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Entropy Aegis Steel

vs

Rune King Thor
Zeus
Thorbuster Iron Man
Magneto
Bor
Worldbreaker Hulk
Kuurth
Sersi
Silver Surfer
Thanos
Void Sentry (Siege version)
Gladiator
Beta Ray Bill
Zuras
P5 Namor (1/5 Phoenix Force)


No BFR

Needs to be a moratorium on EA Steel threads.

Team dies.

the entropy aegis was that big of an amp ?

The Entropy Aegis wields entropy, the most destructive force in DC.

The EA also tanked a combined attack from the Quintessence (Shazam, Ganthet, Phantom Stranger, Highfather, Zeus) as effortlessly as Superman tanks bullets.

Originally posted by Cogito
The Entropy Aegis wields entropy, the most destructive force in DC.

The EA also tanked a combined attack from the Quintessence (Shazam, Ganthet, Phantom Stranger, Highfather, Zeus) as effortlessly as Superman tanks bullets. Kryptonite bullets?

Are there any scans of the Aegis' best feats, because to prove that the team loses, it should take more than the comments posted above. No offense intended. That just happens to be a universe crushing team so please humor me. For now I believe that the team wins.

The scans are in the Imperiex respect thread.

Originally posted by Stoic
Are there any scans of the Aegis' best feats, because to prove that the team loses, it should take more than the comments posted above. No offense intended. That just happens to be a universe crushing team so please humor me. For now I believe that the team wins. All of the E/A's feats are here:
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=520501&pagenumber=2

Originally posted by Galan007
All of the E/A's feats are here:
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=520501&pagenumber=2

Who do you think wins? Personally, I think RKT would be a good fight one on one, but would lose. Wouldn't this team be overkill?

The EA wasn't scratched by anything. Since it has not enough appearances and it's unknown how to damage or destryo it, i's rather unquantifiable. The Quintessence stated that no mortal should wield the power of Imperiex or entropy itself. I think one need abstract level of power to damage it.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
The EA wasn't scratched by anything. Since it has not enough appearances and it's unknown how to damage or destryo it, i's rather unquantifiable. The Quintessence stated that no mortal should wield the power of Imperiex or entropy itself. I think one need abstract level of power to damage it.

That's pretty solid reasoning, but before America's Shield was rumpled by a far weaker King Thor (comparing him to Rune King Thor in this instance), I'm sure many would have doubted, or had doubts that even an Odin powered being would be able to physically harm it.

The idea behind the armor itself, and where it was taken leaves a rather large possibility of the armor itself being able to be compromised. Rune King Thor may be just the one to do so. He after all was able to rip off a Sky Fathers head with less trouble than you or I would be able to pluck a flower. If that isn't power I don't know what is.

I've expressed my doubts about Galactus being able to defeat the Rune King at average levels, while others continued to rate him as an Elder Deity by title which is something that I believe that this forum suffers from. What I mean is that there are guys that are in tiers that run contrary to the amount of punishment that they can take.

I can't recall there ever being a level placed on him (RKT). Just how powerful is an Elder Deity exactly? Can we be sure that the Rune King could not wipe the floor with one? Would an Elder Deity be able to defeat Galactus at the level that he was on when he fought Tyrant, or Odin. I know that when he fought Tyrant that he prepared for the battle, so no excuses can be given in that regard.

We know that the Aegis was durable by canonical citation, but what of it's offensive powers? Could it even harm King Thor, let alone the Rune King, whose power dwarfs the former? That's just one of the guys on the team, albeit the most powerful.

You hit the nail on the head when you brought up the Aegis' short history. I need to remind some people that there was a time that the Destroyer armor was also looked upon under the same light that the Aegis is looked upon now. What's changed? Well history, and I have no doubt that if the Aegis ever returns on the scene, that it too will likely suffer a defeat or two.

I'm willing to bet that after a prolonged battle with Rune King Thor, and his vast array of powers, that we would see the Aegis defeated. after all who no sells Mangog with ease?

This team should win by proxy on the strength of actually having histories, but not just that, but by comparing them to other characters with long running histories, and their ability to easily outshine very powerful opponents with ease.

I'm not trying to apply a no-limits fallacy to the EA, but I'm confident that entropy can kill anyone on the team and I'm not convinced that anyone on the team can definitively damage the Aegis.

