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Prime Dooku. Rested and healed after each round; starting distance is 20 meters.

Warmup: Foundry Revan

1. MW Revan

2. Darth Revan

3. KotOR Revan (end of KotOR)

4. Novel Revan

5. Prime Revan (both halves united + the knowledge and experience of SoR Revan)

Where does he stop and why?

Clears.

Stops at 2.

Originally posted by UCanShootMyNova
Clears.
I still don't get the whole, "I'm going to write fake answers on the forums" act.

:>

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
I still don't get the whole, "I'm going to write fake answers on the forums" act.
Is there a reason you get triggered by the opinions of dudes regarding fictional characters?

Originally posted by Rockydonovang
Is there a reason you get triggered by the opinions of dudes regarding fictional characters?
*cringe*

Please don't comment on matters you don't understand.

Then again, that sort of sums up every post you ever made here, so I doubt you'd heed my advice.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
*cringe*


Is your face alright ant man?

Could stop at 2 depending on one's views of certain quotes and scaling

Clears

Stops at 3.

Can someone explain how Dooku beats SOR Revan?!

Stops at 2, maybe 3

Originally posted by godemperortrump
Stops at 2, maybe 3

"Being undominated by Yoda"

When you watch the movie its a different case.
Force attacks were reflected back, Yoda didn't attack once. When he did, he was shown to send Sidious flying across the room. Dooku's vast superior.

He then resorted to lightsaber combat in which he was pushed back, and forced to flee.

Then there is that list of quotes, that contradict primary showings in G canon.

That then further backs their narrative that Anakin is Yoda/Sidious level, because he dominated Dooku on the invisible hand.

On his best day, he gets to Redeemed Revan.

Originally posted by Haschwalth
"Being undominated by Yoda"

When you watch the movie its a different case.
Force attacks were reflected back, Yoda didn't attack once. When he did, he was shown to send Sidious flying across the room. Dooku's vast superior.

He then resorted to lightsaber combat in which he was pushed back, and forced to flee.

Then there is that list of quotes, that contradict primary showings in G canon.

That then further backs their narrative that Anakin is Yoda/Sidious level, because he dominated Dooku on the invisible hand.

What are you talking about? Is this a really bad troll?

Anyway, Sidious has fought evenly with superior duelists to Anakin (Mace and Yoda)

The fight against Mace mind you, was too fast for Anakin to even see...

Sheev has greater physical stats, versatility, experience, force abilities etc. so I'm struggling to see Anakin as one who is on the level of Yoda or Sidious.

Originally posted by godemperortrump
What are you talking about? Is this a really bad troll?

Anyway, Sidious has fought evenly with superior duelists to Anakin (Mace and Yoda)

The fight against Mace mind you, was too fast for Anakin to even see...

Sheev has greater physical stats, versatility, experience, force abilities etc. so I'm struggling to see Anakin as one who is on the level of Yoda or Sidious.

TBF, Mace and Yoda both disarmed Sidious.
There argument is that Anakin was conflicted so he wasn't as strong then as when he went knightfall. Then use Greatest Jedi ever quotes to back it, when its contradiction.

They say he is in the same ballpark, just lower tier if Yoda/Sidious were high tier, in that realm of power.

Clears

Originally posted by Haschwalth
TBF, Mace and Yoda both disarmed Sidious.
There argument is that Anakin was conflicted so he wasn't as strong then as when he went knightfall. Then use Greatest Jedi ever quotes to back it, when its contradiction.

They say he is in the same ballpark, just lower tier if Yoda/Sidious were high tier, in that realm of power.

Sids was only 'disarmed' by Mace after a gruelling, even duel because he needed to sell his 'helplessness' to Anakin.

Yoda did rid Sidious of his lightsabers pretty quickly but the force fight went his way.

His 'greatest Jedi ever' quotes? The one where Dooku and Sidious call him the greatest Jedi alive? Strange that the greatest Jedi alive gets outmuscled by Savage (with the help of Obi-Wan) and struggles with Ventress (With the help of Obi-Wan). Those two old men are senile.

He has the raw power to exceed Yoda/Sheev tier, but his range of abilities and force defence aren't there.

EDIT: Are you trying to say Anakin could beat Sidious or Yoda? Or arguing that he's more powerful than them? Because if it's the latter I would agree and admit I may have misjudged your argument. There are many many quotes dubbing Anakin as "The most powerful Jedi in history" or "The most powerful Jedi in a millennium"

Likely stops at SoR Revan.

