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*H2H only
*No BFR
*No heat vision from Zod/No flight

Fight takes place on neutral ground

Kurse breaks him.

This is going to be one loooong fight. I'm leaning a bit toward Zod due to speed but Kurse also doesn't seem to feel pain. Don't know...

Despite Zod losing powers here, he'd win.

Originally posted by Robtard
Despite Zod losing powers here, he'd win. Based on ?

By reading the Op.

Zod is stronger, he makes shockwaves with his punches and he's much faster than Kurse too. Kurse gets dummied before he knows he's even in a fight.

Speed kills.

If this is Zod from MOS movie then their is definitely a chance of him losing. All he did in MOS was get his butt kicked. If this is Reeves Zod then Kurse dies.

Originally posted by relentless1
Zod is stronger, he makes shockwaves with his punches and he's much faster than Kurse too. Kurse gets dummied before he knows he's even in a fight. Based on ?

Originally posted by Kazenji
By reading the Op. Zod loses even harder here.

Originally posted by relentless1
Zod is stronger, he makes shockwaves with his punches and he's much faster than Kurse too. Kurse gets dummied before he knows he's even in a fight.

What leads you to believe Zod is stronger than Kurse?

Even if so (I disagree), that still doesn't for Kurse being seemingly more durable

Strength advantage is questionable. Thor was strong enough to block a hit from the Hulk and even turn Hulk 360 with a punch. He was completely helpless against Kurse. Also, other than a blackhole grenade we're not sure what it takes to end Kurse. He took an elven blade straight through and didn't seem like it was bothering him. On the other hand, we know Zod's neck can be snapped.

So I give durability to Kurse. Fighting skill to Kurse as well. Strength is a toss up. Speed and mobility to Zod. I do believe Kurse can land a few hits on Zod, considering Zod isn't exactly QS fast and Kurse was able to slap away Mjolnir. Whether those few hits are enough to take out Zod is the question.

Right now, I say Zod 6/10.

OP says no flight, so Zod doesn't really have a speed or mobility advantage.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Strength advantage is questionable. Thor was strong enough to block a hit from the Hulk and even turn Hulk 360 with a punch. He was completely helpless against Kurse. Also, other than a blackhole grenade we're not sure what it takes to end Kurse. He took an elven blade straight through and didn't seem like it was bothering him. On the other hand, we know Zod's neck can be snapped.

So I give durability to Kurse. Fighting skill to Kurse as well. Strength is a toss up. Speed and mobility to Zod. I do believe Kurse can land a few hits on Zod, considering Zod isn't exactly QS fast and Kurse was able to slap away Mjolnir. Whether those few hits are enough to take out Zod is the question.

Right now, I say Zod 6/10.

It is evident that the MCU intended Hulk to be physically stronger than Thor. Thor's strength is not showcased like it is in the comics. From onscreen feats, we can see Thor's punches are not hard enough to send Hulk flying, like Abomination and Hulkbuster Iron Man did. Thir is no weakling. He's stronger than Iron Man, but weaker than Hulk and Kurse.

As for Kurse vs Zod, it is evident that Zod is above Thor in strength based on feats. I don't know if Zod will win, but it will last a while and Kurse will be taken off his feet several times.

Originally posted by Tattoos N Scars
It is evident that the MCU intended Hulk to be physically stronger than Thor. Thor's strength is not showcased like it is in the comics. From onscreen feats, we can see Thor's punches are not hard enough to send Hulk flying, like Abomination and Hulkbuster Iron Man did. Thir is no weakling. He's stronger than Iron Man, but weaker than Hulk and Kurse.

As for Kurse vs Zod, it is evident that Zod is above Thor in strength based on feats. I don't know if Zod will win, but it will last a while and Kurse will be taken off his feet several times.

I know Hulk is stronger than Thor. But Thor was able to block Hulk's hammer punch (though with difficulty) and was strong enough to spin Hulk around with a punch. That's still a pretty good strength showing. My point was, he was unable to do any of those stuff with Kurse, which is what makes me rate Kurse stronger than Hulk, which is why I'm unsure who's stronger between Kurse and Zod.

Originally posted by Silent Master
OP says no flight, so Zod doesn't really have a speed or mobility advantage.

Prior to his flight, Zod was jumping around and crawling on building somewhat like Hulk, which is why I gave him mobility advantage.

Though come to think of it, did Zod ever display any speed feats that weren't him flying? I know Faora had some speed feats minus flying but can't remember Zod doing any.

I think Kurse will win due to attrition. Zod's gonna be whoopin his for awile unless he catches a backhand like something thats faster and more durable than he is did. Then his little floppy neck that Kryptonian super soldiers apparently get might get damaged. I love how Zod mentioned twice that soldiers were made for fighting and then promptly get beatdown by a scientist and a person who had been in one fight their entire life.

So Kurse>kryptonian bum>janitor>farmer>scientist> super elite soldier.

One is a stoic, well disciplined death machine that doesent need to get in a hurry.. The other one is a complete emotional wreck that cant focus on his fights.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Prior to his flight, Zod was jumping around and crawling on building somewhat like Hulk, which is why I gave him mobility advantage.

Though come to think of it, did Zod ever display any speed feats that weren't him flying? I know Faora had some speed feats minus flying but can't remember Zod doing any.

Fair enough.

I don't remember any either.

Originally posted by ShadowFyre
I think Kurse will win due to attrition. Zod's gonna be whoopin his for awile unless he catches a backhand like something thats faster and more durable than he is did. Then his little floppy neck that Kryptonian super soldiers apparently get might get damaged. I love how Zod mentioned twice that soldiers were made for fighting and then promptly get beatdown by a scientist and a person who had been in one fight their entire life.

So Kurse>kryptonian bum>janitor>farmer>scientist> super elite soldier.

One is a stoic, well disciplined death machine that doesent need to get in a hurry.. The other one is a complete emotional wreck that cant focus on his fights.

Zod is way faster on land, he doesnt need flight to outmaneuver.. this is evident by proxy in Faoras example..also he is a very skilled hand to hand combatant.. he's a bred soldier, even though Jor El got the upper hand on him you could see him bust out some moves at the beginning of MOS..Kurse doesnt have any finesse like that.

"Feats" are not interchangeable. You cannot give Zod Faora's showings.

Originally posted by relentless1
Zod is way faster on land, he doesnt need flight to outmaneuver.. this is evident by proxy in Faoras example..also he is a very skilled hand to hand combatant.. he's a bred soldier, even though Jor El got the upper hand on him you could see him bust out some moves at the beginning of MOS..Kurse doesnt have any finesse like that.

You're aware that Zod and Faora are two different people, right?

Zod got outfought by a scientist and a farmer. Kurse outfought the top fighter of Asgard. Makes it pretty clear who was a better fighter.

It's going to be one long ass fight, they both have pretty insane durability. The main issue is that it was never established what it actually toke to damage Kurse to a significant degree, likewise Zod didn't get a single scracth from being beaten around the city by Superman. The main difference to me is that Zod seemed (again to me) stronger then Kurse, so in the end I see Zod outlasting Kurse rather then the other way around. But it's close and could really imo go either way.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Zod got outfought by a scientist and a farmer. Kurse outfought the top fighter of Asgard. Makes it pretty clear who was a better fighter.


Zod was also outright by Jor El. Zod was an inept villain. He was awful IMO.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
"Feats" are not interchangeable. You cannot give Zod Faora's showings.

Originally posted by Silent Master
You're aware that Zod and Faora are two different people, right?


That's kind of silly logic IMO.

There's no reason to think Zod wouldn't have similar running speed to Faora. In fact Zod's Kryptonian powers clearly advanced beyond hers by the end of the movie.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
That's kind of silly logic IMO.

There's no reason to think Zod wouldn't have similar running speed to Faora. In fact Zod's Kryptonian powers clearly advanced beyond hers by the end of the movie.

You mean other than the fact that Zod never once was shown to have her level of running speed?

Originally posted by Darth Thor
That's kind of silly logic IMO.

There's no reason to think Zod wouldn't have similar running speed to Faora. In fact Zod's Kryptonian powers clearly advanced beyond hers by the end of the movie.

Rules. "Feats" are not interchangeable. Posted a mod ruling by Bada about this before already IIRC.

Originally posted by Utrigita
It's going to be one long ass fight, they both have pretty insane durability. The main issue is that it was never established what it actually toke to damage Kurse to a significant degree, likewise Zod didn't get a single scracth from being beaten around the city by Superman. The main difference to me is that Zod seemed (again to me) stronger then Kurse, so in the end I see Zod outlasting Kurse rather then the other way around. But it's close and could really imo go either way.

Don't know what you're talking about. It took a blackhole grenade to take out Kurse. It took a neck snap to take out Zod.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Don't know what you're talking about. It took a blackhole grenade to take out Kurse. It took a neck snap to take out Zod.

Do you have any idea what the punches from Zod is going to do to Kurse? Because based on the movie and what it toke to damage Kurse I don't. Likewise I have no idea what Kurse punches are going to do to Zod when Supermans punches failed to do any form of damage. Furthermore Kurse didn't at any single point of time grapple with Thor, he pounded him, I have no reason to think based on the way Kurse fight that he is going to go for a RNC.

Originally posted by Silent Master
You mean other than the fact that Zod never once was shown to have her level of running speed?

Originally posted by Nibedicus
Rules. "Feats" are not interchangeable. Posted a mod ruling by Bada about this before already IIRC.



That's a Strange rule IMO. I guess on this board Yoda or Sidious can't sprint as fast as Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon do at the beginning of TPM then.

Usain Bolt and Kevin Nash are both humans, can Usain's running feats be used for Kevin?

Originally posted by Silent Master
Usain Bolt and Kevin Nash are both humans, can Usain's running feats be used for Kevin?

thats not even a good analogy, kryptonians all have the same power set, THIS was established rather clearly in the movie, russell crowe had a huge speech about it. Besides that Zod has several moments where he shows off his speed. When he and Superman start their final battle Zod blitzes him three times.