^ This, pretty much. I can't see someone even as high up as RKT being able to handle being dumped in an entropy rift. Plus, given Steel's ability to rend time/space, I'm not sure Thor could stop time to prevent Steel from attacking.

Originally posted by Stoic
That's pretty solid reasoning, but before America's Shield was rumpled by a far weaker King Thor (comparing him to Rune King Thor in this instance), I'm sure many would have doubted, or had doubts that even an Odin powered being would be able to physically harm it.

The idea behind the armor itself, and where it was taken leaves a rather large possibility of the armor itself being able to be compromised. Rune King Thor may be just the one to do so. He after all was able to rip off a Sky Fathers head with less trouble than you or I would be able to pluck a flower. If that isn't power I don't know what is.

I've expressed my doubts about Galactus being able to defeat the Rune King at average levels, while others continued to rate him as an Elder Deity by title which is something that I believe that this forum suffers from. What I mean is that there are guys that are in tiers that run contrary to the amount of punishment that they can take.

I can't recall there ever being a level placed on him (RKT). Just how powerful is an Elder Deity exactly? Can we be sure that the Rune King could not wipe the floor with one? Would an Elder Deity be able to defeat Galactus at the level that he was on when he fought Tyrant, or Odin. I know that when he fought Tyrant that he prepared for the battle, so no excuses can be given in that regard.

We know that the Aegis was durable by canonical citation, but what of it's offensive powers?Could it even harm King Thor, let alone the Rune King, whose power dwarfs the former? That's just one of the guys on the team, albeit the most powerful.

You hit the nail on the head when you brought up the Aegis' short history. I need to remind some people that there was a time that the Destroyer armor was also looked upon under the same light that the Aegis is looked upon now. What's changed? Well history, and I have no doubt that if the Aegis ever returns on the scene, that it too will likely suffer a defeat or two.

I'm willing to bet that after a prolonged battle with Rune King Thor, and his vast array of powers, that we would see the Aegis defeated. after all who no sells Mangog with ease?

This team should win by proxy on the strength of actually having histories, but not just that, but by comparing them to other characters with long running histories, and their ability to easily outshine very powerful opponents with ease.
Considering how entropy is capable of casually killing a Celestial(the same breed that were able to survive nullification energies from an alternate UN) in the Marvel Multiverse , I doubt that any skyfather or elder god level entity could tank or even survive it .

Originally posted by Harbinger
^ This, pretty much. I can't see someone even as high up as RKT being able to handle being dumped in an entropy rift. Plus, given Steel's ability to rend time/space, I'm not sure Thor could stop time to prevent Steel from attacking.
Low Abstract level beings like the Mad Celestials could be killed by an entropic shot from a rifle sized tech gun .

Unless his magical/supernatural nature grants him immunity to entropy , I don't see RKT surviving entropy .

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Considering how entropy is capable of casually killing a Celestial(the same breed that were able to survive nullification energies from an alternate UN) in the Marvel Multiverse , I doubt that any skyfather or elder god level entity could tank or even survive it . Good point.

Originally posted by Stoic
That's pretty solid reasoning, but before America's Shield was rumpled by a far weaker King Thor (comparing him to Rune King Thor in this instance), I'm sure many would have doubted, or had doubts that even an Odin powered being would be able to physically harm it.

The idea behind the armor itself, and where it was taken leaves a rather large possibility of the armor itself being able to be compromised. Rune King Thor may be just the one to do so. He after all was able to rip off a Sky Fathers head with less trouble than you or I would be able to pluck a flower. If that isn't power I don't know what is.

I've expressed my doubts about Galactus being able to defeat the Rune King at average levels, while others continued to rate him as an Elder Deity by title which is something that I believe that this forum suffers from. What I mean is that there are guys that are in tiers that run contrary to the amount of punishment that they can take.

I can't recall there ever being a level placed on him (RKT). Just how powerful is an Elder Deity exactly? Can we be sure that the Rune King could not wipe the floor with one? Would an Elder Deity be able to defeat Galactus at the level that he was on when he fought Tyrant, or Odin. I know that when he fought Tyrant that he prepared for the battle, so no excuses can be given in that regard.

