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Hiya. I've always sort of wondered about this; X was around in a time of severe racism towards blacks (ie jim crow), but his views towards the whites from what I've learned are quite racist themselves.
I honestly don't know enough about him to know if he generalised all whites as being the 'white devil'.

I know he fought against the whole inequality thing but was his ultimate goal inequality ie no whites?

When he was associated with the Nation of Islam, he preached hatred/racism. After he left, he supposedly calmed down some.

As I recall from history class he was proudly racist early on but after going on the Hajj and getting exposure to cultures all around the world he started to mellow. Of course he died like a year later so there wasn't much time for that to have an effect.

I wonder why so many people are pointed out as Racist all the time?it gets pretty boring after hearing it all over and over again.

Originally posted by ADarksideJedi
I wonder why so many people are pointed out as Racist all the time?it gets pretty boring after hearing it all over and over again. It may be cause a lot of people are racist.

Malcolm the 10th was a good dude.

Originally posted by Dave_97
Malcolm the 10th was a good dude.

[email protected]

it was on a show, maybe scrubs.

I don't think he was at al
Only white people can be racists and that is a fact thanks to the various colonial
European empires that murdered millions of people of America, Canada, Brazil, Australia, New Zealand, India etc

If you're trying to rile people for fun, FoTN did this "racism invented by Whites!" angle long ago.

If you actually think that, you're a tool and non-European empires murdered people just the same, so read a book or two.

It's historical fact that cannot be ignored

But what happened in the past cannot be blamed on the modern day white race
And that's all I'm saying on that

Originally posted by majid86
I don't think he was at al
Only white people can be racists and that is a fact thanks to the various colonial
European empires that murdered millions of people of America, Canada, Brazil, Australia, New Zealand, India etc

Lol, anyone can be racist.

If we go by "X" the movie, which afaik was fairly accurate, his trip to Mecca, where he worshiped with people of all races, was hugely transformative in his opinion of whites and racial integration.

Also, there is a line where a white girl asks him what she, as a non-racist white person can do to help his cause, to which X says "nothing", sort of indicates that he was only preaching against white establishment and not individual white people.

The problem is, X was alive in a time where all the establishment was essentially "white". To fight the battle he was fighting, some aknowledgement of this would have been necessary, and in a way, that does make him "anti-white", but only in so far as whites controlled the systems that legitimately work to oppress black people. We could probably call this "racism" in a philosophical sense, but I think there is very little evidence that this extended to X's opinion of white people in general.

There are good interviews of him on youtube, where he seems to have little problem discussing with white people, though his confrontational nature does come out.

Originally posted by majid86
It's historical fact that cannot be ignored

/facepalm

you know, Japanese society is extremely xenophobic

Arabs have traditionally been racist toward blacks

etc

Originally posted by Bardock42
Lol, anyone can be racist.

Not anyone just those who preach hatred toward non whites because they don't have blond hair, blue eyes, light skin etc

Originally posted by majid86
It's historical fact that cannot be ignored

But what happened in the past cannot be blamed on the modern day white race
And that's all I'm saying on that
The concept of race as a divisor dates back at least to Ancient Egypt, maybe even earlier.

Yasuke, the first black man to ever live in Japan was executed after being captured by the enemies of his Lord, Oda Nobunaga on the grounds that they believed him to be an animal. We're talking about Japan prior to any meaningful contact with white cultures. IE: white people have no monopoly on racism.

Originally posted by majid86
Not anyone just those who preach hatred toward non whites because they don't have blond hair, blue eyes, light skin etc
What you seem to be doing here is simplifying racism to apply only to White Supremacy, specifically the Nordic variety.

Does using racial slurs in your defense make you a racist?

This has happened to me many times whenever a white person calls me a paki

Originally posted by majid86
Does using racial slurs in your defense make you a racist?

This has happened to me many times whenever a white person calls me a paki
A little bit, yeah.

Originally posted by majid86
Not anyone just those who preach hatred toward non whites because they don't have blond hair, blue eyes, light skin etc

sorry man, that is just factually incorrect

I don't think so and I'll say whatever I want to hurt that person the most.
How can a person be mad and pc at the same time?