Yeah that is a bad analogy. Not saying Faora can't necessarily run faster than Zod, but it's obvious Zod could also run at those kind of super speeds.

Originally posted by relentless1
thats not even a good analogy, kryptonians all have the same power set, THIS was established rather clearly in the movie, russell crowe had a huge speech about it. Besides that Zod has several moments where he shows off his speed. When he and Superman start their final battle Zod blitzes him three times.


Then by all means post the scenes where Zod shows off his running speed.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Yeah that is a bad analogy. Not saying Faora can't necessarily run faster than Zod, but it's obvious Zod could also run at those kind of super speeds.

Then post the scenes where Zod runs at super speed.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Do you have any idea what the punches from Zod is going to do to Kurse? Because based on the movie and what it toke to damage Kurse I don't. Likewise I have no idea what Kurse punches are going to do to Zod when Supermans punches failed to do any form of damage. Furthermore Kurse didn't at any single point of time grapple with Thor, he pounded him, I have no reason to think based on the way Kurse fight that he is going to go for a RNC.

Kurse going for a RNC is a lot more probable than Zod pulling out an elven sword or blackhole grenade.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Kurse going for a RNC is a lot more probable than Zod pulling out an elven sword or blackhole grenade.

Not based on how Kurse chose to engage Thor. Kurse used his fists to pummel Thor, the only time I recall them being just semi close to a grappling scenario was when Kurse picked up Thor only for Thor to engaged Kurse in a glanching blow match with Kurse completely thrashing Thor as a result. For Kurse to suddenly try and grap his opponent to try and snap his neck with a RNC, will, imo be Kurse fighting out of character. I personally see this, based on the way they fought on screen, being a blunt force match where both combatents will try and beat the other into submission and that can take quite a while, based on the damage they can tank. But to each his own.

Well, to be honest, the fight between the two was poorly done and Chris Yost was there. I mean, Thor didnt try lightning or anything. But as soon as malefic comes around next fight theyre doing MOS like things. Destroying massive steel and concrete pillars.

Anyway, my point is, we did not get an extensive look into how Kurse fights except that one scene really. Its not like a rear naked choke is some ancient lost kung fu move or something. Im sure after awhile they would give up punching each other if it wasnt working.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Not based on how Kurse chose to engage Thor. Kurse used his fists to pummel Thor, the only time I recall them being just semi close to a grappling scenario was when Kurse picked up Thor only for Thor to engaged Kurse in a glanching blow match with Kurse completely thrashing Thor as a result. For Kurse to suddenly try and grap his opponent to try and snap his neck with a RNC, will, imo be Kurse fighting out of character. I personally see this, based on the way they fought on screen, being a blunt force match where both combatents will try and beat the other into submission and that can take quite a while, based on the damage they can tank. But to each his own.

Dude, seriously, how difficult do you think a rear naked choke or neck snap is? It's not like a super secret move that requires endless years of training. Anyone can do it given the right positioning and strength. Besides, you really think Kurse who is thousands of years old won't know how to do such a simple maneuver?

ANd like I said (which is something you're not addressing), Kurse doing a neck snap is more plausible than Zod bringing out a blackhole grenade.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Then by all means post the scenes where Zod shows off his running speed.



Then post the scenes where Zod runs at super speed.

dunno how to post scenes but heres the link:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HnAw3E_mLh8

Originally posted by FrothByte
Dude, seriously, how difficult do you think a rear naked choke or neck snap is? It's not like a super secret move that requires endless years of training. Anyone can do it given the right positioning and strength. Besides, you really think Kurse who is thousands of years old won't know how to do such a simple maneuver?

ANd like I said (which is something you're not addressing), Kurse doing a neck snap is more plausible than Zod bringing out a blackhole grenade.

That is not at all what I'm saying. I'm saying that based on the way Kurse fights the chances of him using or trying to apply a RNC are in my eyes nonexistant. That thousand years of experience was limited to beating the living snot out of Thor. Hence I base my assesment of this particular fight on the way that Kurse approches his fight with Thor and that is like a boxer, and a boxer doesn't suddenly use a RNC, just like Kurse didn't a single time in his fight with Thor use a single hold, beyond when he lifted Thor from the ground.

You disagree and think Kurse will win by applying a RNC and snap Zods neck? Cool, I just think that is a gross neglect of the ways both characters have shown to fight on panel. But w/e.

Originally posted by relentless1
dunno how to post scenes but heres the link:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HnAw3E_mLh8

I don't see any Faora like running speed, however as I'm watching from my phone its possible that I missed it. If you'll list the exact time it happens in the clip, I'll take another look.

Originally posted by Utrigita
That is not at all what I'm saying. I'm saying that based on the way Kurse fights the chances of him using or trying to apply a RNC are in my eyes nonexistant. That thousand years of experience was limited to beating the living snot out of Thor. Hence I base my assesment of this particular fight on the way that Kurse approches his fight with Thor and that is like a boxer, and a boxer doesn't suddenly use a RNC, just like Kurse didn't a single time in his fight with Thor use a single hold, beyond when he lifted Thor from the ground.

You disagree and think Kurse will win by applying a RNC and snap Zods neck? Cool, I just think that is a gross neglect of the ways both characters have shown to fight on panel. But w/e.

I'm saying choking out someone or snapping someone's neck is not something you need training for. You can train to mak yourself more efficient at it, but no person is incapable of doing it given proper position and strength.

So, I think it's ridiculous to think that Kurse won't utilize it given an opportunity. Kurse is not fightinh under boxing rules. A better argument would be whether Kurse will have the opportunity to apply a RNC given Zod's speed.

Originally posted by FrothByte
I'm saying choking out someone or snapping someone's neck is not something you need training for. You can train to mak yourself more efficient at it, but no person is incapable of doing it given proper position and strength.

So, I think it's ridiculous to think that Kurse won't utilize it given an opportunity. Kurse is not fightinh under boxing rules. A better argument would be whether Kurse will have the opportunity to apply a RNC given Zod's speed.

Which I'm not at all going to disagree on. I'm disagreeing with the mindset of Kurse and his willingness to apply it. And as already mentioned I see that as non existant, based on his performance against Thor and his avenue of attack.

I on the other hand think it ridiculous to assume Kurse will use something that he has never shown any form of willingness to utilize on panel in a fight. The speed is another question all together.

But again, we have entirely different views on how this fight will pan out, which is cool.

Originally posted by Silent Master

Then post the scenes where Zod runs at super speed.


I can't. Just like I can't show Palpatine or Mace Windu sprinting as fast as Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan do in TPM.

@ Silent Master, he runs at super speed when he blitzes clark right at the beginning and displays super speed yet again when they both charge at each other right after that and again when he charges up the side of the building at Superman

Originally posted by Darth Thor
I can't. Just like I can't show Palpatine or Mace Windu sprinting as fast as Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan do in TPM.

its in the vid i posted; Zod charging at Superman at super speed

Originally posted by Darth Thor
I can't. Just like I can't show Palpatine or Mace Windu sprinting as fast as Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan do in TPM.

Are you unable to post the scene because you can't find it on youtube. Or because it doesn't exist?

Originally posted by Darth Thor
I can't. Just like I can't show Palpatine or Mace Windu sprinting as fast as Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan do in TPM.

Both Qui-Gon and Obi Wan used the same power, at the same time, the same way, the skill does not seem to be unique in style and nature to the specific persons. Qui-Gon taught Obi Wan the same way as Dooku taught Qui Gon and Yoda taught Dooku. It is not unreasonable to assume that the skills were passed down between master and student. Unless you think QG invented force speed. But rules are rules. I think it comes down to if both sides of a debate wants to consider certain exceptions to the rule due to reasonable logic (as above).

However, Faora fought differently from Kal-El (and had an obvious speed difference as Kal) and she's def much faster than Nam Ek. They each fought differently in the movie and Zod had a crap ton of chances to showcase his speed in his fight with Kal And he did (as relentless pointed out, he did a pretty fast bullrush at the start of his fight with Kal El). Just not nearly the same blinding speed as Faora. He rushed pretty fast, tho (based on the video above, about 25 feet within a second, 0:23-0:24 exactly).

I'd say about as fast as a flying Thor or Mjolnir. More or less.

Originally posted by Utrigita
That is not at all what I'm saying. I'm saying that based on the way Kurse fights the chances of him using or trying to apply a RNC are in my eyes nonexistant. That thousand years of experience was limited to beating the living snot out of Thor. Hence I base my assesment of this particular fight on the way that Kurse approches his fight with Thor and that is like a boxer, and a boxer doesn't suddenly use a RNC, just like Kurse didn't a single time in his fight with Thor use a single hold, beyond when he lifted Thor from the ground.

You disagree and think Kurse will win by applying a RNC and snap Zods neck? Cool, I just think that is a gross neglect of the ways both characters have shown to fight on panel. But w/e.

To be fair, Kurse was face grabbing the Asgardian guards at their assault on Asgard and burning their faces. That's a form of grapple.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
Both Qui-Gon and Obi Wan used the same power, at the same time, the same way, the skill does not seem to be unique in style and nature to the specific persons. Qui-Gon taught Obi Wan the same way as Dooku taught Qui Gon and Yoda taught Dooku. It is not unreasonable to assume that the skills were passed down between master and student. Unless you think QG invented force speed. But rules are rules. I think it comes down to if both sides of a debate wants to consider certain exceptions to the rule due to reasonable logic (as above).

However, Faora fought differently from Kal-El (and had an obvious speed difference as Kal) and she's def much faster than Nam Ek. They each fought differently in the movie and Zod had a crap ton of chances to showcase his speed in his fight with Kal And he did (as relentless pointed out, he did a pretty fast bullrush at the start of his fight with Kal El). Just not nearly the same blinding speed as Faora. He rushed pretty fast, tho (based on the video above, about 25 feet within a second 0:23-0:24 exactly).

I'd say about as fast as a flying Thor or Mjolnir.

