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- Opponents face off on an open battlefield.
- They start 20 feet apart.
- Both can fight to the peak of their abilities.
- Both are out to kill.

Who wins?

Gul'dan...fels him.

Originally posted by KingD19
Gul'dan...fels him.

oShTJ90fC34

This is even worse than Azog vs Blackhand.

Originally posted by FrothByte
This is even worse than Azog vs Blackhand.

Not according to a certain delusional fanboy, who claimed that Azog is the most formidable of any of the Orcs in either the Hobbit/LotR or Warcraft. Strange how he is noticeably absent in this thread, considering his bold claims in the other one.

Azog wins.

Gul'dan wins.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Gul'dan wins. Based on ?

Based on feats and common sense. Gul'dan has magical life drain abilities Azog has no answer for. But you have decided that Azog is the latest fictional dick you are going to ride, so you're just going to keep wanking him regardless of the facts.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Based on feats and common sense. Gul'dan has magical life drain abilities Azog has no answer for. But you have decided that Azog is the latest fictional dick you are going to ride, so you're just going to keep wanking him regardless of the facts. So you made an intentional bait thread while just complaining you're sick of my opinions in another thread. Based off the Orc code in Warcraft he doesn't implore this right out of the gate. Azog kills him. He displayed far greater skill. He kills Gul'dan.

Originally posted by quanchi112
So you made an intentional bait thread while just complaining you're sick of my opinions in another thread. Based off the Orc code in Warcraft he doesn't implore this right out of the gate. Azog kills him. He displayed far greater skill. He kills Gul'dan.

Nope, I made it to settle the argument of who is the most formidable Orc overall. Azog is the toughest pure Orc shown in the Hobbit/LotR films. Gul'dan is the most powerful Orc seen in Warcraft. Don't really care whether you comment or not. I'm happy to discuss the topic with other people. I just found your initial lack of response amusing, considering your boasting.

Also, read the OP. This isn't a Mak'gora. This is a fight on an open battlefield, where both are fighting to the best of their ability and are out to kill. Gul'dan sucks his life out. The only reason Gul'dan did not implore that from the start against Durotan was because of the rules of Mak'gora. He showed zero problems with using it right off the bat in other situations.

Also, why are you lying? I never said anything about being "sick". Just said listening to you repeat yourself over and over gets old pretty quickly.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Nope, I made it to settle the argument of who is the most formidable Orc overall. Azog is the toughest pure Orc shown in the Hobbit/LotR films. Gul'dan is the most powerful Orc seen in Warcraft. Don't really care whether you comment or not. I'm happy to discuss the topic with other people. I just found your initial lack of response amusing, consider your boasting.

Also, read the OP. This isn't a Mak'gora. This is a fight on an open battlefield, where both are fighting to the best of their ability and are out to kill. Gul'dan sucks his life out. The only reason Gul'dan did not implore that from the start against Durotan was because of the rules of Mak'gora. He showed zero problems with using it right off the bat in other situations. You made multiple posts and actually begged for my opinion. I happily obliged since your obsession with me goes into hyperdrive.

So you want to script this battle. We see him do so to slaves, prisoners, etc. in the film but the one fight he was in he didn't so so right out of the gate. You can ignore film evidence all you want when this orc is clearly a sorcerer not a pure warrior Orc. He uses the Fel but that won't save him from Azog's mace. It also wasn't immediate and needed two passes at Durotan. Azog for the clear win. He's the best Orc in all of cinema. If you seek to run and flee from this debate as you did the other just go and wet your bed.

Originally posted by quanchi112
You made multiple posts and actually begged for my opinion. I happily obliged since your obsession with me goes into hyperdrive.

So you want to script this battle. We see him do so to slaves, prisoners, etc. in the film but the one fight he was in he didn't so so right out of the gate. You can ignore film evidence all you want when this orc is clearly a sorcerer not a pure warrior Orc. He uses the Fel but that won't save him from Azog's mace. It also wasn't immediate and needed two passes at Durotan. Azog for the clear win. He's the best Orc in all of cinema. If you seek to run and flee from this debate as you did the other just go and wet your bed.

More lying from Liarchi112. Post where I made "multiple posts" and "begged" for anything. I only even referenced you once before your dumb ass came into the thread. You really have an over-inflated opinion of your importance on these boards.

Not scripting anything. This is not Mak'gora. Mak'gora rules do not apply here. This is an all out fight, to the best of their ability, as per the OP. You are just ignoring match stips. Also, he was holding his own against Durotan just fine without it. He employed his magic to speed things along, because he was on a schedule. He also only used it mildly to begin with, because he was trying not to get noticed. He only stopped giving a f*** later, and then quickly took Durotan out. You are literally arguing that Gul'dan won't use his magic in a fight where he is free to, when he used it in a fight where he actually wasn't supposed to. Gul'dan kills Azog in an all out battle.

But go ahead, keep ignoring very clearly put match stipulations. All you are doing is proving you are such a big fanboy that you will ignore the actual OP to favour your character.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
More lying from Liarchi112. Post where I made "multiple posts" and "begged" for anything. I only even referenced you once before your dumb ass came into the thread. You really have an over-inflated opinion of your importance on these boards.

Not scripting anything. This is not Mak'gora. Mak'gora rules do not apply here. This is an all out fight, to the best of their ability, as per the OP. You are just ignoring match stips. Also, he was holding his own against Durotan just fine without it. He employed his magic to speed things along, because he was on a schedule. He also only used it mildly to begin with, because he was trying not to get noticed. He only stopped giving a f*** later, and then quickly took Durotan out. You are literally arguing that Gul'dan won't use his magic in a fight where he is free to, when he used it in a fight where he actually wasn't supposed to. Gul'dan kills Azog in an all out battle.

But go ahead, keep ignoring very clearly put match stipulations. All you are doing is proving you are such a big fanboy that you will ignore the actual OP to favour your character. Your YouTube link and your post utterly sobbing for my involvement. I am here so make this worth it for me.

A one on one fight for the Warcraft orcs automatically reverts into this especially because this isn't a battle between forces but a one on one encounter. He used the Fel and most orcs believed that was cheating. Gul'dan won't use it right away and will be killed in the meantime when he engages him as he did with Durotan initially. And as I said it wasn't one immediate zap and his death but required two multi second spanning drains.

I am arguing based off the tendencies and the code these orcs implore in their films. You want to ignore all the facts it of your obsession with cinemas greatest Orc in Azog. Just deal with the fact he slays Gul'dan.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Your YouTube link and your post utterly sobbing for my involvement. I am here so make this worth it for me.



