Ending Damnation

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Oneness

Mindship
Thought Barrier.

"Fate, it seems, is not without a sense of irony."
-- Morpheus

Bentley
Except if sensitivity is born from hierarchizing information and it's a part of all kinds of matter, not just organic one. Then you're pretty much phucked.

There is some irony about you talking about ending damnation by enacting massive extinction. That would be a fitting end to human damnation indeed.

Mindship
Originally posted by Bentley
Except if sensitivity is born from hierarchizing information and it's a part of all kinds of matter, not just organic one. mass/density : gravity :: material complexity : consciousness ?

Oneness
Originally posted by Bentley
Except if sensitivity is born from hierarchizing information and it's a part of all kinds of matter, not just organic one. Then you're pretty much phucked.

There is some irony about you talking about ending damnation by enacting massive extinction. That would be a fitting end to human damnation indeed. Cyberspace is like New Jerusalem.

Let's look at it that way. Heaven on earth, The Kingdom. Another realm, a virtual realm where thoughts materialize.

One's stream of continuity is not broken through cybertization, they slowly drift into nirvana. In that state I'd cease to be human, you'd cease to be human, but we would forever after be empathetic, emotional, living souls. More so than ever, more emotional, more elevated. No hedonic capital, no reason to get our heads out of the clouds, no ability to harm one another or be harmed by anything short of entropy. Given ample time we may even be sophisticated enough to avert that natural disaster. As technology with no biological needs and no ability to age, we will easily be able to escape our solar system long before any cosmological threat becomes that.

We'll be able to spread ourselves throughout a vast enough space to avert the reverse entropy our collective processing power produce as it heats space itself. Yet when the cosmos undergoes entropy googol of years from now we may condense that processing power to avert it.

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Bentley
Originally posted by Oneness
In that state I'd cease to be human

Yes, it's called death.

Oneness
Originally posted by Bentley
Yes, it's called death. No death. You're around throughout the whole thing. Gaining access to all accumulated knowledge, instead of googling it it's just there. You can be anywhere on the planet, in everything, in a virtual reality, long before it's over.

With nanites as blood that can store upward of 400 times more oxygen than a red blood cell, one could sprint all out for 15 minutes before the limbs get damaged, one could go diving without the aid of a scuba for 5 hours. One could survive any heart attack or blood clot without medical aid.

The brain is the last organ to be cybertized.

It's perfect, as a cyber-spatial species we don't need light-speed, we can survive for the thousands of years it would take to travel far to another solar system to escape the inevitable destruction of this one. On another world we'd rebuild everything and continue to increase in intellectual complexity. A process of survival that could be sustained indefinitely.

Oneness
Carbon nanotube proteins would make for excellent muscles, more electricity could be processed through these immensely stronger nerves - a better muscular response, muscle fibers that can resist more pressure and that are impervious to wear and tear. The heart would operate on a higher level for a thousand years, pumping nanite blood cells that all provide more oxygen, lungs powered by these cybernetics could regenerate within minutes. Bones composed of carbon buckeyballs would offer excellent structural support and integrity, because muscles like these would reduce normal bones to dust when you're leaping tall buildings in a single bound so to speak.

Bentley
Originally posted by Oneness
No death. You're around throughout the whole thing. Gaining access to all accumulated knowledge, instead of googling it it's just there. You can be anywhere on the planet, in everything, in a virtual reality, long before it's over.

With nanites as blood that can store upward of 400 times more oxygen than a red blood cell, one could sprint all out for 15 minutes before the limbs get damaged, one could go diving without the aid of a scuba for 5 hours. One could survive any heart attack or blood clot without medical aid.

The brain is the last organ to be cybertized.

It's perfect, as a cyber-spatial species we don't need light-speed, we can survive for the thousands of years it would take to travel far to another solar system to escape the inevitable destruction of this one. On another world we'd rebuild everything and continue to increase in intellectual complexity. A process of survival that could be sustained indefinitely.

Without delving too much into the technical aspect of your fascination, nothing about such form points towards giving up desire, if anything you're painting gluttonous machines that are eager to survive no matter what and that are just physically unable to feel desire. If they don't have desire to leave, don't be surprised when they shut themselves down.

Oneness
Originally posted by Bentley
Without delving too much into the technical aspect of your fascination, nothing about such form points towards giving up desire, What, I thought you were arguing against that notion?

That's the primary notion I've ever argued for all along in this thread.

Originally posted by Bentley
if anything you're painting gluttonous machines that are eager to survive no matter what and that are just physically unable to feel desire. If they don't have desire to leave, don't be surprised when they shut themselves down.