I'll check the bullrush scene after work when I can watch it on a full screen. But relentless1 was wrong about Zod running up the building.

Originally posted by Silent Master
I'll check the bullrush scene after work when I can watch it on a full screen. But relentless1 was wrong about Zod running up the building.

Yeah, good idea. He's not always accurate with these things sometimes. But from what I saw, he covered the distance pretty well.

He fights differently from Faora, tho. Nowhere near the same finesse. Usually just bullrushing forward.

yeah he's definitely not as graceful but he's still just as fast, Zods speed clamouring up the side of the building was on par with Supermans flying towards him so id say that counts

Originally posted by Nibedicus
To be fair, Kurse was face grabbing the Asgardian guards at their assault on Asgard and burning their faces. That's a form of grapple.

Looking at it on a bigger monitor, the bullrush scene looks more like a super-powered lunge/forward jump and not running.

Zod was bear crawling up that wall pretty fast. Havent seen that fight in about a year but if i were to hazard a guess i would say bout 50-60 mph but I could be way off. Anybody got a gif of that by chance.

Originally posted by relentless1
yeah he's definitely not as graceful but he's still just as fast, Zods speed clamouring up the side of the building was on par with Supermans flying towards him so id say that counts

Nope. Faora was much faster as her movement was blinding fast and very precise.

Again, he does NOT have any of Faora's speed showings. Different kinds of speeds. All he's shown is the ability to leap forward fast and to fly fast. That is all.

Originally posted by ShadowFyre
Zod was bear crawling up that wall pretty fast. Havent seen that fight in about a year but if i were to hazard a guess i would say bout 50-60 mph but I could be way off. Anybody got a gif of that by chance.

Actually did the math for that and you're a little off.

Here is the clip:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HnAw3E_mLh8

From the ff. timestamps:

(2:02) looks like the building had about 8 segments with each segment containing 5 stories (thus 40 stories) it also looks like Zod cleared 9 stories on his initial leap upwards.

(2:03-2:05) Zod did 4 lunges in this space of time.

(2:08) Looks like Zod is about 4 segments from reaching the top.

Assuming 1 story is 3 meters (floors in this building look rather short IMO).

From this observation alone, one can ascertain:

Tha Zod cleared 11 stories (40 - 9 (cleared by jump) - 20 (position at 2:08) ) within 5 seconds (2:03-2:08) or 11/5 or 2.2 story per second.

2.2 story per second x 3 meters/story = 6.6m/s or 23.76kph or 14.85mph

Bear in mind this was done because he was (from visual observation) clearing about 1 story per lunge, not because he was moving his limbs very fast. From just counting, he did 4 lunges in a little over 2 seconds. Which about correlates with my math above.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
To be fair, Kurse was face grabbing the Asgardian guards at their assault on Asgard and burning their faces. That's a form of grapple.

He did? I don't recall that at all, but cool.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
Actually did the math for that and you're a little off.

Here is the clip:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HnAw3E_mLh8

From the ff. timestamps:

(2:02) looks like the building had about 8 segments with each segment containing 5 stories (thus 40 stories) it also looks like Zod cleared 9 stories on his initial leap upwards.

(2:03-2:05) Zod did 4 lunges in this space of time.

(2:08) Looks like Zod is about 4 segments from reaching the top.

Assuming 1 story is 3 meters (floors in this building look rather short IMO).

From this observation alone, one can ascertain:

Tha Zod cleared 11 stories (40 - 9 (cleared by jump) - 20 (position at 2:08) ) within 5 seconds (2:03-2:08) or 11/5 or 2.2 story per second.

2.2 story per second x 3 meters/story = 6.6m/s or 23.76kph or 14.85mph

Bear in mind this was done because he was (from visual observation) clearing about 1 story per lunge, not because he was moving his limbs very fast. From just counting, he did 4 lunges in a little over 2 seconds. Which about correlates with my math above.

A real life peak human can run twice as fast as that.

But his feat may not be as slow as it appears, you need to keep in mind a few things:

- he is working against gravity. You could probably work out how fast he was accounting for this as well.

- He seems to be accelerating, as his final lunge appears to cover a larger distance.

Originally posted by Placidity
A real life peak human can run twice as fast as that.

But his feat may not be as slow as it appears, you need to keep in mind a few things:

- he is working against gravity. You could probably work out how fast he was accounting for this as well.

- He seems to be accelerating, as his final lunge appears to cover a larger distance.

Well, his strength made gravity much less of an issue, I reckon. And the lunge thing is more of a strength factor, as well. All in all, less a speed thing, more of a strength thing IMO.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
Actually did the math for that and you're a little off.

Here is the clip:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HnAw3E_mLh8

From the ff. timestamps:

(2:02) looks like the building had about 8 segments with each segment containing 5 stories (thus 40 stories) it also looks like Zod cleared 9 stories on his initial leap upwards.

(2:03-2:05) Zod did 4 lunges in this space of time.

(2:08) Looks like Zod is about 4 segments from reaching the top.

Assuming 1 story is 3 meters (floors in this building look rather short IMO).

From this observation alone, one can ascertain:

Tha Zod cleared 11 stories (40 - 9 (cleared by jump) - 20 (position at 2:08) ) within 5 seconds (2:03-2:08) or 11/5 or 2.2 story per second.

2.2 story per second x 3 meters/story = 6.6m/s or 23.76kph or 14.85mph

Bear in mind this was done because he was (from visual observation) clearing about 1 story per lunge, not because he was moving his limbs very fast. From just counting, he did 4 lunges in a little over 2 seconds. Which about correlates with my math above.

Thank you. That was pretty cool. Wow..thats...only 15 mph? I was pretty far off lol And im pretty sure real life humans only run like 115-24 mph. Never heard of a human that can run 30 mph

Originally posted by Nibedicus
Both Qui-Gon and Obi Wan used the same power, at the same time, the same way, the skill does not seem to be unique in style and nature to the specific persons. Qui-Gon taught Obi Wan the same way as Dooku taught Qui Gon and Yoda taught Dooku. It is not unreasonable to assume that the skills were passed down between master and student. Unless you think QG invented force speed. But rules are rules. I think it comes down to if both sides of a debate wants to consider certain exceptions to the rule due to reasonable logic (as above).

However, Faora fought differently from Kal-El (and had an obvious speed difference as Kal) and she's def much faster than Nam Ek. They each fought differently in the movie and Zod had a crap ton of chances to showcase his speed in his fight with Kal And he did (as relentless pointed out, he did a pretty fast bullrush at the start of his fight with Kal El). Just not nearly the same blinding speed as Faora. He rushed pretty fast, tho (based on the video above, about 25 feet within a second, 0:23-0:24 exactly).

I'd say about as fast as a flying Thor or Mjolnir. More or less.


Yeah that argument's fine. I was just arguing against the "can't ever interchange feats" rule, as that clearly would be silly in something like the Qui-Gon/Obi-Wan case.

Kind of like if Supergirl moved a Planet then it should go without saying that Superman can move a planet.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Yeah that argument's fine. I was just arguing against the "can't ever interchange feats" rule, as that clearly would be silly in something like the Qui-Gon/Obi-Wan case.

Kind of like if Supergirl moved a Planet then it should go without saying that Superman can move a planet.

Those are the rules, tho. And rules are rules. The specific example on the ruling stated (IIRC) if BRB smashes a planet, doesn't mean Thor can.

Not gonna argue on when the rules apply and when it does not, however.

I think certain arguments (like Voldemort being able to do basic spells performed by lower lvl wizards or Yoda being able to do what the student of his student did) are reasonable but, then again, if a mod says no. It's no.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Yeah that argument's fine. I was just arguing against the "can't ever interchange feats" rule, as that clearly would be silly in something like the Qui-Gon/Obi-Wan case.

Kind of like if Supergirl moved a Planet then it should go without saying that Superman can move a planet. We argue in character so it isn't even just about can they its about would they. You don't get to jump into the character and just use their powers. Come on man you should know better.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Yeah that argument's fine. I was just arguing against the "can't ever interchange feats" rule, as that clearly would be silly in something like the Qui-Gon/Obi-Wan case.

Kind of like if Supergirl moved a Planet then it should go without saying that Superman can move a planet.

It's varied in here and during the great original 'Star Wars Vs Harry Potter' thread many years ago Imp ruled that similar powered beings can use each other's powers within reason even if not shown.

eg Darth Maul could use Force-Choke as it's a Sith/Jedi power, even though he didn't explicitly use Force-Choke in TPM.

edit: just ask Imp for a ruling in here if you need, considering Zod has the same powers and he became more powerful/diverse than Faora

That's the thing... Bolt may be the fastest guy on earth... that doesn't mean he's the most agile, best reactions, best acceleration etc etc. Just like all humans are very similar at a biological level. The difference from person to person are very very minimal in the over all scene of physiology. That doesn't mean we all run the same speed, reaction at the same time. You have may a twin brother who's almost exactly like you in every way, that doesn't mean they have the same fighting speed.

You need to practice MOVING that fast and fighting at that speed. You need train your muscles to be able to respond at certain speeds and times. They are built up. Not everybody is born with fast twitch muscles fibers.. some are born with slow twitch. Point is, just because Faora was shown fighting at that speed with that skill level, doesn't mean Zod could. Doesn't work that way. With time and training, sure, but clearly not normally or he would have. He didn't.

Huh. One of the few times I actually agree with Kurupt.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
That's the thing... Bolt may be the fastest guy on earth... that doesn't mean he's the most agile, best reactions, best acceleration etc etc. Just like all humans are very similar at a biological level. The difference from person to person are very very minimal in the over all scene of physiology. That doesn't mean we all run the same speed, reaction at the same time. You have may a twin brother who's almost exactly like you in every way, that doesn't mean they have the same fighting speed.