This is priceless. I made that post as a response to the fact that another poster made a pun/joke while giving their opinion on the match. You have become so delusional that you think posts that have nothing to do with you are about you. It's just sad.

Originally posted by quanchi112

A one on one fight for the Warcraft orcs automatically reverts into this especially because this isn't a battle between forces but a one on one encounter. He used the Fel and most orcs believed that was cheating. Gul'dan won't use it right away and will be killed in the meantime when he engages him as he did with Durotan initially. And as I said it wasn't one immediate zap and his death but required two multi second spanning drains.

I am arguing based off the tendencies and the code these orcs implore in their films. You want to ignore all the facts it of your obsession with cinemas greatest Orc in Azog. Just deal with the fact he slays Gul'dan.

So, you base your argument off something that contradicts the actual OP I set up? I very clearly say this is an open battle field. I very clearly say they are fighting to the best of their ability, which for Gul'dan involves using his magic. I have repeatedly made it clear this is not Mak'gora. Also, funny how you accuse me of scripting, and then script how Gul'dan is going to fight. Basically, you are not actually arguing the thread topic, which makes anything you say invalid.

Thanks for the lols though.

Unless Mok'gara is invoked specifically its not in effect. So Gul'dan will drain him immediately.

Originally posted by KingD19
Unless Mok'gara is invoked specifically its not in effect. So Gul'dan will drain him immediately.

Exactly. Honour duels don't just happen automatically every time an Orc fights someone one-on-one. It is a formally issued challenge. Not to mention, I already specified in the OP that both fighters are fighting to the best of their ability.

Also, Mak'gora doesn't even solely apply to one-on-one fights. It can be issued in larger groups as well. And Mak'gora requires that each fighter has a "witness". No one else in this thread so, by default, it cannot be Mak'gora.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller


This is priceless. I made that post as a response to the fact that another poster made a pun/joke while giving their opinion on the match. You have become so delusional that you think posts that have nothing to do with you are about you. It's just sad.



So, you base your argument off something that contradicts the actual OP I set up? I very clearly say this is an open battle field. I very clearly say they are fighting to the best of their ability, which for Gul'dan involves using his magic. I have repeatedly made it clear this is not Mak'gora. Also, funny how you accuse me of scripting, and then script how Gul'dan is going to fight. Basically, you are not actually arguing the thread topic, which makes anything you say invalid.

Thanks for the lols though. It is an open battlefield but it's one on one. You admitted you created this thread because of my statement Azog is the greatest Orc. You're an idiot. I don't respect someone who lies or gets so emotionally worked up and deludes himself. I've caught you in multiple lies from the film Warcraft.


I am basing this off of Gul'dan using his magic against Durotan. It wasn't immediate and he took two attempts. Azog kills him. He's more skilled and more dangerous than weak Durotan.

Does anyone respect you ??

Rhetorical question.

Originally posted by KingD19
Unless Mok'gara is invoked specifically its not in effect. So Gul'dan will drain him immediately. Azog kills him first. More skill than Gul'dan.

Originally posted by quanchi112
It is an open battlefield but it's one on one. You admitted you created this thread because of my statement Azog is the greatest Orc. You're an idiot. I don't respect someone who lies or gets so emotionally worked up and deludes himself. I've caught you in multiple lies from the film Warcraft.


I am basing this off of Gul'dan using his magic against Durotan. It wasn't immediate and he took two attempts. Azog kills him. He's more skilled and more dangerous than weak Durotan.

Does anyone respect you ??

Rhetorical question.

Oh the irony of this. You lied about my supposed "multiple" posts of "begging". You lied about how Mak'gora applies to Orc combat. I also never said I made this thread because of what you said. I just mentioned what you said in response to Frothbyte implying this is spite. Azog has better feats than other Orcs. Just because you also acknowledge it doesn't mean other people can't hold that opinion on their own. Like I said, you are so full of yourself you are becoming delusional. So, another lie on your part. Also, you never caught me in "multiple lies". At best, I forgot exactly how Lothar's son lost his weapon. And I never said Blackhand disarmed him in anyways. So, yet another lie and strawman on your part. So, you are the one who has been caught in multiple lies. This is clear to see for everyone. Azog starts 20 feet away, which is plenty of time for Gul'dan to drain him, seeing as he would go for his best attack, as per the OP. Even if Azog closes the distance, he will be significantly weakened, as Durotan was. Gul'dan wins. Cry more.

And LOL at talking about respect. You are a laughing stock here. I don't give a shit whether you respect me or not. I am quite confident that I have far more credibility in the eyes of the other posters here than you do. So, your petty little insults backfired.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Not according to a certain delusional fanboy, who claimed that Azog is the most formidable of any of the Orcs in either the Hobbit/LotR or Warcraft. Strange how he is noticeably absent in this thread, considering his bold claims in the other one. Here is you frothing at the mouth for me. I enter and utterly decimate your points to which you've rest retread from the debate just as in the Blackhand debate.Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Nope, I made it to settle the argument of who is the most formidable Orc overall. Azog is the toughest pure Orc shown in the Hobbit/LotR films. Gul'dan is the most powerful Orc seen in Warcraft. Don't really care whether you comment or not. I'm happy to discuss the topic with other people. I just found your initial lack of response amusing, considering your boasting.

Also, read the OP. This isn't a Mak'gora. This is a fight on an open battlefield, where both are fighting to the best of their ability and are out to kill. Gul'dan sucks his life out. The only reason Gul'dan did not implore that from the start against Durotan was because of the rules of Mak'gora. He showed zero problems with using it right off the bat in other situations.

Also, why are you lying? I never said anything about being "sick". Just said listening to you repeat yourself over and over gets old pretty quickly. Here you plainly admit this was meant to settle my claim. I'm in your head. You made a thread to cure your Butthurt from another thread. You're weak.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Oh the irony of this. You lied about my supposed "multiple" posts of "begging". You lied about how Mak'gora applies to Orc combat. I also never said I made this thread because of what you said. I just mentioned what you said in response to Frothbyte implying this is spite. Azog has better feats than other Orcs. Just because you also acknowledge it doesn't mean other people can't hold that opinion on their own. Like I said, you are so full of yourself you are becoming delusional. So, another lie on your part. Also, you never caught me in "multiple lies". At best, I forgot exactly how Lothar's son lost his weapon. And I never said Blackhand disarmed him in anyways. So, yet another lie and strawman on your part. So, you are the one who has been caught in multiple lies. This is clear to see for everyone. Azog starts 20 feet away, which is plenty of time for Gul'dan to drain him, seeing as he would go for his best attack, as per the OP. Even if Azog closes the distance, he will be significantly weakened, as Durotan was. Gul'dan wins. Cry more.