@Trump

I'm not arguing lol, i'm giving their(they) Arguments.

Right...

Originally posted by godemperortrump
Right...

What i'm trying to get at is that is not my opinion or belief.
It's arguments i've seen from other people.

Furthest he possibly gets is 4, could conceivably see him losing earlier

Originally posted by godemperortrump
Anyway, Sidious has fought evenly with superior duelists to Anakin (Mace and Yoda).
Except Anakin is better than either Mace or Yoda as a swordsman, lol.

At the very least, on par with Yoda.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Except Anakin is better than either Mace or Yoda as a swordsman, lol.

At the very least, on par with Yoda.

Thank goodness you edited it to that.....

No way in hell Anakin is a better duelist than Yoda...

He's said to be better by multiple high-ranking sources.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
He's said to be better by multiple high-ranking sources.

Where? I've only seen, gillards 9s, with Yoda/Sidious.

Yoda's plenty of quotes putting him at the top with the actual combats feats to back it, unlike anakin who only outmatched Dooku.

More sources put Anakin as the most powerful Jedi as of ROTS than Yoda. And said sources are all of higher value.

Also, Anakin's performance against Dooku is more impressive than anything Yoda has ever done.

And, here's one of numerous quotes noting Anakin's supremacy:

Anakin's style has changed completely between Episode II and Episode III. He now no longer cares. He knows he's unbeatable. He's far more dangerous than anybody in the universe.

Yeah no, it's not more impressive than Yoda Disarming a far superior duelist called Sheev Palpatine.

"far more dangerous than anybody" sounds like a load of bullshit tbh.
Both Yoda and Sidious during their duel confirm he isn't above them.
Sidious is more dangerous than Anakin, same with Yoda.

I'd like to see feats that surpass Yoda's before I take the " Hes unbeatable" at face value.

It's... not though. Anakin outright dominating Dooku in such an amount of time is something Yoda blatantly couldn't do in AotC.

Except Gillard wrote that duel and still considered Anakin as far more dangerous, so clearly not.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Except Anakin is better than either Mace or Yoda as a swordsman, lol.

At the very least, on par with Yoda.

In terms of pure skill only? ehh sure, whatever. But Anakin isn't as quick or strong as Yoda.

Care to address this 'on par with Yoda' duelists' showings against Ventress and Savage? Can't imagine the Grandmaster struggling against them...

Do people think TCW Anakin and ROTS Anakin are the same person?

And yeah, Anakin is on par with Yoda/Sidious.

Originally posted by godemperortrump
In terms of pure skill only? ehh sure, whatever. But Anakin isn't as quick or strong as Yoda.
Ironically, there is a Lucas-approved quote specifically stating Anakin is the fastest and strongest Jedi in ROTS.

Anakin's physical strength demonstrated vs Dooku is more impressive than any in-combat strength feat in the mythos.

In regards to speed, a case can be made that Yoda is faster, but then again Anakin is outright stated to be faster, so...

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Ironically, there is a Lucas-approved quote specifically stating Anakin is the fastest and strongest Jedi in ROTS.

Anakin's physical strength demonstrated vs Dooku is more impressive than any in-combat strength feat in the mythos.

In regards to speed, better case can be made that Yoda is faster, but then again Anakin is outright stated to be faster, so...

Why is that the most impressive in-combat strength feat in the mythos? This is canon Dooku, the same guy who got overwhelmed by pre-prime Savage Opress' strength, sending him flying into a wall with such force he dropped his saber.

Unless you believe Dooku's own strength increased dramatically from mid-late TCW to ROTS

Keep in mind Maul had no problem easily batting away a more seasoned and trained Savage's strikes.

Provide the quotes pls.

The "far more dangerous than anybody in the universe" quote is being taken seriously? A huge shit ton of evidence directly contradicts that.

Anakin may be on a similar class when compared with Yoda/Sidious, but he hasn't surpassed them, lmao.

Anakin is better than Yoda based on their respective performances against Dooku.

A Lot of it would of been due to Lightsaber styles.

Due to a different style Anakin can do in three seconds what Yoda couldn't do in 30?

Shii cho is bad facing up against Makashi.
Djem So is better with dealing Makashi, as it breaks his rhythm.

Holy shit, that still doesn't makes stomping Dooku in three moves less impressive than failing to beat him in 30 seconds lmfao.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
Due to a different style Anakin can do in three seconds what Yoda couldn't do in 30?