Oh. They're able to feel any physical desire in VR. More so than a human can physiologically experience. Without the need for a separate entity to get involved with the experience one entity chooses to engage in a fraction of a moment, such as thousand perfect human lifetimes filled with everything a human could ever experience, except that which is bad. Love, adventure, thrill-seeking, exploration, learning, all over again. Of course extreme mitigation of cognitive awareness and processing power, aka the splintering of said super-intellect, to create an illusory stupor and the systems interacted with (gravity, oxygen, sunlight, companions, etc).

As I said, a mind in cyberspace can undeniably do anything you can imagine and more.

Oneness
As I said, a mind in cyberspace can undeniably do anything you can imagine and more. All processing power of this new robotized society is shared completely. The hedonic capital is stupendous, and culminated with inhuman capacity. It's liberated from the structural restraints of biology in every form.

Actually, as processing power is increased and the space needed to generate such processing power is reduced, it would be more practical to scatter about the cosmos (to avoid obliteration by reverse-entropy) as nearly atom-sized structures (femtotechnology) too minute to be destroyed by supernovae from a good enough distance (the force of the blast would be nothing but FTL propulsion) calculating routes based on astrological phenomenons (main propulsion source) to scatter about everywhere. Black holes are the only objects to be avoided in these routes, at least direct contact, something that small would have to get pretty deep into event horizon, they'd need to be dangerously close (not quite as close as the light trapped beyond the event horizon) to the rapidly spinning singularity of the black hole to use as an orbital sling-shot because of how infinitesimally massed these structures are.

Bentley
Well, instead of arguing about the details about your narrative, I would like to know what made you feel this belonged to the religion forums.

Oneness
Originally posted by Bentley
Well, instead of arguing about the details about your narrative, I would like to know what made you feel this belonged to the religion forums. Hedonic capital is present in all religions, in some form or another. As is eternal life, the never-ending continuity of consciousness after death. This thread proposes a more sci-fi oriented depiction of that element in particular.

On my profile page I have also constructed a sci-fi oriented hypothetical way in which they all could be correct about all-powerful deities which I would describe as conscious hyper-cosmological abstractions, existing within a hyper-cosmological construct in and of itself (as it pertains to the level of their cosmos' astrophysical complexity resultant from additional strings/dimensional structures). 3D cosmologies may be both constructional and astrophysical phenomenons within them may be very movable (like Chess pieces) as well, by a singular sentient mind or a group of sentient minds.

I'd fairly recently developed the super beings as deities notion, but that passion was even more recently reignited by Interstellar and once more became an addition to my user page.

Oneness
Originally posted by Oneness
*************On my profile page I have also constructed a sci-fi oriented hypothetical way in which religions could be correct about the existence and intentions of all-powerful deities which I would describe as conscious hyper-cosmological abstractions, existing within a hyper-cosmological construct in and of itself (as it pertains to the intensity of their cosmos' astrophysical activity resultant from additional strings/greater dimensional complexity). That all cosmologies may be constructional and astrophysical phenomenons within them may be very movable (like Chess pieces) as well, by a singular sentient mind or a group of sentient minds.*************

Mindship
Thought barrier, Oneness. The more you think/write, the stronger it gets.

Oneness
Originally posted by Mindship
Thought barrier, Oneness. The more you think/write, the stronger it gets. You need to understand some of the things I've gone through, as a victim.

These couple people went through some horrors before they passed away. I watch those in full screen with the volume turned up, tried as hard as I could to be there. I watched them enough times I think I can empathize.

Now, with what happens to me, with God's mark upon me, my fate, my pattern. I'd rather be either other one of those men than have gone through what I've had go through and what I will always have to live with.

Do you understand?

After a certain point - the thought barrier begins running very slowly and can't keep up as well as with, say, Einstein, Isaac Newton, Wolfgang Von Goethe, you, inimalist, Digi, the smartest most heavy-thinkers...

I am telling you I am emotionally distraught and euphoric from one moment to the next because every amount pleasure must be bought by an equal and opposite amount of pain. If I were to have my toil supplemented by Christ's relatively measly melancholy in the way he was executed compared to some of the things that have worked victimized me in my life. Bearing the sins of men maybe has fruit. I know things are about to get worse, and I will be forced into immorality before my time is done here.

I'll give you a hint as to what I deal with; love is this sick game.

Oneness
Right now, I am a bit shaken up, but that self-loathing will turn into a euphoric rush in a moment. It's the only thing that works, I fall into abysmal demoralization and it's a more euphoric high than marijuana.