Thank god I live in a multicultural nation like the UK because I feel safer living in an Asian area than any other place in London

Originally posted by majid86
I don't think so and I'll say whatever I want to hurt that person the most.

if they are racial epitaphs, you are being racist...

how is this difficult to understand?

In defense only for example if a white guy came up to me and calls me a paki bastard and then I'll call him a white bastard in return.

That has been the case sometimes

ok, so you are responding to racism with racism...

this is the very basic concept of "two wrongs don't make a right" or "pot calling the kettle black"

I don't see nothing wrong with using racism to fight racism

Originally posted by majid86
I don't think so and I'll say whatever I want to hurt that person the most.
How can a person be mad and pc at the same time?

Thank god I live in a multicultural nation like the UK because I feel safer living in an Asian area than any other place in London
This post expresses mistrust of non-Asians, IE racism.

What's the point of calling your nation multi-cultural if the only race/culture you feel comfortable with is your own?

Originally posted by majid86
I don't see nothing wrong with using racism to fight racism
I bet you also try prying knives out with other knives.
Z2mCMF222IQ

I'm very neutral on who I approach so no I'm not racist

Originally posted by majid86
I'm very neutral on who I approach so no I'm not racist
Your previous comments suggest otherwise.

Originally posted by majid86
Not anyone just those who preach hatred toward non whites because they don't have blond hair, blue eyes, light skin etc

Nah, really anyone can potentially be racist, and racism doesn't mean that you favour white skinned, blue eyed, blonde people, that is just one form of racism among many.

Originally posted by majid86
Not anyone just those who preach hatred toward non whites because they don't have blond hair, blue eyes, light skin etc
I'm sorry, but that is not the definition of racism.

Originally posted by majid86
I don't see nothing wrong with using racism to fight racism

you become the thing you are fighting against?

or, read my sig

Originally posted by majid86
Not anyone just those who preach hatred toward non whites because they don't have blond hair, blue eyes, light skin etc

Come on, I refuse to believe you're that stupid as your post suggest.

Do you really believe only "white" people (as define by you above) can be racist?

hey, I guess I'm not white...

That's what I was figuring but I had read something that seemed extremely anti-white, I'll have to watch that film 'X' is sounds pretty interesting.


Originally posted by inimalist
If we go by "X" the movie, which afaik was fairly accurate, his trip to Mecca, where he worshiped with people of all races, was hugely transformative in his opinion of whites and racial integration.

Also, there is a line where a white girl asks him what she, as a non-racist white person can do to help his cause, to which X says "nothing", sort of indicates that he was only preaching against white establishment and not individual white people.

The problem is, X was alive in a time where all the establishment was essentially "white". To fight the battle he was fighting, some aknowledgement of this would have been necessary, and in a way, that does make him "anti-white", but only in so far as whites controlled the systems that legitimately work to oppress black people. We could probably call this "racism" in a philosophical sense, but I think there is very little evidence that this extended to X's opinion of white people in general.

There are good interviews of him on youtube, where he seems to have little problem discussing with white people, though his confrontational nature does come out.

awesome film

Originally posted by inimalist
"pot calling the kettle black"

Excuuuuse me?

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Excuuuuse me?

He means pot calling the kettle African American.


He's old school.

His family was killed by the KKK, jeez, no wonder where all the hatred comes from.

Why'd he get wrapped up in that stupid religious extremism though?

Originally posted by Liberator
His family was killed by the KKK, jeez, no wonder where all the hatred comes from.

Why'd he get wrapped up in that stupid religious extremism though? He became muslim in jail.

As we all know, all muslims are extremists.

Originally posted by Liberator
Hiya. I've always sort of wondered about this; X was around in a time of severe racism towards blacks (ie jim crow), but his views towards the whites from what I've learned are quite racist themselves.
I honestly don't know enough about him to know if he generalised all whites as being the 'white devil'.

I know he fought against the whole inequality thing but was his ultimate goal inequality ie no whites?


Yes, there is no question that Malcolm X is racist. You know how i know that..,because of his actions and his hate rhetoric. Is Malcolm X racist...,

www.white-history.com

Notice Chapter 8 where he says ancient Egypt was a "Nordic Desert Empire".

Originally posted by Quiero Mota
www.white-history.com

That didn't seem so bad until I saw the "breakdown of racial homogeneity" part.

Originally posted by Mindset
He became muslim in jail.