And depending on where, you believe anakin had his boost, it was anywhere between 11 to 30 seconds.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
Holy shit, that still doesn't makes stomping Dooku in three moves less impressive than failing to beat him in 30 seconds lmfao.

I'm not saying it does.
I believe Yoda disarming Sidious is a better feat than Anakin disarming Dooku in like 15 seconds.

It depends if you think Yoda could beat Dooku in 15 seconds as well.

Originally posted by godemperortrump
Why is that the most impressive in-combat strength feat in the mythos? This is canon Dooku, the same guy who got overwhelmed by pre-prime Savage Opress' strength, sending him flying into a wall with such force he dropped his saber.

Unless you believe Dooku's own strength increased dramatically from mid-late TCW to ROTS

Keep in mind Maul had no problem easily batting away a more seasoned and trained Savage's strikes.

Provide the quotes pls.
Wait, why is this Canon Dooku?

Regardless, let's do a comparison:

Anakin Skywalker vs Dooku:

Attack One: "The first overhand chop of Skywalker's blade slid off Dooku's instinctive guard."

Attack Two: "The second bent Dooku's wrist."

Attack Three: "The third flash of blue forced Dooku's scarlet blade so far to the inside that his own lightsaber scorched his shoulder, and Dooku was forced to give ground."

Continued: "Skywalker came on, mechanically inexorable, impossibly powerful, a destroyer droid with a lightsaber: each step a blow and each blow a step. Dooku backed away as fast as he dared; Skywalker stayed right on top of him. Dooku's breath went short and hard. He no longer tried to block Skywalker's strikes but only to guide them slanting away; he could not meet Skywalker strength-to-strength - not only did the boy wield tremendous reserves of Force energy, but his sheer physical power was astonishing."

Continued: "Skywalker was all over him. The shining blue lightsaber whirled and spat and every overhand chop crashed against Dooku's defense with the unstoppable power of a meteor strike; the Sith Lord spent lavishly of his reserve of the Force merely to meet these attacks without being cut in half, and Skywalker- Skywalker was getting stronger. Each parry cost Dooku more power than he'd used to throw Kenobi across the room; each block aged him a decade. He decided he'd best revise his strategy once again. He no longer even tried to strike back. Force exhaustion began to close down his perceptions, drawing his consciousness back down to his physical form, trapping him within his own skull until he could barely even feel the contours of the room around him; he dimly sensed stairs at his back, stairs that led up to the entrance balcony. He retreated up them, using the higher ground for leverage, but Skywalker just kept on coming, tirelessly ferocious. That blue blade was everywhere, flashing and whirling faster and faster until Dooku saw the room through an electric haze and now Kenobi was back in the picture: with a shout of the Force, he shot like a torpedo up the stairs behind Skywalker, and Dooku decided that under these rather extreme circumstances, it was at least arguably permissible for a gentleman to cheat."

Yoda vs Dooku::

"Yoda's green blade caught the blow, holding the red lightsaber at bay, locking the two in a contest of strength, physical and of the Force."

So, you've already agreed Anakin is likely as skilled as Yoda, and as now established, Anakin is likewise stronger and faster.

Anakin is better.



In my debating career I've yet to see a semblance of a proper contradiction to it. Please, enlighten me.



We saw them fight and know he cannot under normal conditions.



Well, for one, let's note Yoda and Sidious are equals - Yoda disarmed Sidious purely due to the environment.

What you're effectively stating is that Yoda > Anakin because Yoda = Sidious, but Gillard has put Anakin on par with (or above) their level.

EDIT: Ah, and the quote you wanted (@Trump):

This is Anakin Skywalker:

The most powerful Jedi of his generation. Perhaps of any generation. The fastest. The strongest. An unbeatable pilot. An unstoppable warrior. On the ground, in the air or sea or space, there is no one even close. He has not just power, not just skill, but dash: that rare, invaluable combination of boldness and grace.

He is the best there is at what he does. The best there has ever been. And he knows it.

4.

Are people arguing Anakin>Yoda?

@Ant

Yoda never wanted to kill Dooku, just arrest him. Also, Yoda would have a hard time killing his former friend and Padawan, it's not in his character.

There's no reason for him to go all out with a rampant assault because he never wanted Dooku dead like Anakin.