You need to practice MOVING that fast and fighting at that speed. You need train your muscles to be able to respond at certain speeds and times. They are built up. Not everybody is born with fast twitch muscles fibers.. some are born with slow twitch. Point is, just because Faora was shown fighting at that speed with that skill level, doesn't mean Zod could. Doesn't work that way. With time and training, sure, but clearly not normally or he would have. He didn't.


Spot on, and lets be real. Zod showed almost 0 level of actual fighting "skill". Faora was obviously the most battle hardened out of the entire crew. Zod must have been born a 4 star general on Krypton to explain his lack of skill and his inability to keep his emotions in check. He had definitely never been any kind of frontline troop or anything.

Originally posted by Robtard
It's varied in here and during the great original 'Star Wars Vs Harry Potter' thread many years ago Imp ruled that similar powered beings can use each other's powers within reason even if not shown.

eg Darth Maul could use Force-Choke as it's a Sith/Jedi power, even though he didn't explicitly use Force-Choke in TPM.


That makes a lot more sense.

Depends on the scenario IMO.


With something like Force Lightning I'd understand, as that's a unique power which has only been displayed by people of a certain tier. But to say Maul can't use Force Suggestion because we didn't see him do that, knowing it's a basic power for Jedi/Sith, would be silly and a pretty worthless debate IMO.

Originally posted by ShadowFyre
Spot on, and lets be real. Zod showed almost 0 level of actual fighting "skill". Faora was obviously the most battle hardened out of the entire crew. Zod must have been born a 4 star general on Krypton to explain his lack of skill and his inability to keep his emotions in check. He had definitely never been any kind of frontline troop or anything. Zod was shit.

Lol. Zod got beat up by everybody that fought him. He was a terrible villain. Kurse would beat him too and I dont think it would even be close.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
That makes a lot more sense.

Depends on the scenario IMO.


With something like Force Lightning I'd understand, as that's a unique power which has only been displayed by people of a certain tier. But to say Maul can't use Force Suggestion because we didn't see him do that, knowing it's a basic power for Jedi/Sith, would be silly and a pretty worthless debate IMO.

Yeah, well I guess if using in character one could say Maul wouldnt use suggestion he would just kill them. But yeah, jedi/Sith/military etc all have "basics" and bootcamps and whatnot that if you dont pass or cant comprehend, ya dont get in correct? So whatever those basic skills that are included in the sith/jedi training courses are should automatically be assumed to be doable by any Sith/Jedi right?

I mean, if someone told you the were a Raider or Seal or SAS or whatever your going to automatically assume they are proficcient with an M16 or AK and are a damn good shot.

And I think arguing in character is stupid because writers never stick to another writers stuff. Look at how everyone in Asgard is acting right now, or Superman makin samiches for his boss. Theyre character always changes writer to writer.

Originally posted by tkitna
Lol. Zod got beat up by everybody that fought him. He was a terrible villain. Kurse would beat him too and I dont think it would even be close.


Robtard loved him as a villain.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Huh. One of the few times I actually agree with Kurupt.

It happens far more than you'd like to admit

Get a room you two

Originally posted by Robtard
Get a room you two Everything is sexual with you. Creep.

Originally posted by FrothByte
I know Hulk is stronger than Thor. But Thor was able to block Hulk's hammer punch (though with difficulty) and was strong enough to spin Hulk around with a punch. That's still a pretty good strength showing. My point was, he was unable to do any of those stuff with Kurse, which is what makes me rate Kurse stronger than Hulk, which is why I'm unsure who's stronger between Kurse and Zod.

And Thor hits did nothing to the Hulk compared to what Ironman buster and Abomination hits did. Do you admit that both of these people are far stronger than Thor?

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
That's the thing... Bolt may be the fastest guy on earth... that doesn't mean he's the most agile, best reactions, best acceleration etc etc. Just like all humans are very similar at a biological level. The difference from person to person are very very minimal in the over all scene of physiology. That doesn't mean we all run the same speed, reaction at the same time. You have may a twin brother who's almost exactly like you in every way, that doesn't mean they have the same fighting speed.

You need to practice MOVING that fast and fighting at that speed. You need train your muscles to be able to respond at certain speeds and times. They are built up. Not everybody is born with fast twitch muscles fibers.. some are born with slow twitch. Point is, just because Faora was shown fighting at that speed with that skill level, doesn't mean Zod could. Doesn't work that way. With time and training, sure, but clearly not normally or he would have. He didn't.

The problem with this is the difference between peak human and average human is actually not that large in the scheme of things.

For example, the fastest sprinter is "only" about 30% quicker than your average healthy man.

When someone like Faora moves at super-speed, she is going many orders of magnitude faster than Zod. If they have similar physiology, even if Faora specifically trained for speed, she still shouldn't be that much faster than a fellow kryptonian. And keep in mind, I really doubt Zod is your average Joe Kryptonian.

While I'm at it, I'd like to point out the false but common idea that super-speed runners aren't necessarily fast fighters as well. One false analogy is Usain Bolt is not necessarily a fast fighter even though he can run fast. As per above, Usain is only 30% faster. When we are talking about a super-speedster we are often talking about someone hundreds of times faster (speed of sound, speed of light etc). Running requires coordinated movement of arms and legs, if the speedster can move at the speed of sound, he sure as hell can "fight" fast, at least compared to anyone that is not close to his running speed.

Yet Zod has zero feats of running or fighting at superspeed.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Yet Zod has zero feats of running or fighting at superspeed.


Huh? You don't think Zod and Superman were fighting at superspeed when they were flying around Metropolis and into space?

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Huh? You don't think Zod and Superman were fighting at superspeed when they were flying around Metropolis and into space?

I think they were flying at superspeed.

Originally posted by Silent Master
I think they were flying at superspeed.


Ok, well looked to me like they were fighting at super speed. And not just flying.

Throwing punches while flying is hardly fighting at superspeed. I mean Iron-man can do that and he doesn't even have peak human reflexes/reactions.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Throwing punches while flying is hardly fighting at superspeed. I mean Iron-man can do that and he doesn't even have peak human reflexes/reactions.


I've not seen IM throwing punches at that level of speed. You could even see the sonic boom with the punches IIRC, meaning their punches were being thrown at super speed.


Plus they were obviously reacting to each other just fine at those speeds.

They were both flying at roughly the same speed, so them reacting to each other isn't that impressive and their ability to throw punches while flying around Mach 1 is more a strength feat than superspeed reactions.

If they had true superspeed reactions, how come they never used it while grounded?

Originally posted by Silent Master
They were both flying at roughly the same speed, so them reacting to each other isn't that impressive and their ability to throw punches while flying around Mach 1 is more a strength feat than superspeed reactions.





I think you're underselling how difficult it would be to fight at those speeds tbh. Especially when they were bull rushing each other, and flying at speeds well beyond the likes of Iron Man have ever fought at.


Originally posted by Silent Master


If they had true superspeed reactions, how come they never used it while grounded?


Well Superman did against machine gun fire and against Faora.

Instead of arguing it out indefinitely. Why not just post clips with timestamps with quantifications for said "feats"?

Ok:

?v=HnAw3E_mLh8


Zod seems to run at superspeed to bullrush Kal @ 1:30

Then their punches and blocks seem to be portrayed at superspeed in their H2H from 1:34-1:36 looking like they're leaving sonic boom discharges.

Then @ 1:37 Superman dodges Zod's punch which leaves lines depicting super speed.

Then again Zod looks like he runs superfast towards Supes at 1:50 and gives him 2 punches which both seem to be depicted as super speed punches.

I'll tell you straight, these depictions of combat at super speeds is a hell of a lot better than anything we ever get in SW, and that was all before Zod learned to fly mind you.

Then after the flying starts there's the bullrushing punches which at 3:04. Including Zod spinning Superman around at superspeed @ 3:35. This is all during combat. Never seen Iron Man even move at those speeds, let alone fight and punch e.t.c.

There's also the Faora fight which I'll post if further proof is needed of Superman fighting/reacting at super speed.

Originally posted by Placidity
The problem with this is the difference between peak human and average human is actually not that large in the scheme of things.

For example, the fastest sprinter is "only" about 30% quicker than your average healthy man.

When someone like Faora moves at super-speed, she is going many orders of magnitude faster than Zod. If they have similar physiology, even if Faora specifically trained for speed, she still shouldn't be that much faster than a fellow kryptonian. And keep in mind, I really doubt Zod is your average Joe Kryptonian.

While I'm at it, I'd like to point out the false but common idea that super-speed runners aren't necessarily fast fighters as well. One false analogy is Usain Bolt is not necessarily a fast fighter even though he can run fast. As per above, Usain is only 30% faster. When we are talking about a super-speedster we are often talking about someone hundreds of times faster (speed of sound, speed of light etc). Running requires coordinated movement of arms and legs, if the speedster can move at the speed of sound, he sure as hell can "fight" fast, at least compared to anyone that is not close to his running speed.


This post made LITERALLY no sense what so ever. In fact, the last paragraph was so all over the place, I don't even know the point you were trying to make.

Take a stance and back it up, don't try and claim you're contradicting my post, and then make no sense what so ever. What exactly are you claiming here?

The proof is in the pudding bud. Zod DIDN'T fight at that speed because he couldn't. Even if could, then he would have in the NUMEROUS opportunities he had to showcase it. He failed to do so, and in fact, was beat directly by speed and had no answer. If he was able to answer Superman's speed in their initial encounter, you'd like he would have, instead of getting his ass beat and mask destroyed.

As I said you are so all over the place I don't understand your point. You're acting like 30% isn't a significance difference, when in fact 30% could be exponentially superior when scaling up. I simply don't get this line of logic that 30% isn't significant, it most certainly is. Even to use your 30% and humans analogy... If Kryptonians can also vary by 30%, just like humans, than that would explain why she could and he couldn't. You in essence proved what I was saying.