And LOL at talking about respect. You are a laughing stock here. I don't give a shit whether you respect me or not. I am quite confident that I have far more credibility in the eyes of the other posters here than you do. So, your petty little insults backfired. You ranted and raved about Lothar's son. A random Orc disarmed the scared boy. He wasn't ****ijg ready for the situation. He was scared shitless. Lothar didn't want to lose his pansy son. He died. Good riddance.

Your ignorance isn't an excuse to exaggerate Bladkhand killing an unarmed scars inexperienced foe. We also see general humans killing plenty of orcs in the final battle. Durotan hit him multiple times. And the second attack was while he bear hugged him. Azog sticks him. Kills him.

He didn't kill Durotan before he could close the distance even after one attempt. Azog wins based off his showings and superior skill advantage. Azog is the superior Orc. Cry elsewhere you pile of shit.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Here is you frothing at the mouth for me. I enter and utterly decimate your points to which you've rest retread from the debate just as in the Blackhand debate. Here you plainly admit this was meant to settle my claim. I'm in your head. You made a thread to cure your Butthurt from another thread. You're weak.


LOL... So, on top of delusion, you can't comprehend English. I said that in response to Froth suggesting it is spite. As I said, Azog has better feats than other Orcs. Hence he is the most formidable Orc in that verse (at least that we have seen). Whether you said it or not makes no difference. It is fact, which can be ascertained without your dumbass going on about it. You act like you are the only one who can make an obvious observation. So, why not pit the best one one against the best of another? Seriously, get over yourself. Most formidable Orc in one verse is not the same as someone saying they are the most formidable in both. That's the only instance where I directly referenced your comment. And again, in response to a suggestion that it was spite. Seriously, you are an idiot.

Originally posted by quanchi112

You ranted and raved about Lothar's son. A random Orc disarmed the scared boy. He wasn't ****ijg ready for the situation. He was scared shitless. Lothar didn't want to lose his pansy son. He died. Good riddance.

Your ignorance isn't an excuse to exaggerate Bladkhand killing an unarmed scars inexperienced foe. We also see general humans killing plenty of orcs in the final battle. Durotan hit him multiple times. And the second attack was while he bear hugged him. Azog sticks him. Kills him.

He didn't kill Durotan before he could close the distance even after one attempt. Azog wins based off his showings and superior skill advantage. Azog is the superior Orc. Cry elsewhere you pile of shit.

I said he killed him. I did not say he disarmed him. Again, you are strawmanning.

They used guns for most of that, or group tactics. And none of them did it with the same level of skill and ease as Lothar and Llane. That was the only point I made there, when we were discussing Llane's skill, which you were downplaying.

Because he didn't try to, you moron. It was Mak'gora. He wasn't even supposed to be using magic at all. He was initially trying to do it just enough so it wouldn't be noticed. Here, he is free to go for the drain from the start. He showed more than once that he capable of draining life at a distance if he wants to. Gul'dan wins.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
LOL... So, on top of delusion, you can't comprehend English. I said that in response to Froth suggesting it is spite. As I said, Azog has better feats than other Orcs. Hence he is the most formidable Orc in that verse (at least that we have seen). Whether you said it or not makes no difference. It is fact, which can be ascertained without your dumbass going on about it. You act like you are the only one who can make an obvious observation. So, why not pit the best one one against the best of another? Seriously, get over yourself. Most formidable Orc in one verse is not the same as someone saying they are the most formidable in both. That's the only instance where I directly referenced your comment. And again, in response to a suggestion that it was spite. Seriously, you are an idiot.
You said before I posted a certain delusional fanboy claimed he was the most formidable Orc. This bothered you so much you knee jerked I to making this thread to cover up your shame in the Azog/Blackhand thread. You made it plainly obvious this is because I'm inside your pea brain. You also conceded the warrior orcs to Azog since you pitted him against a magic using Orc. Azog still wins due to skill.

So what ? You already admitted you weren't aware of the circumstances you ignorant piece of vagina. Now when I corrected you look stupid. You bragged he killed Lothar's son. Idiot.

Lothar also used a gun on Blackhand. They weren't aware of the orcs or their strength. They came out of nowhere. Once they got more Intel on them they started going down since they were familiar with them.

Llane flat out tells that whore Orc she needs to kill him. She does. No one else. Blackhand didn't kill him. Speculation. Watch the movie as you need corrected on nearly everything in it. Your perception or memory is hazy at best.

He used it three times and was blatantly obvious the second and the final attempt. Azog sticks him. You shouldn't try to bear hug Azpg you won't like the outcome. Azog for the win. More battle tested, more experience, and more skill. This is a wrap. The Fel fails Gul'dan.

Originally posted by quanchi112
You said before I posted a certain delusional fanboy claimed he was the most formidable Orc. This bothered you so much you knee jerked I to making this thread to cover up your shame in the Azog/Blackhand thread. You made it plainly obvious this is because I'm inside your pea brain. You also conceded the warrior orcs to Azog since you pitted him against a magic using Orc. Azog still wins due to skill.

OMFG... how thick are you? I brought that up because of what Frothbyte said. If he hadn't suggested it was a mismatch, you would never have been mentioned at all. What is so difficult to grasp?

Also... again, now try to keep up. Gul'dan - Most powerful Orc in Warcraft (due to magic powers and being Horde Leader). Azog - Most power Orc from Hobbit/LotR (due to better combat feats than other LotR Orcs). So, there is a theme running there, which is the reason for the thread. I make versus matches all the time. Some better than others. Whether you actually comment or not is of no consequence to me. You could disappear off these boards forever and it would make no difference.

Also, Blackhand wins the other thread, so why would I feel shame? I just know your MO. You will drag a thread out endlessly, just to get the last word in. That stupid Dumbledore/Voldemort thread being the perfect example. I just have better things to do with my time than indulge your endless circular loop debates.

Originally posted by quanchi112

So what ? You already admitted you weren't aware of the circumstances you ignorant piece of vagina. Now when I corrected you look stupid. You bragged he killed Lothar's son. Idiot.