I promise that because of my miserable fortune I've become bold to change it and that doesn't work, that oppressive force in nature better check itself, it gets ahead of itself with me, it better check and see what toll it has already taken, much less continue to push. I will get up and Murphy's law will be supplanted, certain things.will never happen again.

Mindship
Originally posted by Oneness
I'll give you a hint as to what I deal with; love is this sick game. Broken heart?

Stoic
Originally posted by Oneness
No death. You're around throughout the whole thing. Gaining access to all accumulated knowledge, instead of googling it it's just there. You can be anywhere on the planet, in everything, in a virtual reality, long before it's over.

With nanites as blood that can store upward of 400 times more oxygen than a red blood cell, one could sprint all out for 15 minutes before the limbs get damaged, one could go diving without the aid of a scuba for 5 hours. One could survive any heart attack or blood clot without medical aid.

The brain is the last organ to be cybertized.

It's perfect, as a cyber-spatial species we don't need light-speed, we can survive for the thousands of years it would take to travel far to another solar system to escape the inevitable destruction of this one. On another world we'd rebuild everything and continue to increase in intellectual complexity. A process of survival that could be sustained indefinitely.

Are you on drugs? Take your head of of the clouds, and think about what something like that would cost. The US government gave a rough figure of how much a single person is worth, and it was roughly 1 million dollars. Do you have any idea how much something like what you suggest would cost? What about the risks of it not working? What corporate entity would fund something of this scope?

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Stoic
Are you on drugs? Take your head of of the clouds, and think about what something like that would cost. The US government gave a rough figure of how much a single person is worth, and it was roughly 1 million dollars. Do you have any idea how much something like what you suggest would cost? What about the risks of it not working? What corporate entity would fund something of this scope?

thumb up

Oneness
Originally posted by Mindship
Broken heart? There's no romance out there, for most of us there's only compromise and death. Romance is an illusory cascade of circumstances in which God does not seem to want to supply to everyone.

I'm having to model at a caliber of making a living at this point just to get girls to dance on me when I get out.

She was taken though.

Oneness
And she was drunk, BoT

Originally posted by Stoic
Are you on drugs? Take your head of of the clouds, and think about what something like that would cost. The US government gave a rough figure of how much a single person is worth, and it was roughly 1 million dollars. Do you have any idea how much something like what you suggest would cost? What about the risks of it not working? What corporate entity would fund something of this scope?

As if the society we live in weren't already empiracally demonstrated to be obsolete: a scientific fact I'm afraid. This issue is building autonomous cities where nothing costs more than a few cents, not even homes.

I'm thinking the pending doom of Strong AI would prompt us to demolish and rebuild anew.

Of course you wouldn't implant artificial neurons if they don't work or kill their host.

Oneness
Originally posted by Stoic
Are you on drugs?In my life I've done two.

The two popular common ones, not like Peyote and Heroine (which I hope to somehow get my hands on through my divine influence and try once in my lifetime), I think you can guess.

Mindship
Originally posted by Oneness
I'm having to model at a caliber of making a living at this point just to get girls to dance on me when I get out.

She was taken though. A broken heart hurts like hell, but like a broken arm, it heals. That's what living things do. And afterwards, you will be stronger and wiser for it.

Don't overplay the maudlin card.

Stoic
Originally posted by Oneness
And she was drunk, BoT



As if the society we live in weren't already empiracally demonstrated to be obsolete: a scientific fact I'm afraid. This issue is building autonomous cities where nothing costs more than a few cents, not even homes.

I'm thinking the pending doom of Strong AI would prompt us to demolish and rebuild anew.

Of course you wouldn't implant artificial neurons if they don't work or kill their host.

The religious institutions would not allow such a thing to come to pass. If it even worked, what would be left of the original person? What about biological rejection? Are you suggesting that nanites would be incorporated into a human body? The body would see the artificial mini bots as a disease, and attempt to destroy them wouldn't it? This isn't like a sci fi movie, or a comic book where someone decided that they're going to graft super powers onto themselves with no consequences. Since you placed this in the religious section and not the general discussion section, you must have realized that the church would never go for it. Research costs money, and although you believe that you've covered that minor obstacle by saying that houses, and other very expensive items cost a penny, I can assure you that something of this scope would cost trillions or more.

What happens when you crash your car, and it is damaged beyond what it is worth? Let me tell you. The insurance company will give you another car, and scrap the old one. This is the same thing that would happen here.

As I said in my other post, the US government placed a price on a human life, and it was given roughly one million dollars. What you suggest would cost far more than this, and as such would not be cost efficient. If something like what you say could work, it would likely happen over a long period of time, and we would probably never see the final product in our life time.

