc. I'm open to pro-life or pro-choice sites, when it comes to abortion there really are no unbiased sites. At least none I've found yet.
A sperm and egg are living even before fertilization occurs. Why is it then justifiable to terminate the life of a sperm and egg one second before fertilization but not one second after fertilization?
Furthermore, if the series of birth control pills a woman is taking fails to repress her ovulation cycle, she will release an egg. The egg will be viable for 24 hours, and if it becomes fertilized during this time, the woman will become pregnant in 14 days. Between the time of fertilization and pregnancy, a woman will continue to take her regular series of birth control pills. This will result in altering the uterine environment to prevent implantation or the flushing of the uterine lining at menstruation along with the fertilized ovum.
A fetus is both living and human but to terminate its life is killing, not murder. After 96 pages, one would think you could make that distinction.
Because a sperm (or an egg) cannot become a human. It has no chance of changing into a human. Once the ovum is fertilized, it will become a human. Saying that one should not kill a sperm is nonsensical--the woman's body does enough of that on its own.
__________________ Ask me about my "obvious and unpleasant agenda of hatred."
Fertilization is the beginning of a humans life, period. After fertilization it isn't a sperm and egg it is an organism. I'm not saying it's "not OK" to get an abortion but people continue to say things that just aren't true. Before you choose to be for or against abortion you should do at least a little research on the subject and find out the basic facts. Obviously not everyone hear has done that or they wouldn't be telling me that a fetus is just a bunch of cells and not life.
If in fact the woman doesn't become pregnant until 14 days after fertilization, than killing the embryo before that technically isn't an abortion. Abortion is more than just killing, it's terminating a pregnancy. You can't terminate a pregnancy that doesn't exist. And once again, I never said it was murder, I said an embryo is life. I was told that an embryo is not life and that's contrary to what I've learned, so I argued that an embryo is life. Never said a thing about murder.
While I agree with your point, I'm not the one that said that. You're confusing me with my boyfriend. We have the same avatar, so it's understandable. Adam will argue his point till the cows come home, and while I agree with him; it matters little to me if it's a life or not. "It" being a life or not hasn't really made much of a difference in my mind. Let's say it's a "life", let's say it isn't. Doesn't matter, it belongs to the parents. Bottom line. Not the people of this world, not the members of any given church, not the god that those people subscribe to, the parents. And the parents alone have the right to make that descision. We've moved past the times where women need to toss themselves down a flight of stairs because they don't want to have a baby.
__________________ "If I were you"
"If you were me, you'd know the safest place to hide...is in sanity!
Regardless if you think it's an important factor, when people say that an embryo isn't life I'm going to correct them because many people do base their standpoint on that factor. And an unborn fetus belongs to the mother only, not the parents. The father has no say whatsoever because the fetus isn't dependant on his body for survival. Once the baby is born then it belongs to the parents.
Afro_Cheese> For the sake of correctness… Okay, let’s go out this tangent for the heck of it. Doesn’t calling something DEAD assume that it can also – in principle – be alive?
I mean, that a definition of dead is inanimate or inert, doesn’t mean that inanimate or inert things are dead, does it? I don’t know actually…
I can’t see how you can label an abortion as MORE than termination of life. Could you elaborate on the ”more”?
Are you saying an egg is not life? Ore you saying sperm is not life???
Adam_Poe> ” Preventing a pregnancy and terminating a pregnancy are different means to achieving the same end. If one is arguing the sanctity of a potential human life, neither choice is better or worse than the other.”
Ah, but I do think that anti-abortionists would beg to differ…
Hey, that thing about a woman not being pregnant until 14 days after conception… Could you toss a link my way? I’d like to get my facts straight… If it’s true it places the ”life begins at conception” in a totally different persepctive (But Afro_Cheese, if the embryo was removed before 14 days after conception, would you call it an abortion??)
Feceman> Wrong. The pill works in two ways. Usually it prevents the release of an egg. But sometimes the egg is released, and the pill then works by flushing the egg – fertilized or not. I argue that this is chemical abortion.
And it is NOT an accident.
” Because a sperm (or an egg) cannot become a human. ” So clones are not life? If you cloned a human it would not be human?
Captain> ” While I agree with your point, I'm not the one that said that.” Ah, well Remind me not to try and explain you then!
__________________ "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
-Voltaire
"That includes ruining Halloween because someone swallowed a Bible."
"I just thought you were a guy."
"... Most guys do."
I'm saying it's not the termination of any life.. it's the termination of a pregnancy after conception. I actually think you are right the pill does sometimes cause early abortions now that I look at what the definition of conception is.. but somebody else said that the baby isn't conceived until 14 days after fertilization which would mean that killing the embryo before then wouldn't be abortion.
And just for future reference the definition of dead is:
dead:
Adjective
Inflected forms: dead·er, dead·est 1. Having lost life; no longer alive. 2. Marked for certain death; doomed: was marked as a dead man by the assassin. 3. a. Having the physical appearance of death: a dead pallor. b. Lacking feeling or sensitivity; numb or unresponsive: Passersby were dead to our pleas for help. c. Weary and worn-out; exhausted. 4. a. Not having the capacity to live; inanimate or inert. b. Not having the capacity to produce or sustain life; barren: dead soil. 5. a. No longer in existence, use, or operation. b. No longer having significance or relevance. c. Physically inactive; dormant: a dead volcano. 6. a. Not commercially productive; idle: dead capital. b. Not circulating or running; stagnant: dead water; dead air. 7. a. Devoid of human or vehicular activity; quiet: a dead town. b. Lacking all animation, excitement, or activity; dull: The party being dead, we left early. 8. Having no resonance. Used of sounds: "One characteristic of compact discs we all can hear is dead sound. It may be pure but it has no life" (Musical Heritage Review). 9. Having grown cold; having been extinguished: dead coals; a dead flame. 10. Lacking elasticity or bounce: That tennis ball is dead. 11. Out of operation because of a fault or breakdown: The motor is dead. 12. a. Sudden; abrupt: a dead stop. b. Complete; utter: dead silence. c. Exact; unerring. the dead center of a target. 13. Sports Out of play. Used of a ball. 14. a. Lacking connection to a source of electric current. b. Drained of electric charge; discharged: a dead battery.
Like I said, no one else's opinion is relevant to the way I approach the subject. To be completely honest, I think we need to stop reproducing all together for a while...as a species. We're fast running out of resources. But that's another argument.
As for it not belonging to the father too, did the sperm belong to the mother before the man produced it? As soon as women start breeding my mitosis, then I will consider your argument relevant. Perhaps in the world today, women are given more consideration in regards to a the baby. I do not agree with this standpoint. Pro-lifers always talk about family values, why would one say that the baby was the mother's alone?
__________________ "If I were you"
"If you were me, you'd know the safest place to hide...is in sanity!
For the record I'm not pro life. I'm almost stuck in the middle on this issue but I don't want a law banning abortion so I'm technically pro choice. Like it or not I'm one of you. But I wouldn't object if they made the time limit in which you could get abortions smaller... 6 months seems a little drastic to me.
It is the woman's choice, therefore the woman alone owns the baby until it's viable. Since she can choose to get an abortion without the father or choose not to without the father it's ultimately hers and he has no say. This isn't my personal view on how it should be.. this is just how it is.
KMC Community Forums
Dec 1st, 2004 08:51 PM