Lothar also used a gun on Blackhand. They weren't aware of the orcs or their strength. They came out of nowhere. Once they got more Intel on them they started going down since they were familiar with them.

Llane flat out tells that whore Orc she needs to kill him. She does. No one else. Blackhand didn't kill him. Speculation. Watch the movie as you need corrected on nearly everything in it. Your perception or memory is hazy at best.

He used it three times and was blatantly obvious the second and the final attempt. Azog sticks him. You shouldn't try to bear hug Azpg you won't like the outcome. Azog for the win. More battle tested, more experience, and more skill. This is a wrap. The Fel fails Gul'dan.

I simply stated he did. But keep exaggerating a point irrelevant to this discussion. I also already explained the situation with Llane. You just can't seem to grasp the very obvious fact that he could have gone with the same plan, even if he had managed to kill Blackhand.

They started using better weapons and better tactics. No shit. It doesn't change the fact that even in that final battle, Blackhand wasn't taken out, and the king knew he would die against him. Only Lothar got the better of him.

I also already addressed the fact that he stopped caring later, and then went at it more aggressively. You are just too thick to put 2 and 2 together, which is that if he hadn't held back at the start, and gone full drain from the beginning, the match wouldn't have lasted anywhere near that long. Azog has never dealt with anything like Gul'dan's life drain. He gets devoured and loses.

Anyway, I am done here. The only person who thinks Azog wins is a known fanboy, and I don't have Juggerman's patience to indulge your circular BS. So, this is settled.

Now, go ahead and make your final post, so that you can get the last word in and proclaim yourself the winner. Go ahead, dance monkey, dance. Prove that you are a predictable simpleton chimp, who is incapable of letting someone else have the last post in a thread.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
OMFG... how thick are you? I brought that up because of what Frothbyte said. If he hadn't suggested it was a mismatch, you would never have been mentioned at all. What is so difficult to grasp?

Also... again, now try to keep up. Gul'dan - Most powerful Orc in Warcraft (due to magic powers and being Horde Leader). Azog - Most power Orc from Hobbit/LotR (due to better combat feats than other LotR Orcs). So, there is a theme running there, which is the reason for the thread. I make versus matches all the time. Some better than others. Whether you actually comment or not is of no consequence to me. You could disappear off these boards forever and it would make no difference.You made the thread right after I made the claim due to your hurt feelings over Azog's win over Blackhand. You wanted someone to take on the big bad Azog. You failed. Gul'dan is a one trick pony who isn't a true warrior as Azog is. You already said a certain poster is notably absent. I already quoted you. You're riled up over Azog's superiority.
I refuted your points and corrected your ignorance. You quickly jumped out of the thread in dramatic girlie fashion. If you can't back your claims or are unsure about the films just pm, kiddo.

You acted as if his win over his son was impressive. It wasn't. You were wrong. You admitted you were. You admitted to me you didn't know shit about the actual specifics aka dumbass.

He wasn't going to risk his kingdom to take on a powerful Orc as it gained his kingdom nothing. He wasn't a prideful cocky king so quit saying he should go out of character to risk the future just to take down Blackhand.

Which furthers my point. They knew how to take on the enemy with more time to better determine how to take on the physically superior species. The king never said he'd die against Blackhand. Not one time. What he did say was she needed to kill him for any possible chance of peace. Watch the ****ing movie I tire of holding your shitty little acne ridden hand over every little detail you're clueless on.

Blackhand didn't kill any notable armed opponent. Not one. Helost to Lothar twice. This is why he loses. He is slow and didn't display any degree of notable skill. Lothar crushed him.

He went to drain him twice. He wasn't just casually draining him. It took two major attempts, time, and a bear hug. He grabs Azog and he's getting gutted by his blade.

Azog kills him just the same as he does any opponent. Gul'dan isn't immune to phay iadl damage and was beaten up by Durotan. He didn't kill Durotan before taking any damage. Watch the film this he drains skilled badass orcs before they can do anything exists only in your fanboy mind.

Your pleas for me to stop fall on deaf ears. Azog wins this thread as well and your running to your mommy shows you're a weak willed pussy who always taps out and relatively quickly.

Nope, no hurt feelings, because Blackhand also wins. I also explained those comments. More than once. You just lack the intelligence to grasp it. Rest of it is just another one of your typical fanboy rants. But what a good monkey you are. You danced, just like I told you to.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Nope, no hurt feelings, because Blackhand also wins. I also explained those comments. More than once. You just lack the intelligence to grasp it. Rest of it is just another one of your typical fanboy rants. But what a good monkey you are. You danced, just like I told you to. Blackhand loses. He didn't beat any notable skilled opponents in a fair fight. He was destroyed by Lothar. Azog destroys him as well. Azog wrecks him and also kills Gul'dan. Sorry but the Lotr characters are more organized, more savage, and better showings. You're a Warcraft fanboy. I knew I'd find one and here you are. You disgrace kmc with your very presence.

*watches in amusement as Quan continues his monkey dance*

Y'know, for a person who accuses others of obsession and fanboyism, you sure can't seem to stop yourself from coming back to my thread and going on about Azog. You really are too easy to trigger and manipulate. It's hilarious. I can pretty much make you post on demand. Just say something that gets your panties in a bunch, and you are virtually guaranteed to reply, just like you will likely be unable to stop yourself from replying to this.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
*watches in amusement as Quan continues his monkey dance*

Y'know, for a person who accuses others of obsession and fanboyism, you sure can't seem to stop yourself from coming back to my thread and going on about Azog. You really are too easy to trigger and manipulate. It's hilarious. I can pretty much make you post on demand. Just say something that gets your panties in a bunch, and you are virtually guaranteed to reply, just like you will likely be unable to stop yourself from replying to this.
*laughs as you continue to make more threads furthering your obsession with me*


I enjoy debating but I tend to really go after fanboys and trolls. Your refusal to debate the characters but instead rave about your feelings is unforgivable. I won't ever stop. Just as Azog never ceased his pursuit of Thorin I won't ever stop debating. That's what I do on this site. This is why I'm the greatest kmc poster ever in its entire existence.

Gul'dan wins

Originally posted by Silent Master
Gul'dan wins Based on ?

Originally posted by quanchi112
*laughs as you continue to make more threads furthering your obsession with me*


I enjoy debating but I tend to really go after fanboys and trolls. Your refusal to debate the characters but instead rave about your feelings is unforgivable. I won't ever stop. Just as Azog never ceased his pursuit of Thorin I won't ever stop debating. That's what I do on this site. This is why I'm the greatest kmc poster ever in its entire existence.