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Stoic
The religious institutions would not allow such a thing to come to pass. If it even worked, what would be left of the original person? What about biological rejection? Are you suggesting that nanites would be incorporated into a human body? The body would see the artificial mini bots as a disease, and attempt to destroy them wouldn't it? This isn't like a sci fi movie, or a comic book where someone decided that they're going to graft super powers onto themselves with no consequences. Since you placed this in the religious section and not the general discussion section, you must have realized that the church would never go for it. Research costs money, and although you believe that you've covered that minor obstacle by saying that houses, and other very expensive items cost a penny, I can assure you that something of this scope would cost trillions or more.

What happens when you crash your car, and it is damaged beyond what it is worth? Let me tell you. The insurance company will give you another car, and scrap the old one. This is the same thing that would happen here.

As I said in my other post, the US government placed a price on a human life, and it was given roughly one million dollars. What you suggest would cost far more than this, and as such would not be cost efficient. If something like what you say could work, it would likely happen over a long period of time, and we would probably never see the final product in our life time.

Ya, he never deals with the "what if it doesn't work" point. I don't think it will ever work, and if it did, it would be the wrong thing to do.

Oneness
Originally posted by Mindship
A broken heart hurts like hell, but like a broken arm, it heals. That's what living things do. And afterwards, you will be stronger and wiser for it.

Don't overplay the maudlin card. No, I'm not like you.

I have a manic condition, separation anxiety culminated with obsession. I'm under close-watch, my privacy has been compromised for this obsession, and at any moment I could go from control to uncontrolled.

Do you understand? If I could just have what I want...

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Oneness
... If I could just have what I want...

So say we all...

Oneness
Originally posted by Stoic
The religious institutions would not allow such a thing to come to pass. If it even worked, what would be left of the original person? What about biological rejection? Are you suggesting that nanites would be incorporated into a human body? The body would see the artificial mini bots as a disease, and attempt to destroy them wouldn't it?

Not necessarily.



You don't know what you're talking about, where are your credentials to stack up against those of Ray Kurzweil's?

More pennies?

Doubtful, we're talking about an infrastructure up to date with modern technological and scientific capacity, not at all like the fossil we live in.

Village Construction Set is scientific, it was an experiment, it was tried and tested.

Do you know how cheap mass production was in WWII when the US was pushed to produce fighters at low cost?? It was unmatched production even in today's world.

You're beyond your depth in this subject. The wastefulness and inefficiency of this society is my specialty. We waste everything just to maintain a beyond dead status-quo because we don't know anything else. Or, we're not conscious of the possibilities we have. Nothing is forcing us to explore them.

We are beginning to give computers singularity power, the power to procreate through introspective redesign. If a computer has greater intellectual and cognitive resources, which they are beginning to in an increasing number of ways, it will be able to make itself better at a quicker rate than our engineers can make it better. When that happens we lose control and will have to improve our minds to remain relevant, and to do that we need a civilization that uses everything available. Sorry money and inequality, you're gone when that happens, when we're forced to take an introspective look at the systems we're maintaining, and finally decide to abandon them, demolish them, for a more efficient infrastructure.

It's already all over, it just hasn't happened yet.

Oneness
I

Oneness
I am the foremost authority on your future, and I say **** yo cash nigga.

We all need the bread without the bullshit. Soon, we will all get a piece for free.

Oneness
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Ya, he never deals with the "what if it doesn't work" point. I don't think it will ever work, and if it did, it would be the wrong thing to do. A) we don't have neuron-sized mechanical structures

B ) neurons fire off through chemical reactions, technologically electronics don't work that way, but nano-electronics=/=electronics

C) Everything is possible, and if it's possible there eventually will be a form of nano-technology capable of replacing every function of the human body down to the molecule, at an exponential level of superiority when culminated - in fact, there won't need to be other organs once the mind gets cybernated, because then it doesn't need any structure but a circuit board and the cybernetic mind can go from nanite to circuit board, then its in everything on earth, all the technology at once.

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Oneness
A) we don't have neuron-sized mechanical structures

B ) neurons fire off through chemical reactions, technologically electronics don't work that way, but nano-electronics=/=electronics

C) Everything is possible, and if it's possible there eventually will be a form of nano-technology capable of replacing every function of the human body down to the molecule, at an exponential level of superiority when culminated - in fact, there won't need to be other organs once the mind gets cybernated, because then it doesn't need any structure but a circuit board and the cybernetic mind can go from nanite to circuit board, then its in everything on earth, all the technology at once.