We know that the Aegis was durable by canonical citation, but what of it's offensive powers? Could it even harm King Thor, let alone the Rune King, whose power dwarfs the former? That's just one of the guys on the team, albeit the most powerful.

You hit the nail on the head when you brought up the Aegis' short history. I need to remind some people that there was a time that the Destroyer armor was also looked upon under the same light that the Aegis is looked upon now. What's changed? Well history, and I have no doubt that if the Aegis ever returns on the scene, that it too will likely suffer a defeat or two.

I'm willing to bet that after a prolonged battle with Rune King Thor, and his vast array of powers, that we would see the Aegis defeated. after all who no sells Mangog with ease?

This team should win by proxy on the strength of actually having histories, but not just that, but by comparing them to other characters with long running histories, and their ability to easily outshine very powerful opponents with ease.

Yeah but CA's shield was made by humans and adamantium. The EA was made by Darkseid and is made from the stuff an Abstract is made of.

No one doubts KT power. But the EA resisted the power of the Quintessence, a bunch of Skyfathers, it also was used to channel the combined power needed to open a BoomTube to the end of time and the OE.

I would Rank Galactus higher then KT but that's a matter of taste.

I don't know, but G was clearly superior to Odin. Odin did well with his headbut don't get me wrong but G was more annoyed then anything else.

Was KT harmed? By what and who? The AE's offense was powerful enough to stop the tendrils from Warworld, something others couldn't do.

The Destroyer was made by a Skyfather, so I would still rank it a little below the EA. And the problem is, the EA won't return, not the original, thanks to Flashpoint. Maybe it should be banned in discusssions.

I think the EA would triumph. The way it was treated by the Quintessence and proved invulnerable to anything Skyfatherlevel beings used against it. However, a guy like Galactus would be able to take it apart.

Maybe.

I think this is really getting ridiculous. I'm finding it quite hard to believe EA could win this.

Is there really a scan where the EA tanked the combined attack of the quintessence?

In the link posted above (Galan's respect thread of Imperiex). The EA armor creates a force field capable of blocking an attack from the Quintessence.

I don't see any attacks by the quintessence there

Looks like the last scans there.

Originally posted by Golgo13
Looks like the last scans there.

where exactly here?

http://s1180.photobucket.com/albums/x402/galanpics/?action=view&current=ea5.jpg

http://s1180.photobucket.com/albums/x402/galanpics/?action=view&current=ea6.jpg

So lava is their combined attack?

Yeah, that's what Galan said in the respect thread. It doesn't look all that uber, but EA is pretty powerful from all those scans. It's basically RKT vs EA. Entropy Rift will KO everyone else.

How will the Entrophy Rift KO Kuurth and Voidsentry? Have they been Ko'd by that before?

Also has EA ever resisted matter manipulation before?

Seeing as EA dealt with Doomsday, I'd say yes. RKT is the only problem, IMO.

Originally posted by Golgo13
Seeing as EA dealt with Doomsday, I'd say yes. RKT is the only problem, IMO.

Doomsday =/= Kuurth or Voidsentry

Regular Juggernaut has been flayed to the bone before and wasn't ko'ed the least or regenerated.

Well, has Void or Kuurth survived an entropy rift?

Originally posted by Golgo13
Well, has Void or Kuurth survived an entropy rift?

Have they ever been killed by an entropy rift?

Cause if they haven't encountered such there is no way of proving they survive or get killed.

Which pretty much trashes:

"Entrophy Rift = auto death" since it can't be proven both ways.

Meanwhile Juggernaut-Kuurth has a proven susceptible only to getting his Cytorrak boon stolen by colossus...

Or that Sentry has came back from anything that has killed him whenever he felt like it...

I think an ER would do Void plenty of harm, but that's just my opinion. A basic energy attack would probably not do anything.

I think the argument that Void/Kuurth could somehow survive entropy--a force that even in Marvel has slagged Celestials-- is a bit specious. Neither has been exposed to it, but I think one would have a much more difficult time arguing they they would survive where their superiors have not than the reverse.

Originally posted by Harbinger
I think the argument that Void/Kuurth could somehow survive entropy--a force that even in Marvel has slagged Celestials-- is a bit specious. Neither has been exposed to it, but I think one would have a much more difficult time arguing they they would survive where their superiors have not than the reverse.