As we all know, all muslims are extremists.

Now, now.
I think all religions are utter bollocks.

And; from listening to a few of his speeches he seemed very extreme when he came and talked a bit about religion. Correct me if i'm wrong but isn't 'Nation of Islam' some extremist group in the US?

extremeist in that they used racial and religious language to attack a system that was inherently racist and oppressive? yes

extremeist in terms of what we understand as muslim extremism today? no

EDIT: what I don't really condone a lot of X's more hateful stuff, you have to remember, back then, there was a "white man", in so far as white people controlled everything and fought against the rights of blacks.

Originally posted by inimalist
extremeist in that they used racial and religious language to attack a system that was inherently racist and oppressive? yes

extremeist in terms of what we understand as muslim extremism today? no

That's a fair point actually, makes sense to me. I just heard somewhere that 'Nation of Islam' was a nonsensical. Weren't they the ones allegedly behind the death of Malcolm X? Sorry for the questions I just don't really hear much about him on this end of the pond.

yes, he broke with their leader after finding out he had affairs on his wife, and began to speak out against him.... can't remember the name or be bother to look it up on wiki...

but yes, he was killed by those within his camp because he broke from "party line"

I think he used to be racist but he changed. I have to say though I'm not sure if you can really blame him for being racist in times like that.

I'm surprised no one has said: "No, he's dead."

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
I'm surprised no one has said: "No, he's dead."

Death doesn't stop ones racism!!! Zombie racism!!!

Originally posted by Robtard
When he was associated with the Nation of Islam, he preached hatred/racism. After he left, he supposedly calmed down some. Because he started sexing white women.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Death doesn't stop ones racism!!! Zombie racism!!!

damn smoothskins

Originally posted by Bardock42
Death doesn't stop ones racism!!! Zombie racism!!!

I lol'd. I suppose when the zombie apocalypse begins it would be safer to travel to a more racially homogeneous location...for the safety of everyone, of course.

Considering the level of racism that white americans showed in the time period and before... can anyone say lynch mob? or being beaten by water from fire hoses? No. he was not a racist. He was a man with extreme views that were completely opposite of the views and values of his time. Those kinds of people tend to stick out and be called horrible things. Even now looking back, I don't think he was racist.

Originally posted by siriuswriter
Considering the level of racism that white americans showed in the time period and before... can anyone say lynch mob? or being beaten by water from fire hoses? No. he was not a racist. He was a man with extreme views that were completely opposite of the views and values of his time. Those kinds of people tend to stick out and be called horrible things. Even now looking back, I don't think he was racist.

If we accept that white people of the time were racist toward blacks, and he held equally extreme views toward whites then I think we sort of have to accept that he was racist, though his feelings were definitely understandable and maybe justified.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
If we accept that white people of the time were racist toward blacks, and he held equally extreme views toward whites then I think we sort of have to accept that he was racist, though his feelings were definitely understandable and maybe justified.

I agree with this - although I don't agree with his views being understandable or even maybe justified.

If you fight the monster, take care you don't become one is type of philosophy that applies here.

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
I agree with this - although I don't agree with his views being understandable or even maybe justified.

If you fight the monster, take care you don't become one is type of philosophy that applies here.

Easier said than done. Its all very nice in theory but I think it helps if you know what it feels like to be in his situation.

Originally posted by Deadline
Easier said than done. Its all very nice in theory but I think it helps if you know what it feels like to be in his situation.

I'm not going to pretend or suggest that I do.

Philosophy of not becoming that which you're trying to fight is not an easy one, and not everyone can do it - Malcom X evidently couldn't because he became that which he was so vehemently flighting against. It ultimately takes a lot in terms of discipline, understanding and virtue in order to fight something and not ending up perpetuating the very practice you wish to eradicate. I do not think that I would be able in any way to do it.

He must have been in an unimaginable position, yes, but equally, black people aren't the only ones in the history of the humanity who were enslaved nor whose rights were denied.

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
I agree with this - although I don't agree with his views being understandable or even maybe justified.

If you fight the monster, take care you don't become one is type of philosophy that applies here.

You don't see how being a black man living in a place where white people really do hold every position of power could feel that sort of rage? I mean there were literally city officials that drove off blacks with cattle prods and didn't get voted out of office by their constituency. It's very hard to look at that from the inside and say "maybe white folks aren't so bad."