Even if something is possible, it isn't always the right thing to do.

Oneness
Honestly, the femtotechnology I described earlier is even more far-fetched. None of this is more far-fetched than creating enough dark matter to warp space for the only possible FTL space-craft. Technically, FTL space travel is far less feasible than immortality.

Our existence may be providential. Isn't merit of the afterlife in religion something to be considered?

The only thing that fits with what religions describe as the afterlife, the continuation of the soul after physical destruction, would be this artificial neuron conversion in a very scientific, astrophysical way.

Oneness
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Even if something is possible, it isn't always the right thing to do. As beings birthed out of a survival setting, it is our purpose to survive as living souls by all means necessary. One transcendent man can replicate a wholly natural human existence in VR, and there'd be no difference from the real thing. So all that is really happening is we're adding to what we have in a completely natural way. If it weren't natural then it wouldn't be inevitable.

We'll see what happens, wink.

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Oneness
As beings birthed out of a survival setting, it is our purpose to survive as living souls by all means necessary. One transcendent man can replicate a wholly natural human existence in VR, and there'd be no difference from the real thing. So all that is really happening is we're adding to what we have in a completely natural way. If it weren't natural then it wouldn't be inevitable.

We'll see what happens, wink.

You are assuming there is a soul. What if there wasn't a soul, and humans are only the sum of our parts. That would been that we would not continue, but a machine that thought is was us would. Sounds like a bad sy fy.

Oneness
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
You are assuming there is a soul. What if there wasn't a soul, and humans are only the sum of our parts. That would been that we would not continue, but a machine that thought is was us would. That's all a guy is from day to day, a guy like me, here in his mold. The difference is I can't necessarily have satisfactory experiences, no matter what I do, regrets still threaten me, and I'm destructible. In fact, as a human in today's world, the only thing he has is the promise that he can be harmed, and I believe the only thing keeping me alive right now is the control I have, the control to end it where I want and how I want.

Oneness
In revelations the true nature of heaven and of hell was explained.

That everyone who is dead now and, and those of us who will die before the second coming, are merely in purgatory awaiting the judgement of a God.

God as us, us past femtotechnology, past this momentary cosmological state, when we can create a universe and step beyond it. Beyond the linear.

Mindship
Originally posted by Oneness
No, I'm not like you.

I have a manic condition, separation anxiety culminated with obsession. I'm under close-watch, my privacy has been compromised for this obsession, and at any moment I could go from control to uncontrolled.

Do you understand? If I could just have what I want...
1. Do you have an official diagnosis?
2. Who evaluated you (ie, a psychiatrist, a psychologist), and how?
3. Taking meds?

Oneness
Originally posted by Mindship
1. Do you have an official diagnosis?
2. Who evaluated you (ie, a psychiatrist, a psychologist), and how?
3. Taking meds? 1. Yes
2. Don't see a shrink, but it was the psychiatrist
3. For what, if I wasn't separated I wouldn't have anxiety. If I'm obsessed, than that's natural and to subvert that is to subvert who I really am.

Oneness
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
So say we all... Here's a montra for you.

I get what I want and every force in the universe stacked up against me would fail miserably and after the universe fails to stop me I'll strip the prideful in that coalition of their dignity and will to live and after I've wrecked the egos of the most potent adversaries, I will make an example out of them in their already demoralized state, I will make it worse for them, with chains that I attach

All after getting what I want despite the resistance put up by what I want

Never sacrifice a part of yourself, a lesson Jesus failed to learn, never accept what you're given only what you take, a lesson Buddha failed to learn.

I would follow in the foot steps of Alexander of Macedonia and Genghis Khan, instead of Jesus and Buddha. Only that the success is exclusive to me, and all should benefit if that's what I'd want. If I have all that I set out to take, then I'd of course be automatically in a state of mind to do nothing but that which is altruistic and beneficial to everyone else. If I'm safe and well I'll love my fellow human, if I'm hungry and endangered I will stab my fellow human in the back and eat that person, lest I starve.

In this way my victory will be ensured, because whatever God may be would want all people to be helped, It should go to extreme lengths to ensure my unfulfilled desires are all met at haste. Or else it will have made a foe it cannot conquer.

If God is a failure in this, or not attached enough, than I must assume Its role. For I'm superior merely because I want absolution, because I'm a totalitarian in my hedonism and God is about balance. The balance will fade just like everything else. Not even balance can escape death, but I can. I'm something new, something novel, I guess you could say that I'm something hedonistic. Something that'd be eternally unmatched in ability.

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