The Celestial got taken before by Sue's forcefield attacks. Exitar "physical body" got killed but it is stated he is not dead.

That doesn't really say much about Celestial physical invulnerability.

Are we even 100% sure Reed killed the guy totally. If so why didn't he just supply the future foundation of entropy guns?

team

Entropy is the single most destructive force in DC-- it is essentially DC's version of nullification.

No one on the team can survive a blast from the ultimate nullifier, just like they cannot survive an entropy rift.

yup



silly day for me

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Yeah but CA's shield was made by humans and adamantium. The EA was made by Darkseid and is made from the stuff an Abstract is made of.

No one doubts KT power. But the EA resisted the power of the Quintessence, a bunch of Skyfathers, it also was used to channel the combined power needed to open a BoomTube to the end of time and the OE.

I would Rank Galactus higher then KT but that's a matter of taste.

I don't know, but G was clearly superior to Odin. Odin did well with his headbut don't get me wrong but G was more annoyed then anything else.

Was KT harmed? By what and who? The AE's offense was powerful enough to stop the tendrils from Warworld, something others couldn't do.

The Destroyer was made by a Skyfather, so I would still rank it a little below the EA. And the problem is, the EA won't return, not the original, thanks to Flashpoint. Maybe it should be banned in discusssions.

I think the EA would triumph. The way it was treated by the Quintessence and proved invulnerable to anything Skyfatherlevel beings used against it. However, a guy like Galactus would be able to take it apart.

Maybe.


Etrigan is a Sky Father?

OK the Aegis wins, there is no power in all of comics that could possibly defeat it, because it has infinite power, and durability. So in this one case let's waive the no limits fallacy. I wonder how that armor was shaped, if it couldn't be affecting by any force in the universe, but whatever there's no need to delve too deeply into that small matter. Oh and how was the armor procured if it was impossible to be damaged?

Originally posted by Sixth_Winged
Are we even 100% sure Reed killed the guy totally. If so why didn't he just supply the future foundation of entropy guns?
Because Hickman is a moron and it shows in his "writing".

Originally posted by Galan007
Entropy is the single most destructive force in DC-- it is essentially DC's version of nullification.

No one on the team can survive a blast from the ultimate nullifier, just like they cannot survive an entropy rift.

Nullification? Who has it nullified to draw a comparison with the UN?

Originally posted by Sixth_Winged
Nullification? Who has it nullified to draw a comparison with the UN? Universes.

Kuurth solos

Originally posted by Galan007
Universes.

Universes =/= people.

There are also exorbitant amounts of powerups, artifacts and beings who wield enough power to destroy universe, so that probably might not be best draw to cite Entropy's supremacy against all other attacks in the DCU or other multiverse.

Originally posted by Sixth_Winged
Universes =/= people. Any on panel? Entropy erasing multiple universes in their entirety is all the proof I need that it is DC's equivalent of Marvel's nullification. If you're trying to downplay a force of that magnitude, then go right ahead. Maybe someone else will indulge that kind of... durness. I can't/won't be bothered with it.

Originally posted by Galan007
Entropy erasing multiple universes in their entirety is all the proof I need that it is DC's equivalent of Marvel's nullification. If you're trying to downplay a force of that magnitude, then go right ahead. Maybe someone else will indulge that kind of... durness. I can't/won't be bothered with it.

Nah i'm just trying to gauge it's potency and credibility as "single most destructive force" in dcu.

Can't recall it being used on abstracts or skyfathers who might be able to fight back it's effect to draw a comparison.

Meanwhile the UN has been used to nullify the embodiment of destruction.. an actual abstract.

If Thor spins his hammer to redirect whatever AE dishes, you guys reckon it won't backfire because of entropy blast's stature?

Just wondering

Has Thor ever redirected a universal destroying blast?

Originally posted by Golgo13
Has Thor ever redirected a universal destroying blast?

Can EA fire a universal destroying blast?

Keep in mind to achieve power enough to destroy DCU Imperiex went through all kinds of planets siphoning them for a powerup to jumpstart it.

And a measly probe with some apokolitan enhancement somehow has more than Prime at the time?