The script has Yoda outright attempting to kill Dooku.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
EDIT: Ah, and the quote you wanted (@Trump):

This is Anakin Skywalker:

The most powerful Jedi of his generation. Perhaps of any generation. The fastest. The strongest. An unbeatable pilot. An unstoppable warrior. On the ground, in the air or sea or space, there is no one even close. He has not just power, not just skill, but dash: that rare, invaluable combination of boldness and grace.

He is the best there is at what he does. The best there has ever been. And he knows it.

Where is this quote from? This is clearly hyperbole. This warrior has been stopped on the ground and in the sea. He has been overwhelmed by other's strength.

Originally posted by godemperortrump
Where is this quote from? This is clearly hyperbole. This warrior has been stopped on the ground and in the sea. He has been overwhelmed by other's strength.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HwX7HHxv53g&t=2m39s

The ROTS novel. The quote isn't saying Anakin has never been overwhelmed. It's stating that Anakin is, currently, unbeatable - as in no one is strong enough to beat him. Since you never read the ROTS novel, you seem to be under the false impression Anakin as of late-TCW is even loosely comparable to ROTS Anakin - he's not. The book states numerous times that Anakin's power and skill increased vastly out in the Outer Rim Sieges. The notion of hyperbole is further unsupported by the fact Nick Gillard literally echoes the same sentiment when he also states Anakin is unstoppable. As it stands, during the time of the quote, which is during the Battle of Coruscant, Anakin is the best.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HwX7HHxv53g&t=2m39s

The ROTS novel. The quote isn't saying Anakin has never been overwhelmed. It's stating that Anakin is, currently, unbeatable - as in no one is strong enough to beat him. Since you never read the ROTS novel, you seem to be under the false impression Anakin as of late-TCW is even loosely comparable to ROTS Anakin - he's not. The book states numerous times that Anakin's power and skill increased vastly out in the Outer Rim Sieges. The notion of hyperbole is further unsupported by the fact Nick Gillard literally echoes the same sentiment when he also states Anakin is unstoppable. As it stands, during the time of the quote, which is during the Battle of Coruscant, Anakin is the best.

Doesn't Gillard state that Anakin is an 8 at the start of the movie?

Well, sure, but since we're talking specifically about Anakin here, it's obviously not that black and white. Anakin is a tier nine as of ROTS. The issue is he is hindered by Jedi restraints and crippling fear, making him a tier eight since he isn't utilizing his tier nine abilities to the fullest. As Dooku notes, he is intentionally restraining himself, but at the end of the fight, Anakin casts aside his restrictions and becomes a tier nine that is, in many respects, greater than Yoda or Darth Sidious. Of course note the distinction between this and Anakin's full-potential, which is not yet attainable for Anakin.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HwX7HHxv53g&t=2m39s

The ROTS novel. The quote isn't saying Anakin has never been overwhelmed. It's stating that Anakin is, currently, unbeatable - as in no one is strong enough to beat him. Since you never read the ROTS novel, you seem to be under the false impression Anakin as of late-TCW is even loosely comparable to ROTS Anakin - he's not. The book states numerous times that Anakin's power and skill increased vastly out in the Outer Rim Sieges. The notion of hyperbole is further unsupported by the fact Nick Gillard literally echoes the same sentiment when he also states Anakin is unstoppable. As it stands, during the time of the quote, which is during the Battle of Coruscant, Anakin is the best.
Yeah I was. I have read it, just obviously too long ago. Well I'm perfectly happy to say I was wrong if this means we can lowball Yoda now. I hope Anakin is the new wank

Originally posted by godemperortrump
Yeah I was. I have read it, just obviously too long ago. Well I'm perfectly happy to say I was wrong if this means we can lowball Yoda now. I hope Anakin is the new wank
Welcome to the Anakin Brigade (circa 2016).

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Welcome to the Anakin Brigade (circa 2016).
Everyone had Anakin > Yoda last year? Don't think so...

Anakin is on par with or above Yoda, as of Knightfall, tbh.

Originally posted by godemperortrump
Everyone had Anakin > Yoda last year? Don't think so...

Well, it's a gradual process. It started with a few members, such as NewGuy, Ellimist, and I. Now it's really gaining steam as members, sometimes in dismay, realize every quote of authority has favored Anakin either on par with or above Yoda.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Well, sure, but since we're talking specifically about Anakin here, it's obviously not that black and white. Anakin is a tier nine as of ROTS. The issue is he is hindered by Jedi restraints and crippling fear, making him a tier eight since he isn't utilizing his tier nine abilities to the fullest. As Dooku notes, he is intentionally restraining himself, but at the end of the fight, Anakin casts aside his restrictions and becomes a tier nine that is, in many respects, greater than Yoda or Darth Sidious. Of course note the distinction between this and Anakin's full-potential, which is not yet attainable for Anakin.