Lastly, your theory that Bolt would be a super fast fighter is completely and totally false. So false, that I can tell you've never watched a combat sport in your life. Bolt is not even close to the fast accelerator in sprinting. In fact, he's average or slightly below average. What separates him is his top end speed and how long he can maintain said speed. That does he literally ZERO good in a cage. The speed that matters in a cage are fast twitch muscle fibers, reaction speed and agility... not top end speed. To even equate moving your arms really fast running, and then turn around and claim he can punch really fast is downright hilarious. I mean literally hilarious. They are usually TOTALLY different muscles for each activity.

I can promise you, that 99% of professional boxers can hit the speed bag faster than Bolt could. In fact, the figure is likely higher. They aren't using the same muscles, nor the same technique, nor does running require the hand eye coordination as fighting. They aren't close to the same. We saw this time and time again with pride. They would match up HUGE guys against small guys to show technique and training matters. They've had World Strongest Man winners compete in MMA and get absolutely embarrassed. Yet, they are likely 30% or more stronger than the average fighter, yet technique wins out. Bolt would not be a fast fighter nor would he move his hands any faster than boxer, in fact, he'd be slower.

I tried to address what you said, but to be honest, I can hardly make out what you were saying.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Ok:

?v=HnAw3E_mLh8


Zod seems to run at superspeed to bullrush Kal @ 1:30

Then their punches and blocks seem to be portrayed at superspeed in their H2H from 1:34-1:36 looking like they're leaving sonic boom discharges.

Then @ 1:37 Superman dodges Zod's punch which leaves lines depicting super speed.

Then again Zod looks like he runs superfast towards Supes at 1:50 and gives him 2 punches which both seem to be depicted as super speed punches.

I'll tell you straight, these depictions of combat at super speeds is a hell of a lot better than anything we ever get in SW, and that was all before Zod learned to fly mind you.

Then after the flying starts there's the bullrushing punches which at 3:04. Including Zod spinning Superman around at superspeed @ 3:35. This is all during combat. Never seen Iron Man even move at those speeds, let alone fight and punch e.t.c.

There's also the Faora fight which I'll post if further proof is needed of Superman fighting/reacting at super speed.

I don't think their punches were creating sonicbooms as much as they were creating shockwaves from the impact. Same way Hulk vs. Hulkbuster and Thor vs. Malekith were creating shockwaves.

But even if they were sonicbooms, they still weren't being done at super speed. The punches were thrown at regular speed, nothing super fast or anything. I mean, just look at them. Heck I've seen boxers throw faster punches. And it wasn't done in slow mo either. You can tell by the background: The cars are still falling at the same rate, the flames are still moving at normal rate, so we know it wasn't simply slowed down.


So yeah, all their punches were definitely thrown at regular speed, regardless of special sonicboom effects. I also don't see how Zod spinning Superman around looks like superspeed. I've seen figure skaters spin faster than that.

I think he meantb30 percent faster isnt significant when comparing to humans. And it would only be a few miles faster, whereba superhuman at 30 % faster would be like 60 miles fasterbor whatever.

Okay, but that is an irrelevant point. Nobody is claiming there isn't a difference between humans and super enhanced characters. The people we are comparing are both super powered being. One fought using super speed, the other did not. Clearly there is a difference in speed between the two. Whether be that she's just naturally faster, whether it's her training specifically for speed, it all is irrelevant why... she was simply faster than Zod for whatever reason you want to pick. The point is, he was essentially proving the point in claiming some humans are faster than others... whether it be 30% or 10%... the point I was making is, we aren't all born with the same ability. Even though we are almost identical physiologically speaking, there are still significant differences in performance from one person to the next. Clearly Kryptonians are very much the same way. Which again, would explain some talking.. some not, some using super speed some not, some seemingly being more intelligent than others... etc etc. It couldn't be made more clear than Kryptonians, like us, are almost different from person to person. Which again, is the point. Faora had super fighting speed, Zod did not.

Originally posted by FrothByte


But even if they were sonicbooms, they still weren't being done at super speed. The punches were thrown at regular speed, nothing super fast or anything. I mean, just look at them. Heck I've seen boxers throw faster punches. And it wasn't done in slow mo either. You can tell by the background: The cars are still falling at the same rate, the flames are still moving at normal rate, so we know it wasn't simply slowed down.





I mentioned that punch of Zod which Superman dodged at 1:37 left lines. Does that happen when a normal human punches? No. Which is why I'm saying the punches were "portrayed" to be at superhuman speed. Whether they actually speed up their punches in the cutting room is a different thing altogether.

For instance, in the Matrix you get slow movements and slow hits. Yet everything around them is moving in slow motion. So what does that mean? It means they won't show them moving at superhuman speeds, but they are portraying it to be at superhuman speeds.


Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
she was simply faster than Zod for whatever reason you want to pick.


Was she faster than Superman?

Originally posted by FrothByte
I don't think their punches were creating sonicbooms as much as they were creating shockwaves from the impact. Same way Hulk vs. Hulkbuster and Thor vs. Malekith were creating shockwaves.

But even if they were sonicbooms, they still weren't being done at super speed. The punches were thrown at regular speed, nothing super fast or anything. I mean, just look at them. Heck I've seen boxers throw faster punches. And it wasn't done in slow mo either. You can tell by the background: The cars are still falling at the same rate, the flames are still moving at normal rate, so we know it wasn't simply slowed down.


So yeah, all their punches were definitely thrown at regular speed, regardless of special sonicboom effects. I also don't see how Zod spinning Superman around looks like superspeed. I've seen figure skaters spin faster than that.

And you can tell from the things happening in the background that we are seeing the fight normally and not in "bullet-time".

Originally posted by Darth Thor
I mentioned that punch of Zod which Superman dodged at 1:37 left lines. Does that happen when a normal human punches? No. Which is why I'm saying the punches were "portrayed" to be at superhuman speed. Whether they actually speed up their punches in the cutting room is a different thing altogether.

For instance, in the Matrix you get slow movements and slow hits. Yet everything around them is moving in slow motion. So what does that mean? It means they won't show them moving at superhuman speeds, but they are portraying it to be at superhuman speeds.





Was she faster than Superman?

Of course, we saw that displayed in there fight. She literally clowned him with her speed. Sure he could fly, and ultimately used that advantage over her, but in straight h2h combat with no flying... she was clearly and decisively faster.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Of course, we saw that displayed in there fight. She literally clowned him with her speed. Sure he could fly, and ultimately used that advantage over her, but in straight h2h combat with no flying... she was clearly and decisively faster.


Was she?


Because at over here at 0:50:

?v=khKaUE9KV3A

Supes is fighting off both Nam-Ek and Faora simultaneously in H2H, and he blocks Faora's kick and puts her to the floor.


So did Supes suddenly become faster, Faora suddenly become slower? Unlikely. More likely Superman was just holding back in the 1 v 1, and getting caught off guard by Faora's ferocity.

Why are you guys arguing about Zods speed? Any Kyrptonian is faster than Kurse. This is a fact.

They are also all significantly stronger and likely more durable. Kurse wasn't tackling over skyscrapers or shown to be strong enough to hold up oil rigs, and he hasn't shown the durability to stand up to someone who could.

This is a flat out stomp for Zod. He ragdolls the shit out of Kurse until he's dust.

Im confused? Its pretty obvious that Faora, for whatever reasons is the fastest out of entire MOS and easily most skilled h2h in movie. Zod is obviously faster than a human but him and mos are not faora fast.

Originally posted by ShadowFyre
Im confused? Its pretty obvious that Faora, for whatever reasons is the fastest out of entire MOS and easily most skilled h2h in movie. Zod is obviously faster than a human but him and mos are not faora fast.


Are you saying she's faster by Krpytonian standards, or that's she's just on a different level of superhuman speed?

Originally posted by Darth Thor
I mentioned that punch of Zod which Superman dodged at 1:37 left lines. Does that happen when a normal human punches? No. Which is why I'm saying the punches were "portrayed" to be at superhuman speed. Whether they actually speed up their punches in the cutting room is a different thing altogether.

For instance, in the Matrix you get slow movements and slow hits. Yet everything around them is moving in slow motion. So what does that mean? It means they won't show them moving at superhuman speeds, but they are portraying it to be at superhuman speeds.




Of course Zod and Superman don't punch like normal humans, they're not. My point is, they were portrayed at regular speed and they weren't sped up or slowed down. You can see this by watching the background: Cars are still falling at regular speed, flames are still moving at regular speed, etc.

Which just goes to show that they weren't throwing punches at superspeed.

Originally posted by Arachnid1
Why are you guys arguing about Zods speed? Any Kyrptonian is faster than Kurse. This is a fact.

They are also all significantly stronger and likely more durable. Kurse wasn't tackling over skyscrapers or shown to be strong enough to hold up oil rigs, and he hasn't shown the durability to stand up to someone who could.

This is a flat out stomp for Zod. He ragdolls the shit out of Kurse until he's dust.

In no way shape or form is Zod more durable. That is simply laughable. One got his neck broken with seemingly utter ease. The other didn't seem to be the least bit bothered by any attack thrown his way, and it took a plot device to end him. Kurse is clearly more durable than Zod.

Zod doesn't use his speed that way though. He's not Faora. He basically fights like a brute. Kurse is vastly more skilled than Zod, and that seemed very apparent. Stronger... who's to say? Kurse was never required to life a thing. He was simply shown treating Thor like a weak feeb and being unfazed by any of his attacks. Maybe Zod's stronger, but it's nothing significant in my opinion.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Of course Zod and Superman don't punch like normal humans, they're not. My point is, they were portrayed at regular speed and they weren't sped up or slowed down. You can see this by watching the background: Cars are still falling at regular speed, flames are still moving at regular speed, etc.

Which just goes to show that they weren't throwing punches at superspeed.

Kurse was also able to slap away Mjolnir with his back turned. Quite a reflex feat. Not saying he's necessarily as fast as Zod but he's no slouch either.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Was she?


Because at over here at 0:50:

?v=khKaUE9KV3A

Supes is fighting off both Nam-Ek and Faora simultaneously in H2H, and he blocks Faora's kick and puts her to the floor.