I think it's very understandable. While I don't think everything he did and said was justified I can see the arguments.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
You don't see how being a black man living in a place where white people really do hold every position of power could feel that sort of rage? I mean there were literally city officials that drove off blacks with cattle prods and didn't get voted out of office by their constituency. It's very hard to look at that from the inside and say "maybe white folks aren't so bad."

I think it's very understandable. While I don't think everything he did and said was justified I can see the arguments.

Right, so your argument is perpetuating hate is understandable - instead of working towards changing the system, preaching more hate is actually going to somehow help the blacks fight the system and it will moreover make white people go ''oooh right, I have seen the error of my ways''.

Even he himself came to release that his blatant racist and aggressive comments were unnecessary and counter-productive and that stereotyping an entire group of people was wrong.

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
Right, so your argument is perpetuating hate is understandable - instead of working towards changing the system, preaching more hate is actually going to somehow help the blacks fight the system and it will moreover make white people go ''oooh right, I have seen the error of my ways''.

And I don't agree with how "even he" is phrased, I could imagine a lesser person to never have realized. We are all a influenced by society around us, and I could not say in good conscience that if I had lived his life in his time that I would not have felt hate for white people and I could also not say that I am sure I would have been able to realize and change, can you?

Even he himself came to release that his blatant racist and aggressive comments were unnecessary and counter-productive and that stereotyping an entire group of people was wrong.

I'd say it is understandable, it may not be justifiable or smart or moral or whatever, but I can understand why it happens under those circumstances. To be fair I can also understand why the more standard racism against blacks happens, but it's certainly not as understandable. Say I could understand how for most people being the target of such thorough discrimination in society it is easy to develop a lot of hatred, perhaps misguided hatred.



Now I am not saying that's true for Malcolm X, I don't know much about him, I'm just talking hypothetically for any person living under such circumstances.

People are mixing his anger/rage (which is justifiable) and his racism.

He preached (as per early NOI doctrine) that white-people were inferior; blacks were the original and genetically superior race. This is retarded and shouldn't be excused.

Originally posted by Robtard
People are mixing his anger/rage (which is justifiable) and his racism.

He preached (as per early NOI doctrine) that white-people were inferior; blacks were the original and genetically superior race. This is retarded and shouldn't be excused.

Were you in his position? I don't agree(edit that whites are inferior) but its all nice in theory.

Obviously no. You don't agree with what?

Originally posted by Robtard
Obviously no. You don't agree with what?

Then you're in no position to judge. I don't agree that whites are inferior.

well if the basket ball court and overall sports was any indication i would agree..excellent

but, then again swimming is their kryptonite.

what about overall education?

O god I hoped this wouldn't happen. facepalm

Originally posted by Deadline
Then you're in no position to judge. I don't agree that whites are inferior.

Um, no. I can judge a ridiculous claim, just as you did by not agreeing with it too, genius.

Originally posted by Deadline
O god I hoped this wouldn't happen. facepalm what? trying to make light of the situation?

i think a lot of what Malcom X said was racist and out of anger. i dont blame him nor judge him due to the world he lived in. it was justifiable his opinion of race superiority is his and i dont care, its a person's opinion which is subjective. i learned to ignore and at times respect such opinions.

Originally posted by Robtard
People are mixing his anger/rage (which is justifiable) and his racism.

He preached (as per early NOI doctrine) that white-people were inferior; blacks were the original and genetically superior race. This is retarded and shouldn't be excused.

its not a really easy distinction to make. his philosophies from the NOI informed a lot of his more valid criticisms of white institutions.

I do agree it is a "baby-in-the-bathwater" situation

Originally posted by Robtard
People are mixing his anger/rage (which is justifiable) and his racism.

He preached (as per early NOI doctrine) that white-people were inferior; blacks were the original and genetically superior race. This is retarded and shouldn't be excused.

There are reasons why someone would follow such ideas though. That's the whole point.

Originally posted by Robtard
Um, no. I can judge a ridiculous claim, just as you did by not agreeing with it too, genius.

Thats not the point.