Anakin is only referred to as a 9 when DS.

This comes down to whether or not you want to side with Gillard or the Novel. If Anakin is an 8 at the beginning of the movie. He's not the best and that's all there is too it.

Dooku's treatment in the novel is very much an outlier. The Junior novel has him being inexhaustible and Anakin only able to achieve a stalemate. The movie has Dooku kicking around both of them and is smiling in Anakin's face like a schoolboy all the way until the final 3 blows.

Anakin being DS and Anakin releasing his restraints are effectively the same thing.

Addressed.

Well, the junior novel has no semblance of authority compared to the novel or film, so let's ignore that. In regards to the film, we see Anakin push Dooku in a retreat up the staircase when they engage in a one on one confrontation. There's not much to say about Anakin vs Dooku until after the Dun Moch since all the fighting is short and constantly interrupted, but we never see Dooku in a retreat like that against Yoda in AOTC. Point being, the film has enough room for differing interpretations that we should refer to the novel, which is the next highest canonical authority since Lucas line-edited it. If contradictions exist, Lucas clearly doesn't seem to think they are significant. In the novel, it paints a clear picture of Anakin's supremacy, so I'm inclined to view the film staircase sequence as, likewise, a visual version of Anakin's domination of Dooku.

Anakin is not above Yoda or Sidious yet, maybe on their level.
As they literally state, "He will become more powerful than either of us", during their battle.

Sidious' opinion isn't as valid as various quotes in-universe and from Gillard, kek.

Especially when Sidious also thinks that Anakin is possibly more powerful than himself.

Originally posted by Haschwalth
Anakin is not above Yoda or Sidious yet, maybe on their level.
As they literally state, "He will become more powerful than either of us", during their battle.
Our discussion thus far has mostly been above combative power.

Anakin's applicable power exceeds Sidious and Yoda, but it's clear his mastery is not on their level yet.

Also, what Skillz said.

Yeah, I thought Supreme was referring to overall force/combat capabilities.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Anakin being DS and Anakin releasing his restraints are effectively the same thing.

Addressed.

Well, the junior novel has no semblance of authority compared to the novel or film, so let's ignore that. In regards to the film, we see Anakin push Dooku in a retreat up the staircase when they engage in a one on one confrontation. There's not much to say about Anakin vs Dooku until after the Dun Moch since all the fighting is short and constantly interrupted, but we never see Dooku in a retreat like that against Yoda in AOTC. Point being, the film has enough room for differing interpretations that we should refer to the novel, which is the next highest canonical authority since Lucas line-edited it. If contradictions exist, Lucas clearly doesn't seem to think they are significant. In the novel, it paints a clear picture of Anakin's supremacy, so I'm inclined to view the film staircase sequence as, likewise, a visual version of Anakin's domination of Dooku.
What does the script say regarding Anakin vs Dooku?

Also, the senior novel happens to have the depiction of the fight that is the most unaligned with the movie. Likely cause it was based off an earlier script.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Sidious' opinion isn't as valid as various quotes in-universe and from Gillard, kek.

Especially when Sidious also thinks that Anakin is possibly more powerful than himself.
He said potentially more powerful

Potentially means:

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Anakin is on par with or above Yoda, as of Knightfall, tbh.
So you have Anakin on par with Sidious?

lol @this knightfall wank, its getting out of hand, cut down on the adderall skillz

Originally posted by ChocolateMuesli
lol @this knightfall wank, its getting out of hand, cut down on the adderall skillz
Blasphemy

Clears

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Anakin is on par with or above Yoda, as of Knightfall, tbh.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Yoda > Anakin and Kenobi duo.

mmm

(8 months of enlightenment later).

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
mmm
Zoltan's back. Must have sensed too much positivity at KMC and has to come rain on some fanboy parades

You think zoltan's gonna counter anything? Kek.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
You think zoltan's gonna counter anything? Kek.
No I think Zoltan's going to mock and insult everything.

Originally posted by ChocolateMuesli
lol @this knightfall wank, its getting out of hand, cut down on the adderall skillz

Gotta acknowledge the facts.

https://i.imgur.com/w8i6ho2.gif