So did Supes suddenly become faster, Faora suddenly become slower? Unlikely. More likely Superman was just holding back in the 1 v 1, and getting caught off guard by Faora's ferocity.

I would hardly use a scene where he's temporarily KO'd when fighting Faora and Nam as him "fighting them off" . They KO'd him, they were unfazed by any of his attacks sans his heat vision. Ferocity? She wasn't fighting the least bit ferocious. Fighting like that would mean going for the kill and not giving your foe a moment to breath. Here, at every turn, she's doing monologue while trouncing him. Hardly what I would call ferocious. She was simply faster and more skilled. Period, end of story.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
In no way shape or form is Zod more durable. That is simply laughable. One got his neck broken with seemingly utter ease. The other didn't seem to be the least bit bothered by any attack thrown his way, and it took a plot device to end him. Kurse is clearly more durable than Zod.

Zod doesn't use his speed that way though. He's not Faora. He basically fights like a brute. Kurse is vastly more skilled than Zod, and that seemed very apparent. Stronger... who's to say? Kurse was never required to life a thing. He was simply shown treating Thor like a weak feeb and being unfazed by any of his attacks. Maybe Zod's stronger, but it's nothing significant in my opinion. Your argument that Kurse is more durable than Zod hinges on the fact that Thor couldn't hurt him whereas, Superman was able to snap Zods neck. This doesn't take into account the fact that Thor is not as strong as Superman and hasn't shown the strength feats to suggest otherwise. Once Kurse survives an onslaught from someone whos Kryptonian level without injury, you can claim Kurse is more durable. Until then, he's not.

And yes, I agree that Faora is the fastest Kryptonian shown. Despite that, all of them were shown to be much quicker and more mobile while fighting than Kurse or Thor by a large margin.

As for who's stronger, yes Kurse wasn't shown to lift things, so we don't know his limits. That also means he has no strength feats. That means strength goes comfortably to Zod.

Going off of feats, Zod is more durable, quicker, and stronger. Zods wins.

Originally posted by Arachnid1
Your argument that Kurse is more durable than Zod hinges on the fact that Thor couldn't hurt him whereas, Superman was able to snap Zods neck. This doesn't take into account the fact that Thor is not as strong as Superman and hasn't shown the strength feats to suggest otherwise. Once Kurse survives an onslaught from someone whos Kryptonian level without injury, you can claim Kurse is more durable. Until then, he's not.

And yes, I agree that Faora is the fastest Kryptonian shown. Despite that, all of them were shown to be much quicker and more mobile while fighting than Kurse or Thor by a large margin.

As for who's stronger, yes Kurse wasn't shown to lift things, so we don't know his limits. That also means he has no strength feats. That means strength goes comfortably to Zod.

Going off of feats, Zod is more durable, quicker, and stronger. Zods wins.

Absence of proof isn't proof friend, and I know you already know that. He does have strength feats though and they are clearly defined. Hulk is every bit as strong as superman, in fact, likely stronger. Look no further than the back and forth fight they had in the Avengers. Thor was PHYSICALLY effecting Hulk time and time again. Whether that be with punches or his hammer. In one instance Thor's hammer through literally sent Hulk flying. In STARK contrast, Kurse treated Thor's hammer as if it was a toothpick and of no consequence. He literally swatted it away as if it was a flea. Shoot we even seen Thor lock up with Hulk and briefly stalemate him. Now, I'm not claiming Thor is as stronger but he's clearly in the ballpark of strength if he could compete with Hulk at almost every turn. Again, we're talking about somebody as strong, or stronger than Clark. Guess what, Kurse treated that same Thor, literally, and I mean literally like a weakling. That is the very definition of extrapolating strength. You're forgetting all of Thor's feats, and Kurse casually owning him at every turn speaks volumes about Kurse's prowess. You're underselling him here.

To go further, the crux of the argument doesn't hinge on Zod having his neck snapped. It hinges on Kurse no selling virtually ever one of Thor's attacks. Then when you factor in Thor's track record and feats, and still see Kurse treating him like he did and no selling attacks... it becomes blatantly apparent he's more durable than Zod. In fact, I would say it's a clear advantage for Kurse based on feats. Zod having his neck snapped in the coup de grace that reinforces the point, not the crux of the argument.

Originally posted by Arachnid1
Your argument that Kurse is more durable than Zod hinges on the fact that Thor couldn't hurt him whereas, Superman was able to snap Zods neck. This doesn't take into account the fact that Thor is not as strong as Superman and hasn't shown the strength feats to suggest otherwise. Once Kurse survives an onslaught from someone whos Kryptonian level without injury, you can claim Kurse is more durable. Until then, he's not.

And yes, I agree that Faora is the fastest Kryptonian shown. Despite that, all of them were shown to be much quicker and more mobile while fighting than Kurse or Thor by a large margin.

As for who's stronger, yes Kurse wasn't shown to lift things, so we don't know his limits. That also means he has no strength feats. That means strength goes comfortably to Zod.

Going off of feats, Zod is more durable, quicker, and stronger. Zods wins.

Not much can be shown regarding how tough Kurse is as he was never really hurt in the movie, but as strength goes, the Hulk couldn't stop Mjolnir's forward momentum with his own strength. Kurse swatted Mjolnir away like nothing.

They could fly pretty fast, yes. But flight is disabled in this scenario. And Kurse was able to react to a flying Thor AND a flying Mjolnir with his back turned and Zod never showed that any of his bullrushes exceeded Thor's or Mjolnir's flight speed IIRC. Ergo, he would be able to react to said bullrushes by swatting Zod away.

Zod might have shown more showings of durability against human skyscrapers and such as his fight with Kal was very give and take. Best I can remember for Kurse is when he blew up the Asgardian reactor and facetanked the whole explosion like nothing. Kurse has better damage soak tho and feels no pain (as he was skewered by a blade and didn't seem all that bothered by it).

Zod was portrayed as a horrible fighter, tho. Barely and tactics in how he fought. He essentially fought like a wild animal. Kurse fought with smarts. Separating his opponent from his primary weapon (and keeping said weapon away), maintained his advantage by keeping his opponent off balance and ground and pounded him for the win had Loki not interfered.

The fact that he was skewered by Loki's level of strength shows his durability is questionable, even if he didn't feel the pain and it didn't kill him

So while he may not die or even feel the pain from having an arm ripped off, but it could possibly be ripped off by someone of Zod's strength

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Absence of proof isn't proof friend, and I know you already know that. He does have strength feats though and they are clearly defined. Hulk is every bit as strong as superman, in fact, likely stronger. Look no further than the back and forth fight they had in the Avengers. Thor was PHYSICALLY effecting Hulk time and time again. Whether that be with punches or his hammer. In one instance Thor's hammer through literally sent Hulk flying. In STARK contrast, Kurse treated Thor's hammer as if it was a toothpick and of no consequence. He literally swatted it away as if it was a flea. Shoot we even seen Thor lock up with Hulk and briefly stalemate him. Now, I'm not claiming Thor is as stronger but he's clearly in the ballpark of strength if he could compete with Hulk at almost every turn. Again, we're talking about somebody as strong, or stronger than Clark. Guess what, Kurse treated that same Thor, literally, and I mean literally like a weakling. That is the very definition of extrapolating strength. You're forgetting all of Thor's feats, and Kurse casually owning him at every turn speaks volumes about Kurse's prowess. You're underselling him here.

To go further, the crux of the argument doesn't hinge on Zod having his neck snapped. It hinges on Kurse no selling virtually ever one of Thor's attacks. Then when you factor in Thor's track record and feats, and still see Kurse treating him like he did and no selling attacks... it becomes blatantly apparent he's more durable than Zod. In fact, I would say it's a clear advantage for Kurse based on feats. Zod having his neck snapped in the coup de grace that reinforces the point, not the crux of the argument. The absence of proof means the absence of feats. That puts the burden of proof on you, but that's impossible since you've already noted that those feats are absent. I'm definitely not trying to undersell Kurse. He's a beast, and likely one of the tops in the MCU so far. He just hasn't shown the feats to be considered above a Kyptonian.

Hulk wasn't holding up oil rigs or tackling over skyscrapers. His hits with the HB did make shockwaves, but nowhere near the level of shockwaves Supes and Zod colliding made. Thor also was not shown to be in the same ballpark strength wise. He's strong, but not enough to give Hulk a run in that stat. He won that fight due to significantly greater skill and superior fighting speed.

You're also trying to use A > B > C logic, which isn't valid here. Hulks strength feats don't translate to Thor, and they definitely don't translate to Kurse. That, combined with Kurses lack of feats, is kind of a death sentence when put into a fight with someone who does have feats.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
Not much can be shown regarding how tough Kurse is as he was never really hurt in the movie, but as strength goes, the Hulk couldn't stop Mjolnir's forward momentum with his own strength. Kurse swatted Mjolnir away like nothing.

They could fly pretty fast, yes. But flight is disabled in this scenario. And Kurse was able to react to a flying Thor AND a flying Mjolnir with his back turned and Zod never showed that any of his bullrushes exceeded Thor's or Mjolnir's flight speed IIRC. Ergo, he would be able to react to said bullrushes by swatting Zod away.

Zod might have shown more showings of durability against human skyscrapers and such as his fight with Kal was very give and take. Best I can remember for Kurse is when he blew up the Asgardian reactor and facetanked the whole explosion like nothing. Kurse has better damage soak tho and feels no pain (as he was skewered by a blade and didn't seem all that bothered by it).

Zod was portrayed as a horrible fighter, tho. Barely and tactics in how he fought. He essentially fought like a wild animal. Kurse fought with smarts. Separating his opponent from his primary weapon (and keeping said weapon away), maintained his advantage by keeping his opponent off balance and ground and pounded him for the win had Loki not interfered. Yeah, its true enough that Kurse has insane damage soak. He's kind of like Ajax in that regard. I can agree he doesn't feel pain, or at least doesn't care about.