Even in Marvel , entropy has serious power . In Hickman's run on Fantastic Four ,in the future the Heat Death of the Universe(a state of entropy) caused all reality to collapse into a single timestream and go terminal . It taxed adult Frank's power to the point that he was sweating just to hold up his own pocket reality in that white space where all other timelines were collapsing . And ultimately he had to let go and make a run for it along with Valeria .

The Silver Surfer defeated two Proemial Gods by channeling the power of the Big Crunch through himself . The Crunch , based on modern scientific theory , is little more than the universe in an expanded state of entropy .

Unless and until magic can somehow grant resistance to the effects of entropy , I don't see any feasible way in which the team can win here .

Ooh fortunately, Silver Surfer is on his thread..

then does that mean he'll solo?

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Even in Marvel , entropy has serious power . In Hickman's run on Fantastic Four ,in the future the Heat Death of the Universe(a state of entropy) caused all reality to collapse into a single timestream and go terminal . It taxed adult Frank's power to the point that he was sweating just to hold up his own pocket reality in that white space where all other timelines were collapsing . And ultimately he had to let go and make a run for it along with Valeria .

The Silver Surfer defeated two Proemial Gods by channeling the power of the Big Crunch through himself . The Crunch , based on modern scientific theory , is little more than the universe in a very high state of entropy .

Unless and until magic can somehow grant resistance to the effects of entropy , I don't see any feasible way in which the team can win here .

AE is seriously powerful.

Originally posted by Sixth_Winged
Ooh fortunately, Silver Surfer is on his thread..

then does that mean he'll solo?
Surfer had to be in the Crunch to channel its power . He almost got killed doing it . That was just natural entropy .

I don't know whether such a maneuver can be pulled off on a weaponized application of entropy as the Aegis armor represents .

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Surfer had to be in the Crunch to channel its power . He almost got killed doing it . That was just natural entropy .

I don't know whether such a maneuver can be pulled off on a weaponized application of entropy as the Aegis armor represents .

But he channeled it, and that means he can redirect it as well.

Keep in mind unlike AE blasts, those "natural entropy" are constant in the background and not some timely spurts.

Also didn't realize there's a difference between natural and whatever AE fires honestly?

Originally posted by Sixth_Winged
But he channeled it, and that means he can redirect it as well.

Keep in mind unlike AE blasts, we those "natural entropy" are constant in the background and not some timely spurts.

Also didn't realize there's a difference between natural and whatever AE fires honestly?
That's because the AE is already using entropic energies int this thread . When the Surfer channeled the Crunch through his body , nobody was wresting with him over its control . And he was almost killed during the process itself(unless I am mis-remembering) .

EA would annihilate Surfer. Just like he did to Superman.

Originally posted by Golgo13
EA would annihilate Surfer. Just like he did to Superman.

So Superman can redirect entropy now? Cause you apparently Silver Surfer can.

AE is just too much. Even for Surfer.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
That's because the AE is already using entropic energies int this thread . When the Surfer channeled the Crunch through his body , nobody was wresting with him over its control . And he was almost killed during the process itself(unless I am mis-remembering) .

Oh really, well then has Imperiex or Aegis entropy has wrestled control of one of his blasts from a would be manipulator?

Does he have any onpanel feat that makes you guys think he can control it once he fires it?

EA can control all energies (as seen in the respect thread). Surfer would be no match.

Originally posted by Sixth_Winged
Oh really, well then has Imperiex or Aegis entropy has wrestled control of one of his blasts from a would be manipulator?

Does he have any onpanel feat that makes you guys think he can control it once he fires it?
I am not going to continue going in circles regarding this issue . The Surfer almost got killed by being within the Crunch alone(that's how it happened apparently) . The AE , based on its design alone , handles entropic energies on a daily basis .The Aegis wins .

AE takes it.

I have three questions.

1. How does entropy affect someone outside of the influence of death on a physical level.

2. Was Rune King Thor immortal in the true sense? If so why would entropy affect him or Zeus for that matter?

Same way/reason nullification would kill them.

Originally posted by Galan007
Same way/reason nullification would kill them.