Like I said. Post on demand. Like a well-trained pet. And you are the only one constantly going on about feelings. LOL at you being the greatest KMC poster ever. I guarantee that you are the only one who thinks that.

Also, exactly what other thread did I make involving you?

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
*watches in amusement as Quan continues his monkey dance*

Y'know, for a person who accuses others of obsession and fanboyism, you sure can't seem to stop yourself from coming back to my thread and going on about Azog. You really are too easy to trigger and manipulate. It's hilarious. I can pretty much make you post on demand. Just say something that gets your panties in a bunch, and you are virtually guaranteed to reply, just like you will likely be unable to stop yourself from replying to this.

Lmao!

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Like I said. Post on demand. Like a well-trained pet. And you are the only one constantly going on about feelings. LOL at you being the greatest KMC poster ever. I guarantee that you are the only one who thinks that.

Also, exactly what other thread did I make involving you? My posting history confirms I am the greatest.

You know what threads you made centered around my verifiable claims.

Originally posted by quanchi112
My posting history confirms I am the greatest.

You know what threads you made centered around my verifiable claims.

Your posting history confirms something, but it's not that.

And I honestly have no idea what you are on about. Last thread I made was Aragorn vs Thorin, which has jack shit to do with you or Azog (literally makes no mention of either of you at all). It's a skilled Human king vs a skilled Dwarf king (see the theme there?), which should be close, seeing as they have relatively similar feats. I can't decide who to back, hence why I wanted to know what others thought. Aragorn has a reach advantage, but Thorin and other Dwarves have shown that their fighting style can compensate for that. This might come as a shock to you, but I like LotR. I thought the Hobbit movies were shit overall (2nd one wasn't too bad though), but the LotR movies were great, and I love the universe. I've read the actual LotR books twice, and The Hobbit three times.

The other recent matches I made was Dr Doom vs Weapon XI and Hellboy vs Lizard. Someone bumped a Lothar vs Aragorn thread, but I made that match in June of last year.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Your posting history confirms something, but it's not that.

And I honestly have no idea what you are on about. Last thread I made was Aragorn vs Thorin, which has jack shit to do with you or Azog (literally makes no mention of either of you at all). It's a skilled Human king vs a skilled Dwarf king (see the theme there?), which should be close, seeing as they have relatively similar feats. I can't decide who to back, hence why I wanted to know what others thought. Aragorn has a reach advantage, but Thorin and other Dwarves have shown that their fighting style can compensate for that. This might come as a shock to you, but I like LotR. I thought the Hobbit movies were shit overall (2nd one wasn't too bad though), but the LotR movies were great, and I love the universe. I've read the actual LotR books twice, and The Hobbit three times.

The other recent matches I made was Dr Doom vs Weapon XI and Hellboy vs Lizard. Someone bumped a Lothar vs Aragorn thread, but I made that match in June of last year. Then why do you shit all over the orcs from the Lotr universe. Azog was the biggest and baddest ever to grace the silver screen. Lurtz while a Uruk hai is a different matter altogether but he posed a clear threat to Aragorn alone. Azog would beat the paint off of Lurtz so your insistence to downplay Azog the greatest Orc is a bit puzzling.

The hobbit movies weren't shit at all.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Gul'dan has magical life drain abilities Azog has no answer for.

Probably, but keep in mind Azog was resisting Gandalf's tk quite well.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Then why do you shit all over the orcs from the Lotr universe. Azog was the biggest and baddest ever to grace the silver screen. Lurtz while a Uruk hai is a different matter altogether but he posed a clear threat to Aragorn alone. Azog would beat the paint off of Lurtz so your insistence to downplay Azog the greatest Orc is a bit puzzling.

The hobbit movies weren't shit at all.

So, you think if you like something, you have to blindly cheer it on regardless of anything else? Most Orcs in the LotR verse are weak, at least film-wise. The movie Orcs tend to lose a lot more often than they win. Name 1 regular Orc, other than Azog or Bolg, who showed any ability of note? I have never downplayed Azog as being the best Orc in that verse. In fact, I said exactly the opposite. I said that, by feats, he is better than the rest. I can quote exactly where I said that.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
... As I said, Azog has better feats than other Orcs. Hence he is the most formidable Orc in that verse (at least that we have seen). Whether you said it or not makes no difference...

With regards to how he compares to other universes as a character, that is a matter of opinion. None of them will ever actually meet, so everything is speculation and personal interpretation. Also, newsflash: The LotR universe isn't just about the Orcs. It's a rich setting, with various races, interesting backstories, history etc. So, thinking the movie Orcs were weak doesn't say shit about my opinion of the setting as a whole.

I found them to be weak compared to the LotR trilogy. You can disagree, but you will find your opinion to be in the minority.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Probably, but keep in mind Azog was resisting Gandalf's tk quite well.

Gandalf wasn't just trying to hold him back though. Azog had a whole crew of his minions surrounding him. You can see here, from around the 0:25 that his staff thrust was sending several of them stumbling.

z7_U6y8kJaY

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
So, you think if you like something, you have to blindly cheer it on regardless of anything else? Most Orcs in the LotR verse are weak, at least film-wise. The movie Orcs tend to lose a lot more often than they win. Name 1 regular Orc, other than Azog or Bolg, who showed any ability of note? I have never downplayed Azog as being the best Orc in that verse. In fact, I said exactly the opposite. I said that, by feats, he is better than the rest. I can quote exactly where I said that.
See here's the problem with what you're saying. They lose due to being up against against characters we follow. Just as the humans, elves, and dwarves aren't centered around they also die far more easier. It's the same in all of these movies. The orcs were beating the elves, humans, and the dwarves in the final hobbit film but the Eagles also showed up to aid them. The dwarves and the elves were also taking each other out the generic ones in the same manner the generic orcs go down.

So you agree your opinion with regards to the other orcs doesn't hold any water since we are discussing Azog.

Sauron said it was the age of the Orc and I definitely believe they were the superior species when compared to the others.

Azog was a far superior villain to Saruman or any Uruk Hai or other Lotr villain in the first trilogy. We see the conflict between he and Oakenshield from the first film to the final as the most fascinating rivalry in all the films. Azog even demanded Oakenshield to Sauron. Nothing was going to deter him from meting Thorin on the battlefield once more.

Very underrated films. Smaug was also well done. The Sauron scenes were also fantastic. Bilbo was also superior to Frodo.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
So, you think if you like something, you have to blindly cheer it on regardless of anything else?