Also, Kurse didn't stop the Hammer like Hulk tried to. He redirected it slightly. I wouldn't really count that as a strength feat. If he caught it and waved it around, I'd be impressed.

Also, I missed Zods flight being disabled here. Thats my bad. I should have paid more attention to OP. Despite that, I seem to remember him bounding pretty fast up the side of a building. He didn't have super speed for a good portion of that fight, but still kept up with someone who does, and could fly.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Ok:

?v=HnAw3E_mLh8


Zod seems to run at superspeed to bullrush Kal @ 1:30

Then their punches and blocks seem to be portrayed at superspeed in their H2H from 1:34-1:36 looking like they're leaving sonic boom discharges.

Then @ 1:37 Superman dodges Zod's punch which leaves lines depicting super speed.

Then again Zod looks like he runs superfast towards Supes at 1:50 and gives him 2 punches which both seem to be depicted as super speed punches.

I'll tell you straight, these depictions of combat at super speeds is a hell of a lot better than anything we ever get in SW, and that was all before Zod learned to fly mind you.

Then after the flying starts there's the bullrushing punches which at 3:04. Including Zod spinning Superman around at superspeed @ 3:35. This is all during combat. Never seen Iron Man even move at those speeds, let alone fight and punch e.t.c.

There's also the Faora fight which I'll post if further proof is needed of Superman fighting/reacting at super speed.

Sorry to tell you DT, but ambigious shockwave fx does NOT trump quantifiable actions/second calcs. That is essentially the entire basis of your argument above. Their actions were clearly within (or at best slightly above) human level speed if you go by actions/punchers per second.

Then you go around and use ABC logic (ignoring context and what is plainly and visually shown on screen) to justify because he fought and reacted to one of Faora's attack then he must have been moving at superspeed even though the scene is obviously showing that neither Faora or him did so.

Originally posted by Robtard
The fact that he was skewered by Loki's level of strength shows his durability is questionable, even if he didn't feel the pain and it didn't kill him

So while he may not die or even feel the pain from having an arm ripped off, but it could possibly be ripped off by someone of Zod's strength

He was skewered by an Alien weapon designed to pierce Asgardian+ durability. Nothing is questionable here at all.

Originally posted by Arachnid1
Yeah, its true enough that Kurse has insane damage soak. He's kind of like Ajax in that regard. I can agree he doesn't feel pain, or at least doesn't care about.

Also, Kurse didn't stop the Hammer like Hulk tried to. He redirected it slightly. I wouldn't really count that as a strength feat. If he caught it and waved it around, I'd be impressed.

Also, I missed Zods flight being disabled here. Thats my bad. I should have paid more attention to OP. Despite that, I seem to remember him bounding pretty fast up the side of a building. He didn't have super speed for a good portion fo that fight, but still kept up with someone who does, and could fly.

I disagree about redirecting slightly. Mjolnir turned a full 90 degrees. He literally swatted it away with his arm.

He cleared 20-25 feet in one second (not all that fast) in his first bullrush, as for the building climb, I did the math for that (somewhere in this thread) and the climb clocked in at around 15 mph.

Originally posted by Robtard
The fact that he was skewered by Loki's level of strength shows his durability is questionable, even if he didn't feel the pain and it didn't kill him

So while he may not die or even feel the pain from having an arm ripped off, but it could possibly be ripped off by someone of Zod's strength

He was skewered by Loki (who's quite strong himself) using an elven blade. Considering that Kurse is dark elf himself, it makes sense that their weapons can penetrate them.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
Sorry to tell you DT, but ambigious shockwave fx does NOT trump quantifiable actions/second calcs. That is essentially the entire basis of your argument above. Their actions were clearly within (or at best slightly above) human level speed if you go by actions/punchers per second.


So tell me since you want to look at them in normal time, do normally timed punches leave those kind of lines behind the punch like Zod's does at 1:37? What do you think that was if not a depiction of super speed?


Originally posted by Nibedicus
Then you go around and use ABC logic (ignoring context and what is plainly and visually shown on screen) to justify because he fought and reacted to one of Faora's attack then he must have been moving at superspeed even though the scene is obviously showing that neither Faora or him did so.


So are you saying Faora suddenly lost her speed when Kal was getting those hits in? Or did she suddenly decide to stop using this amazing speed that apparently only she has?

Because he lands hits on her more than once in that 2 on 1 scuffle.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
He was skewered by an Alien weapon designed to pierce Asgardian+ durability. Nothing is questionable here at all.

Could then be said that Kurse swatting away Mjolnir was due to him being the anti-Asgard living-weapon and not just a matter of physical strength

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
I would hardly use a scene where he's temporarily KO'd when fighting Faora and Nam as him "fighting them off" . They KO'd him, they were unfazed by any of his attacks sans his heat vision.


Whether they were fazed by his hits or not is completely irrelevant to the point which is speed.

He was landing more hits on Faora in that fight than vice versa, even though he was the one who was outnumbered.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
So tell me since you want to look at them in normal time, do normally times punches leave those kind of lines behind the punch? What do you think that was if not a depiction of super speed?

So are you saying Faora suddenly lost her speed when Kal was getting those hits in?

Because he lands hits on her more than once in that 2 on 1 scuffle.

Depictions of power of said punches, dramatic effect to give the scene more "motion".

No, she didn't lose her speed. She just didn't use it. Overconfidence perhaps? After all, that's what killed her in the end.

Originally posted by Robtard
Could then be said that Kurse swatting away Mjolnir was due to him being the anti-Asgard living-weapon and not just a matter of physical strength

You're just trolling right, or is this a serious argument?

Originally posted by Darth Thor
So tell me since you want to look at them in normal time, do normally times punches leave those kind of lines behind the punch like Zod's does at 1:37? What do you think that was if not a depiction of super speed?



So are you telling us that because of fancy shockwaves you want us to believe they punched in super speed even though the punches were in fact shown to be delivered at normal speed?

Originally posted by Nibedicus
You're just trolling right, or is this a serious argument?

Asking the question is just that. Kurse or the science/magic that made him was to turn him into an anti-Asgardian living weapon.

Factor in that we have several instances where it's portrayed to us that moving Mjolnir isn't a matter of strength, it makes sense that Kurse's flyswat might not have just been brute strength (even though Kurse is very strong)

You even made a similar point with Elven weapons being made to counter Asgardians and their gear. So why is one sensible and the other not?

Originally posted by Robtard
Asking the question is just that. Kurse or the science/magic that made him was to turn him into an anti-Asgardian living weapon.

Factor in that we have several instances where it's portrayed to us that moving Mjolnir isn't a matter of strength, it makes sense that Kurse's flyswat might not have just been brute strength.

There is no indication that Kurse was designed specifically to fight Asgardians and negate their tech/magic. At least none that I can remember. Isn't the Kurse transformation some ancient DElven ritual? You need to provide proof that they were made specifically for this purpose.

He didn't "move" Mjolnir, he stopped/deflected it's forward movement. Something Hulk was unable to do.

Onus is on you to prove that anything outside strength was involved.

When did I say that the Elven weapons were made to counter Asgardians and their gear? I don't seem to recall saying that. What i said was weapons were made to pierce Asgardian durability because that was what bladed weapons are supposed to do.

It's proof enough that Asgardian/DElf bladed weapons were designed to pierce Asgardian/DElf level durability, otherwise, they wouldn't be really using it against Asgardians/DElves who has said durability. I mean that's common sense there.

I really find it hard to believe that you're being serious here.

Going to have to watch the scene where he's created again, iirc, Malekith mentions something along those lines. I'll get back to you either way.

Algrim was the last and supposedbly most powerful of the Kursed. As for weapons, lazer guns and black hole grenades. The asgardians were the ones carrying swords I believe. Asgardian blades and the like are apparently way more. Durable and apparently sharper than regular earth metal. Been shown already.

Regardless, Zod has no blades just fists so not sure how hes gonna get past that blunt fforce durabilty.

Originally posted by FrothByte
He was skewered by Loki (who's quite strong himself) using an elven blade. Considering that Kurse is dark elf himself, it makes sense that their weapons can penetrate them.

Sorry I missed this last page.

If we're arguing that Asgardian and DE weapons are designed to harm Asgardians/DE, which is fine and it makes sense, not sure how that plays out when he was in turn unfazed by Mjolnir.

If a far inferior blade could pierce him, Mjolnir being one of the most powerful weapons should have done something, using that logic.

At no point any where in the movie was Kurse started to be the ultimate nullifier against all things Asgardian.

We can just end that line of reasoning here and now.

He was never really hit by the hammer except once when he was fleeing and already jumping off a cliff.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
What leads you to believe Zod is stronger than Kurse?

Even if so (I disagree), that still doesn't for Kurse being seemingly more durable

How is Kurse more durable? He was pierced by swords and spears and could not survive a black hole grenade. Something that Zod did survive and Zod was never pierced by anything.

Originally posted by Robtard
Sorry I missed this last page.

If we're arguing that Asgardian and DE weapons are designed to harm Asgardians/DE, which is fine and it makes sense, not sure how that plays out when he was in turn unfazed by Mjolnir.

If a far inferior blade could pierce him, Mjolnir being one of the most powerful weapons should have done something, using that logic.

Did he ever get hit directly by Mjolnir?

Yes only once when he was not trying to deflect it.

Didn't Lois also survive that "blackhole"?

I just rewatched the fight, doesn't seem like Kurse ever really gets hit by Mjolnir.

Alright then, must have misremembered, been some time since I watched it and it's one of my least favorite MCU flicks.

Zod has the strength speed and durability for a drawn out ugly fight that he will win the majority.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
Depictions of power of said punches, dramatic effect to give the scene more "motion".

LOL..... dramatic effect... what a clown.

Zod takes this, MCU fanboys should go and cry to Marvel Studios, they are doing a really bad job potrating Thor as a powerhouse.

Also, wasnt Kurse killed by a little blackhole grenade? Superman tanked a bigger one without problems and Zod was pretty much at his level.