But entropy is more or less meant to rot, or age correct? I don't recall the exact issue, but I believe that Thor resisted an entropic touch due to his ability to live for a very long time. It began to weaken him, but it took time. Zeus may not be affected at all, and as the Rune King, Thor's long life may have been become even longer. Nullification has a completely different meaning to it, which is to erase. Is there a possibility that these two may resist entropic forces as immortals?

Originally posted by Stoic
But entropy is more or less meant to rot, or age correct? I don't recall the exact issue, but I believe that Thor resisted an entropic touch due to his ability to live for a very long time. It began to weaken him, but it took time. Zeus may not be affected at all, and as the Rune King, Thor's long life may have been become even longer. Nullification has a completely different meaning to it, which is to erase. Is there a possibility that these two may resist entropic forces as immortals?

Entropy is a reorganization of energy, or everything in the universe. Thats what it does, for a higher purpose. It is not disorder or rot. No force can resist entropy.

Originally posted by kevdude
Entropy is a reorganization of energy, or everything in the universe. Thats what it does, for a higher purpose. It is not disorder or rot. No force can resist entropy.


I'm not sure what comic writers use the word for. In Marvel entropy was used in the sense of matter rotting away. One of the Exemplars had such a touch. But even before this, Thor was hit with entropic forces, and as i said earlier, he was able to resist it, due to his long lived life. I don't mind being wrong, I just had to question whether an immortal could resist forces that destroyed matter on the level, that it was suggested to do in the couple of comics that I read. You get me?

Originally posted by Stoic
I'm not sure what comic writers use the word for. In Marvel entropy was used in the sense of matter rotting away. One of the Exemplars had such a touch. But even before this, Thor was hit with entropic forces, and as i said earlier, he was able to resist it, due to his long lived life. I don't mind being wrong, I just had to question whether an immortal could resist forces that destroyed matter on the level, that it was suggested to do in the couple of comics that I read. You get me?

Some people view it as rotting away while some don't, some view Entropy as change measuring the dispersal of energy or the amount of change in the system. Haven't seen Thor survive entropic forces, but I doubt he would survive given how AE and Imperiex was perceived.

http://entropysite.oxy.edu/entropy_isnot_disorder.html

Galan i don't believe you

You don't have to believe me, but at least believe DC.

Gay boy.

Nice Galan. Here is some more! Entropy is linked from the Beginning of Time to the End and its power is felt everywhere!

http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/9950/image187s.th.jpg

The universe is born old from its release!

http://img834.imageshack.us/img834/5979/image188hk.th.jpg

The universe losing potentially billions of years of life as it floods the early universe.

http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/5159/image186q.th.jpg

Originally posted by Galan007
Now that we know the real world definition, lets look at what entropy has done in the fictional world of comics.

"This destructive force is working its way back through the timestream--simultaneously wiping out time and space.":
http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/13118452_3.jpg

"It seems that entire segments of time--and the universe--are being destroyed.":
http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/13118454_4.jpg

"All-consuming, destructive entropy has been unleashed, crushing every shred of matter in existence.":
http://s4d2.turboimagehost.com/t/13118380_1.jpg

"The entire universe ceases to exist. All energy is gone. There are no witnesses alive, no one to tell the tale.":
http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/13118373_2.jpg

Time, space, matter, energy... Reality itself. Erased on a universal+ scale by entropy. If that isn't equivalent to Marvel's nullification, then I don't know what is.

So yeah, no one on the team is tanking entropy. Sorry.

Sorry about that man, got really busy. Anyways I can dig it.

Cool beans.

Originally posted by Stoic
I'm not sure what comic writers use the word for. In Marvel entropy was used in the sense of matter rotting away. One of the Exemplars had such a touch. But even before this, Thor was hit with entropic forces, and as i said earlier, he was able to resist it, due to his long lived life. I don't mind being wrong, I just had to question whether an immortal could resist forces that destroyed matter on the level, that it was suggested to do in the couple of comics that I read. You get me?
Thor does a lot sh1t he isn't supposed to do . But anyways , during Galactus' first encounter with the Mad Celestials , the radiation leaking out from their battle caused an entire Kree armada to make a run for it .

Yet during a similar battle on Earth , the human witnesses were watching it as if it was an action-packed movie in an amphitheater .

Comic book inconsistencies are common , and they often suck .

Entropy Aegis takes it 10/10, the only real threat is Rune Thor