That is exactly what he thinks, he also enjoys trolling.

Originally posted by Silent Master
That is exactly what he thinks, he also enjoys trolling. What have I said that is exaggerated or unsupported ?

Originally posted by quanchi112
See here's the problem with what you're saying. They lose due to being up against against characters we follow. Just as the humans, elves, and dwarves aren't centered around they also die far more easier. It's the same in all of these movies. The orcs were beating the elves, humans, and the dwarves in the final hobbit film but the Eagles also showed up to aid them. The dwarves and the elves were also taking each other out the generic ones in the same manner the generic orcs go down.

So you agree your opinion with regards to the other orcs doesn't hold any water since we are discussing Azog.

One battle in one film, compared to all the other instances where they ended up on the losing side. Also, they had warbeasts and such for that battle.

*facepalm* If I thought that Azog was as weak as the others, I would not bother putting him in any match.


Originally posted by quanchi112

Sauron said it was the age of the Orc and I definitely believe they were the superior species when compared to the others.

That's your subjective opinion. And, guess what? It wasn't, seeing as they ended up on the losing side at the end of both trilogies.

Originally posted by quanchi112

Azog was a far superior villain to Saruman or any Uruk Hai or other Lotr villain in the first trilogy. We see the conflict between he and Oakenshield from the first film to the final as the most fascinating rivalry in all the films. Azog even demanded Oakenshield to Sauron. Nothing was going to deter him from meting Thorin on the battlefield once more.

Very underrated films. Smaug was also well done. The Sauron scenes were also fantastic. Bilbo was also superior to Frodo.

Again, subjective opinion. Serious question. Have you actually ever read the book version of The Hobbit?

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
One battle in one film, compared to all the other instances where they ended up on the losing side. Also, they had warbeasts and such for that battle.

*facepalm* If I thought that Azog was as weak as the others, I would not bother putting him in any match.
And the dwarves had war machines. We see Azog have them taken out via command.

You've used the logic generic orcs are greater in a Warcraft thread which you just admitted has no basis for Azog since he's the best.


No shit. We knew how this was going to end but that's the point of these gigantic against all odds fantasy hero quests. We see the heroes having to work together to take out the overall threat the orcs.

Yes, I did in the 8th grade but that's neither here nor there since this is a films only thread. Films give the characters tangibility. Peter Jackson isn't perfect but he did a fantastic job with this material and I'd definitely trust him going forward if they ever wrangled the rights to the Simarillion from the Tolkiens.

I'd definitely put Azog and Bolg's forces against the Uruk Hai, orcs who stormed Helm's Deep in a battlezone if you feel up to the task since you think the hobbit films are just inferior.

Originally posted by quanchi112
And the dwarves had war machines. We see Azog have them taken out via command.

You've used the logic generic orcs are greater in a Warcraft thread which you just admitted has no basis for Azog since he's the best.

In a totally different thread. Because the average Warcraft Orc > the average LotR Orc, one-on-one. This is very clear to see.

Now, army vs army is a different story. Because LotR Orc armies have better overall cohesion than their Warcraft counterparts. They fight in formations, have war machines, archers etc., unlike the Warcraft Orcs. But none of these threads are army vs army battles.

Originally posted by quanchi112

No shit. We knew how this was going to end but that's the point of these gigantic against all odds fantasy hero quests. We see the heroes having to work together to take out the overall threat the orcs.

That doesn't change the fact that they lost. If it was truly the age of the Orc, they would have prospered and taken over. The good guys in fantasy-type tales don't always win. Yes, it is part of the story. But the story told has the Orcs losing. You can't get around that. Otherwise, you could apply that logic to any movie ending you don't like and just say, "Oh, they only lost because they were the bad guys". It doesn't work like that.

Originally posted by quanchi112

Yes, I did in the 8th grade but that's neither here nor there since this is a films only thread. Films give the characters tangibility. Peter Jackson isn't perfect but he did a fantastic job with this material and I'd definitely trust him going forward if they ever wrangled the rights to the Simarillion from the Tolkiens.

It is relevant though. Fact is the LotR trilogy is a better adaptation from the books than the Hobbit films are. Jackson added a bunch of filler crap to stretch it out to 3 films. I honestly think that if he had compacted it into one solid film, removing a bunch of unnecessary clutter, it would have been better. He didn't even really want to do the films. He really wanted to do LotR, and that enthusiasm translated onscreen.

Originally posted by quanchi112

I'd definitely put Azog and Bolg's forces against the Uruk Hai, orcs who stormed Helm's Deep in a battlezone if you feel up to the task since you think the hobbit films are just inferior.

*facepalm* Sorry, but this is the stupidest challenge ever. Film quality and army strengths have no relation to each other whatsoever. That'd be like arguing Man of Steel is a better film than Captain America: The Winter Soldier because Superman would beat Cap in a fight. Yet we both know TWS is a far better film than MoS is.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
In a totally different thread. Because the average Warcraft Orc > the average LotR Orc, one-on-one. This is very clear to see.

Now, army vs army is a different story. Because LotR Orc armies have better overall cohesion than their Warcraft counterparts. They fight in formations, have war machines, archers etc., unlike the Warcraft Orcs. But none of these threads are army vs army battles.
Which has no bearing on Azog vs Blackhand just as it had no bearing on Lothar vs. Blackhand. In both films the generic orcs were less than the established characters. Lotr didn't really establish many orcs. That's the difference.


Due to the other people joining together and the good guys winning. The orcs took on various factions aligned together so the context matters. The elves and dwarves are formidable indeed. They were going to win. Azog's strategy of two fronts was brilliant but the Eagles and aid showed up at the end. No other faction could take on the rest if the orcs aligned with anyone else. They are the dominant force in the films. Context matters not just the end result. You seem to be like a prebuscent child who can't grasp context and wants to just look at the end result. Context matters. Always.


That isn't a fact it's subjective. This is taste. You're trying to argue your opinion is correct when that will never make it an objective fact no matter how many agree. Quit giving excuses as to justify your opinion. It's just an opinion.

I never said that determines what's better. I said there were certain things better in the hobbit films than Lotr. Bilbo shits all over Frodo. His performance. Do you disagree ?