Seriously MCU supporters make me laugh, MCU has yet to have a fight on the scale of Superman VS Zod, they are fleas compared to the Kryptonians.

Originally posted by FrothByte
So are you telling us that because of fancy shockwaves you want us to believe they punched in super speed even though the punches were in fact shown to be delivered at normal speed?

Seems that's how Snyder was portraying punches at super speeds. I mean what else were the shockwaves and after lines supposed to be portraying?

Also I still regard hitting while travelling at superhuman speeds as superhuman fast punches. Super reactions would definitely be required to fight at those speeds. Let's not forget how fast Zod was spinning Kal around. That was all super speed combat IMO

Originally posted by TH3_V01D
LOL..... dramatic effect... what a clown.

Zod takes this, MCU fanboys should go and cry to Marvel Studios, they are doing a really bad job potrating Thor as a powerhouse.

Also, wasnt Kurse killed by a little blackhole grenade? Superman tanked a bigger one without problems and Zod was pretty much at his level.

Seriously MCU supporters make me laugh, MCU has yet to have a fight on the scale of Superman VS Zod, they are fleas compared to the Kryptonians.


The butt-hurt is strong with this one.

Originally posted by Arachnid1
The absence of proof means the absence of feats. That puts the burden of proof on you, but that's impossible since you've already noted that those feats are absent. I'm definitely not trying to undersell Kurse. He's a beast, and likely one of the tops in the MCU so far. He just hasn't shown the feats to be considered above a Kyptonian.

Hulk wasn't holding up oil rigs or tackling over skyscrapers. His hits with the HB did make shockwaves, but nowhere near the level of shockwaves Supes and Zod colliding made. Thor also was not shown to be in the same ballpark strength wise. He's strong, but not enough to give Hulk a run in that stat. He won that fight due to significantly greater skill and superior fighting speed.

You're also trying to use A > B > C logic, which isn't valid here. Hulks strength feats don't translate to Thor, and they definitely don't translate to Kurse. That, combined with Kurses lack of feats, is kind of a death sentence when put into a fight with someone who does have feats.

Yeah, its true enough that Kurse has insane damage soak. He's kind of like Ajax in that regard. I can agree he doesn't feel pain, or at least doesn't care about.


It's funny how you view a scene one way, and I take the scene the totally opposite. Don't get me wrong, I see your point, but I just don't think it's the most logical one. For instance, you claim from Zod and superman were more impressive, I feel the opposite. Zod's and Superman's shockwaves were done with the aid of flight i.e. speed. Thus aiding in the creation of, and power of said shockwaves. Hulk were done without the aid of speed like that, and thus more impressive he was able to create them.

One of Thor's hammer throws literally send Hulk flying, Kurse either no sold it or simply swatted it away as if it was a toy. Again, in Hulk we're talking about somebody as stronger or stronger than Clark or Zod, and Thor was holding his own. Against Kurse he was a minor annoyance who was treated like a feeb. It's the marked disparity between the showings that makes it all the more impressive, and where the heart of the extrapolation lies. Thor has a wide array of feats throughout his appearances... Frost Giants, Huge Leviathan etc etc. Yet this same person, was treated like an utter feeb. That is more impressive than anything Zod did in the entire movie.

It goes like this

Kurse treating Thor like such a feeb >>>> Than anything Zod did in the entire movie.

You're claiming the feats lie with Zod, and that couldn't be further from the truth. IN fact, it's the exact opposite. Zod has ZERO impressive combat feats. Let's examine:

1. Zod losses convincingly to Jor-El
2. Gets bull rushed by superman and is unable to counter anything. He's head is beaten so bad without a counter, that his protective mask is destroyed and he has to BFR himself
3. Again losses to superman in a straight up fight

To even pretend Zod has the better combat feats is being disingenuous friend, and looking at the above, I think you'd tend to agree. It's not that losing to superman is a low showing per se, but when Kurse is casually and easily dealing with a super powered being. A being with more powers than superman by a large degree. Yet was unable to do a thing to Kurse. The combat feats are squarely in Kurse favor. Let's take it further

1. Durability - Kurse and easily so
2. Skill - Kurse and easily so
3. Speed - Zod, with flight easily so, without it, he's simply faster
4. Damage Soak - Kurse, and again easily so
5. Strength - Hard to say, but neither one would have a decisive edge imo
6. Reactions - Stalemate, possibly a very slight edge to Zod based on his speed.

All in all, Kurse simply is better at more combat related variables imo.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Seems that's how Snyder was portraying punches at super speeds. I mean what else were the shockwaves and after lines supposed to be portraying?

Also I still regard hitting while travelling at superhuman speeds as superhuman fast punches. Super reactions would definitely be required to fight at those speeds. Let's not forget how fast Zod was spinning Kal around. That was all super speed combat IMO

I'm confused here. It was specifically shown in the fights that their punches were done at normal speed. Again, this is proven by all the background cars and flames moving at normal speed and the punches also moving at normal speed. Yet you want us to completely disregard this and use shockwaves (that are probably more from impact than speed) as proof of superspeed?

Sorry dude, I'm judging the speed of something based on its, you know, speed. In this fight, it was clear that they were throwing punches at normal speed.


If I was sitting in a jet traveling at mach 1 and I punched the person beside me, does that mean I'm capable of superspeed punches? Because that's basically what Superman and Zod were doing. It's the theory of relativity.

Originally posted by TH3_V01D
LOL..... dramatic effect... what a clown.

Zod takes this, MCU fanboys should go and cry to Marvel Studios, they are doing a really bad job potrating Thor as a powerhouse.

Also, wasnt Kurse killed by a little blackhole grenade? Superman tanked a bigger one without problems and Zod was pretty much at his level.

Seriously MCU supporters make me laugh, MCU has yet to have a fight on the scale of Superman VS Zod, they are fleas compared to the Kryptonians.

Yeah okay bud, get back to be when Zod doesn't lose every damn fight he was in. You have your head so far up DC's bunghole you can't think coherently. Zod losses again, just like he did throughout the entire MOS movie.

Originally posted by FrothByte
I'm confused here. It was specifically shown in the fights that their punches were done at normal speed. Again, this is proven by all the background cars and flames moving at normal speed and the punches also moving at normal speed. Yet you want us to completely disregard this and use shockwaves (that are probably more from impact than speed) as proof of superspeed?

Sorry dude, I'm judging the speed of something based on its, you know, speed. In this fight, it was clear that they were throwing punches at normal speed.


If I was sitting in a jet traveling at mach 1 and I punched the person beside me, does that mean I'm capable of superspeed punches? Because that's basically what Superman and Zod were doing. It's the theory of relativity.

I'm with you for the most part in this argument, though I would back away from those punches being Human level. I think it's kind of silly to assert that those punches were done at human level speed. I agree they weren't done as fast as they were traveling. But they were faster than human level as well. It's one of these things I've argued before. The director wants the audience to see what the heck is going on. IF they had them fight as fast they were traveling, we wouldn't be able to see a thing. Now I'm not going extreme and saying the director believes they can throw punches as fast as they are flying. However, I wouldn't use the background or people around them to say they were punching at human level speed. That also doesn't make sense. I'd choose some place in the middle to low-middle as to how fast they were punching compared to flying. Again though, it's not enough punching speed that Kurse wouldn't be able to react to, and that is the bottom line here.

Originally posted by Silent Master
You mean other than the fact that Zod never once was shown to have her level of running speed?

Superman mastered Faora superdash in BvS, I think with enough time, ALL Kryptonians can pull off the basic super moves

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fDssYuXuPG0
At 0:23

Also for the ''Thor is as strong as Superman'' debate, we have OFFICIAL Bio/info about DCEU Superman and his powers, also closing the debate of the oil rig feat, he is incrementing his powers.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/11121/111211851/5054738-strength+bio.jpg

He can hold THOUSAND OF TONS without getting tired

Originally posted by TH3_V01D
Superman mastered Faora superdash in BvS, I think with enough time, ALL Kryptonians can pull off the basic super moves

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fDssYuXuPG0http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/11121/111211851/5054738-strength+bio.jpg


You're getting blood all over the floor, you really need to do something about your butt-hurt.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Yeah okay bud, get back to be when Zod doesn't lose every damn fight he was in. You have your head so far up DC's bunghole you can't think coherently. Zod losses again, just like he did throughout the entire MOS movie.

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mbynuuAUTg1rrpsd7.gif

''BLA BLA BLAH, IM a butthurt MCU fanboy because DIsn... errmm MArvel Studios make Thor look like a weak *****''

Then again this is the dude who was knocked out by a boulder and was afraid of a little blackhole grenade

Originally posted by TH3_V01D
http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mbynuuAUTg1rrpsd7.gif

It really burns you that Baleman is one of the weakest superheros to ever be put to film.

No offense, TH3 VO1D, but you're somewhat behaving like the DC equivalent to quanchi112's 'Marvel wins because I hate DC'. We really don't need more of that type of nonsense.

Check his posting history, crying because Marvel has been more successful is basically all he does.

Originally posted by Silent Master
You're getting blood all over the floor, you really need to do something about your butt-hurt.

Sorry buddy, but this is OFFICIAL info, its make you mad? well there is more:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_large/11121/111211851/5058890-6205023914-50533.jpg

Thor is a flea compared to Superman

Originally posted by Silent Master
It really burns you that Baleman is one of the weakest superheros to ever be put to film.
Bateman really sucks yeah

Originally posted by TH3_V01D
Sorry buddy, but this is OFFICIAL info, its make you mad? well there is more:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_large/11121/111211851/5058890-6205023914-50533.jpg

I get it, you're mad that Cap's last movie destroyed MOS at the box office and DC was so scared of Cap's new movie that they moved BvS's opening date.

Originally posted by Robtard
No offense, TH3 VO1D, but you're somewhat behaving like the DC equivalent to quanchi112's 'Marvel wins because I hate DC'. We really don't need more of that type of nonsense.

LOL