Originally posted by King Castle
what? trying to make light of the situation?

i think a lot of what Malcom X said was racist and out of anger. i dont blame him nor judge him due to the world he lived in. it was justifiable his opinion of race superiority is his and i dont care, its a person's opinion which is subjective. i learned to ignore and at times respect such opinions.

Its ok I'm kinda messing with you.

Originally posted by inimalist
its not a really easy distinction to make. his philosophies from the NOI informed a lot of his more valid criticisms of white institutions.

I do agree it is a "baby-in-the-bathwater" situation
Originally posted by Bardock42
There are reasons why someone would follow such ideas though. That's the whole point.

Have you read the early NOI doctrines on white-people? Being created by an evil black scientist eons ago to punish the pure black-race etc.

It's absurd at it's best, hate the white-man all you like for going through Jim Crow and whatnot, but preaching and believing nonsense is just that.

Originally posted by Deadline
Thats not the point.

I don't think you had a point.

Originally posted by Robtard
I don't think you had a point.

Of course I did. If you want to lie about it, its ok.

Originally posted by Robtard
Have you read the early NOI doctrines on white-people? Being created by an evil black scientist eons ago to punish the pure black-race etc.

It's absurd at it's best, hate the white-man all you like for going through Jim Crow and whatnot, but preaching and believing nonsense is just that.

my point is more that you can't look at his "anger" and his "racism" as two separate things, I'm not trying to say that his legitimate statements about oppression make his racism any more true

Originally posted by Deadline
Of course I did. If you want to lie about it, its ok.

Lie? That was my opinion.

But okay, what was your point?

Originally posted by inimalist
my point is more that you can't look at his "anger" and his "racism" as two separate things, I'm not trying to say that his legitimate statements about oppression make his racism any more true

And my point was that his racism shouldn't be excused, despite his suffering due to oppression.

Originally posted by Robtard
It's absurd at it's best, hate the white-man all you like for going through Jim Crow and whatnot, but preaching and believing nonsense is just that.

You will find absurdity in every religion. To which religion do you subscribe?

Originally posted by Robtard
And my point was that his racism shouldn't be excused, despite his suffering due to oppression.

no, but it certainly shouldn't be simply dismissed as "racial untruth". Understanding the position of militant blacks depends on understanding their hatred, the same would be true for anyone looking into what drove the KKK

maybe we are arguing different points. I never said he wasn't racist, but more was arguing that his racism was a byproduct of a very racialized time, and in some sense appropriate to the position he took. Obviously it is something he should be criticized for, but there is more to it than "X is/isn't a racist"

like, obviously the better path is the one MLK took

Originally posted by Robtard
Have you read the early NOI doctrines on white-people? Being created by an evil black scientist eons ago to punish the pure black-race etc.

It's absurd at it's best, hate the white-man all you like for going through Jim Crow and whatnot, but preaching and believing nonsense is just that.

And no one is denying that...all people are saying is that circumstances matter and that it is understandable to have ones judgement clouded by anger (justified anger in this case perhaps)

Originally posted by inimalist
no, but it certainly shouldn't be simply dismissed as "racial untruth". Understanding the position of militant blacks depends on understanding their hatred, the same would be true for anyone looking into what drove the KKK

maybe we are arguing different points. I never said he wasn't racist, but more was arguing that his racism was a byproduct of a very racialized time, and in some sense appropriate to the position he took. Obviously it is something he should be criticized for, but there is more to it than "X is/isn't a racist"

like, obviously the better path is the one MLK took



I guess we are, I can rationalize his anger/hatred towards white-people/society, I'd probably feel the same way were I in his time/position. His racism though, considering that in all likelihood it came long after his anger/hate as he experienced racial-oppression early on , I can't. It's also outright laughable, the concept of it, even more-so than the KKK's idiotic rants on racial superiority for whites.

Originally posted by skekUng
You will find absurdity in every religion. To which religion do you subscribe?

I don't subscribe to any.

Originally posted by Liberator
Hiya. I've always sort of wondered about this; X was around in a time of severe racism towards blacks (ie jim crow), but his views towards the whites from what I've learned are quite racist themselves.
I honestly don't know enough about him to know if he generalised all whites as being the 'white devil'.

I know he fought against the whole inequality thing but was his ultimate goal inequality ie no whites?

Yes, he sure was.

Originally posted by Robtard
I don't subscribe to any.

Then to the choir I am preaching.