I also showed you I'm willing to argue the biggest force from the bad guys seen on screen from Saruman would be defeated by Azog's forces from the Hobbit. Azog would prevail over the bred Uruk Hai. Be a man and let's battlezone this. You'll always try to scurry away like Gandalf when Azog comes at him. Whether it's hiding up a tree or glaring s light to just get the hell out of there.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Which has no bearing on Azog vs Blackhand just as it had no bearing on Lothar vs. Blackhand. In both films the generic orcs were less than the established characters. Lotr didn't really establish many orcs. That's the difference.

Now I am convinced you only read bits and pieces of my posts and just imagine what you want the rest to say. When I commented on the other Orcs, in terms of applying fighting feats to other characters, I was talking in relation to Aragorn and Thorin. You are just rambling at this point.

Originally posted by quanchi112

Due to the other people joining together and the good guys winning. The orcs took on various factions aligned together so the context matters. The elves and dwarves are formidable indeed. They were going to win. Azog's strategy of two fronts was brilliant but the Eagles and aid showed up at the end. No other faction could take on the rest if the orcs aligned with anyone else. They are the dominant force in the films. Context matters not just the end result. You seem to be like a prebuscent child who can't grasp context and wants to just look at the end result. Context matters. Always.

And my point goes right over your head. You used Sauron's statement as an argument for why the Orcs are so great. His statement was wrong. That's the point. And the Orcs had a numbers and prep advantage against the other factions, individually. So, of course banding together made sense. And again, none of this is relevant to 1-on-1 versus matches. If you want to go on about this, go make some army thread.

Also, funny how you go on about context when you are famous for picking and choosing when you want to apply it.

Originally posted by quanchi112

That isn't a fact it's subjective. This is taste. You're trying to argue your opinion is correct when that will never make it an objective fact no matter how many agree. Quit giving excuses as to justify your opinion. It's just an opinion.

You should learn to apply this to yourself, as you constantly act like your opinion is Word of God, even in non-Versus regular film discussions. Fact of the matter is that far more people like the LotR films above the Hobbit films. I said from the get go that you are entitled to your opinion, but you are a minority. It's like you are just arguing for the sake of arguing, to get attention.

Originally posted by quanchi112

I never said that determines what's better. I said there were certain things better in the hobbit films than Lotr. Bilbo shits all over Frodo. His performance. Do you disagree ?

Neither of those were the best Hobbits from the films, IMO. Also, see above about applying subjective opinion/taste to your own posts.

Originally posted by quanchi112

I also showed you I'm willing to argue the biggest force from the bad guys seen on screen from Saruman would be defeated by Azog's forces from the Hobbit. Azog would prevail over the bred Uruk Hai. Be a man and let's battlezone this. You'll always try to scurry away like Gandalf when Azog comes at him. Whether it's hiding up a tree or glaring s light to just get the hell out of there.

Why the actual f*** would I BZ a statement I never made, and which has zero bearing on film quality, which is the discussion topic? I never once stated the Helm's Deep army would beat Azog's force, so why should I BZ it? That's just stupid.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Now I am convinced you only read bits and pieces of my posts and just imagine what you want the rest to say. When I commented on the other Orcs, in terms of applying fighting feats to other characters, I was talking in relation to Aragorn and Thorin. You are just rambling at this point.
No, your main point from the other thread was that Warcraft orcs were better than Lotr orcs. That's meanginless drivel since we are discussing certain characters so enough with that nonsense. These threads involve highly skilled individuals so quit bringing up the generics. We see Aragorn and Thorin how they fare going up against the elites which make them elite. Blackhand has no impressive showings against elites.

How was it wrong ? Just because everyone else teams up to stop them proves my point. Elves and dwarves can't stand each other but guess what when the real badasses show up they put aside their differences because they know they have to.

The dwarves had the terrain advantage. By means of prep they just showed up to attack but the other forces were already ready for battle so they just turned to face the orcs. It wasn't like they were napping when the orcs showed up in the dead of night, they were already fighting each other. My point is the orcs have always been the de factor badass force the other factions need to align to take on. That's a fact. You can't go around it, Lotr Orc hater.

Azog can stand up to any skilled elf, dwarf, or human character from the Lotr universe in the Lotr universe which shows he's one of the few elite out of this entire realm. Sauron wanted him to lead his armies. Azog was undeniably great. He'd beat any Warcraft Orc in battle.


. What am I ignoring then ?


My opinion isn't a fact it's a subjective opinion. I've never said otherwise. I've never denied that but it's just a more shared opinion. False. You're shitting all over the Hobbit films and I won't allow that. Azog was unmistakably great. The scenes with Sauron were awesome. Smaug was also well done. The fight scenes were just as good as the Lotr massive battles but I enjoyed the battle of the five armies more than Helms Deep or any Return of the King battle. Azog fills the role of the superior trilogy villain. I'm not including Sauron since he was always a background character trying to come back to power and his true form.

What hobbit from the Lotr was better than Bilbo ?

So do you agree with me that Azog would beat the shit out of those Uruk hai bred by Saruman who stormed Helms Deep. Do you agree with me ? Take a position.

You come up with an awful lot of excuses as to avoid a judged debate against me despite your blatant posturing.

Originally posted by quanchi112
No, your main point from the other thread was that Warcraft orcs were better than Lotr orcs. That's meanginless drivel since we are discussing certain characters so enough with that nonsense. These threads involve highly skilled individuals so quit bringing up the generics. We see Aragorn and Thorin how they fare going up against the elites which make them elite. Blackhand has no impressive showings against elites.

Thank you for proving my point. I said general Orcs in Warcraft were shown to be better than general LotR Orcs. This does not contradict any statement I made about Azog. I made that as a comment to say that Aragorn & Thorin beating regular Orcs isn't that impressive, but I never said it's the only measure of their skill. FFS, I even pointed out that both are skilled when I was discussing the match I made between them. Blackhand had implied superiority to most Warcraft Orcs, given the context of his position in the hierarchy.

Originally posted by quanchi112

How was it wrong ? Just because everyone else teams up to stop them proves my point. Elves and dwarves can't stand each other but guess what when the real badasses show up they put aside their differences because they know they have to.

Fighting together against a numerically superior force is just common sense.

Originally posted by quanchi112

The dwarves had the terrain advantage. By means of prep they just showed up to attack but the other forces were already ready for battle so they just turned to face the orcs. It wasn't like they were napping when the orcs showed up in the dead of night, they were already fighting each other. My point is the orcs have always been the de factor badass force the other factions need to align to take on. That's a fact. You can't go around it, Lotr Orc hater.

Azog can stand up to any skilled elf, dwarf, or human character from the Lotr universe in the Lotr universe which shows he's one of the few elite out of this entire realm. Sauron wanted him to lead his armies. Azog was undeniably great. He'd beat any Warcraft Orc in battle.

Who said they were napping? Fact is Azog made his plans long before the Dwarves and Elves did. Preparation, planning, and working out long term strategy for battle goes a long way. This is common sense.

When did I say he couldn't fight others in the LotR universe?

And about beating any Warcraft Orc is your opinion. One which several people disagree with, and have presented arguments to back their stance. If you don't agree, that is your opinion too, just as the rest is other people's opinions. None of this shit is real, and characters from different universes will never actually fight onscreen, so all of it is down to interpretation and speculation.

Oooh, "LotR Orc hater". You really need to try harder with your insults.

Originally posted by quanchi112

. What am I ignoring then ?


You often ignore it across multiple threads when it suits you.


Originally posted by quanchi112

My opinion isn't a fact it's a subjective opinion. I've never said otherwise. I've never denied that but it's just a more shared opinion. False. You're shitting all over the Hobbit films and I won't allow that. Azog was unmistakably great. The scenes with Sauron were awesome. Smaug was also well done. The fight scenes were just as good as the Lotr massive battles but I enjoyed the battle of the five armies more than Helms Deep or any Return of the King battle. Azog fills the role of the superior trilogy villain. I'm not including Sauron since he was always a background character trying to come back to power and his true form.

And everything you just stated is your opinion. And it is common knowledge that most people prefer the LotR trilogy to the Hobbit films. Even 10 minutes of online research can tell you as much.

Originally posted by quanchi112

What hobbit from the Lotr was better than Bilbo ?

I found Merry and Pippin to be the most entertaining out of all the Hobbits in the films. I felt like they worked really well because they had a great dynamic between them. And this is my opinion. Some people didn't like those two. And they are entitled to feel that way.

Originally posted by quanchi112

So do you agree with me that Azog would beat the shit out of those Uruk hai bred by Saruman who stormed Helms Deep. Do you agree with me ? Take a position.

Well, considering all the Uruk-hai basically had were some ladders and a bomb, whereas Azog's army even had were-worms, the Uruk-hai are at a distinct disadvantage and would likely lose. They also didn't seem to have much of a battle plan other than "get inside Helm's Deep," nor did they appear to have any notable commander on the ground, at the battle. You only need a bit of common sense to realise a better prepped army would do better.


Originally posted by quanchi112

You come up with an awful lot of excuses as to avoid a judged debate against me despite your blatant posturing.

LMAO... It's not excuses. It's just refusing to put up with your nonsense. When people BZ something, it is when the posters took opposing stances to something. I never said shit about Helm's Deep Uruk-hai, so I have nothing to prove. It'd be the same as me challenging you to some nonsense BZ about a claim you never made, and then accusing you of making excuses if you don't agree to it. You should try your baiting tactics with a newer member. I've seen you pull this crap before, and am not falling for it.

Anyway, this has veered so far off topic that it might as well be a different thread altogether. I come to these boards as a minor form of entertainment when I am taking breaks from work and such. You are boring me at this point. I am seriously getting tired of repeating the same things over and over again. You can keep on ranting if you want, but there are other, newer threads to discuss, some even featuring your idol, Azog. But if you really want to keep discussing the armies, just make a new thread for it already.

The hobbit films were okay. The one thing I like in them that we don't see in the LoTR trilogy is we get to see people like Sauron, Saruman, Galadriel, etc. cut loose. It was cool to, in some way, see why they were so afraid of Sauron coming back. Oh I also like how much of a dick the father of Legolas is.

On the other hand, just the love and care that went into the LoTR trilogy..it just doesn't seem to be there in the Hobbit films. That is how I see it Also IMO it should not have been a trilogy, but just 2 films.

I'm also going to call attention to the elephant in the room: whats with the wizard with the bird shit all over his face? And the rabbit sled or whatever? Yeah, I could of done without those things to be honest.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Thank you for proving my point. I said general Orcs in Warcraft were shown to be better than general LotR Orcs. This does not contradict any statement I made about Azog. I made that as a comment to say that Aragorn & Thorin beating regular Orcs isn't that impressive, but I never said it's the only measure of their skill. FFS, I even pointed out that both are skilled when I was discussing the match I made between them. Blackhand had implied superiority to most Warcraft Orcs, given the context of his position in the hierarchy.
The relative ease in which Thorin and Aragorn defeat the orcs show they stand in comparison. Just as Azog stomps dwarves and even recognized dwarves shows he's in the elite class. Anyone they have shown and built up is better than the rest. This isn't just an Lotr thing either. It's the same in Warcract. Highly skilled humans and orcs slaughter the other generics.

Blackhand was greater than generic orcs just as Durotan, etc. any other portrayed Orc. You're giving him more credit than he deserves especially when gauging his performance against a highly skilled human in Lothar. That's why he falls dramatically off against Azog.

So you admit the orcs were the dominant force due to their numbers. That's what I've been saying, even Gandalf said these orcs were bred for war. They are fighters. Watch the film again since you give them no credit.


And the elves and dwarves were ready for combat. They were aligned in formations ready for combat. They didn't know he was coming despite Gandalf's warnings but all they had to do was turn and face them. This is common sense.

So you agree with my opinion.

My opinion is well supported and makes sense when we factor in the tendencies, feats, and skills of the characters. I am consistent in my standards whereas yours change when it comes to certain Warcraft characters.



Well you don't give them any credit. I ignore nothing.


So you are in agreement both are opinions and neither is a fact. I never disputed the Lotr films are more well liked.


So you enjoyed the comedic aspects but they weren't essential to the story. Bilbo and Frodo were essential to the tasks at hand. Bilbo was the best hobbit hands down IMO.


They had crossbows as well and there were iirc 10,000. So you agree Azog would win. Good. The were-worms weren't used in combat just to dig the tunnels. I wouldn't argue they suddenly join the fray.

I never said you were a coward since you never took that position. But let's talk about a stance you have made. Warcraft orcs vs Lotr orcs.

I'll take Azog and Bolg's combined forces against Gul'dan's forces in the final battle. Would you accept this challenge since you've already made your stance clear on Warcraft orcs being superior. Let's do it.

Quan could Azog beat Khan?!

Quit going off topic and stick to the relevant subject at hand.

That is a good idea, I will sit back and watch your arguments get repeatedly destroyed. Carry on.

My arguments are all sound and well supported. Always. Begone, troll.

Right.

Concession accepted.