Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

Strange has time time

Loki has mind gem

Strange beats.

Time gem > mind gem?

Originally posted by TethAdamTheRock
Time gem > mind gem?

No.

Time Gem = Mind Gem.

But Strange is already > Loki when magic is concerned.

Strange wins with gems. Without gems Loki wins.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Strange wins with gems. Without gems Loki wins.

Strange is above Loki in terms of magic.

Ragnarok proved that.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Strange is above Loki in terms of magic.

Ragnarok proved that.

Yes and No. In Ragnarok, Strange had the benefit of prep and foreknowledge that Loki didn't have. And while I'm convinced that Strange is capable of much bigger magical acts, he's also slower on the draw and far weaker physically than Loki. In fact other than bfr, I can't really see how Strange can beat Loki. And for bfr to work Strange needs a few seconds of prep... seconds that he might not have when trying to dodge daggers.

So, when the OP says Loki gets the Mind Stone, does that mean he gets it in the scepter, like he had it for Avengers?

Yes

How does that help him against the time gem in any way?

He can blast him energy/ take over his mind

Did anyone ever bring up that Loki fell for 30 minutes a was just annoyed? Durability feat maybe?

Originally posted by juggerman
Did anyone ever bring up that Loki fell for 30 minutes a was just annoyed? Durability feat maybe?


He already survived a seemingly bottomless fall at the end of Thor1.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Yes and No. In Ragnarok, Strange had the benefit of prep and foreknowledge that Loki didn't have. And while I'm convinced that Strange is capable of much bigger magical acts, he's also slower on the draw and far weaker physically than Loki. In fact other than bfr, I can't really see how Strange can beat Loki. And for bfr to work Strange needs a few seconds of prep... seconds that he might not have when trying to dodge daggers.

Prep?

I don't recall Strange receiving a message saying that Loki was going to be on Earth 2 days before! Which means that Strange detected Loki the moment he stepped on Earth. It also means he was able to create a pocket dimension on the same spot where Loki was standing!

Doesn't matter how physically powerful Loki is. Strange's magic could even defeat the Hulk if need be!

Strange>Loki.

Time Stone=Mind Stone

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Prep?

I don't recall Strange receiving a message saying that Loki was going to be on Earth 2 days before! Which means that Strange detected Loki the moment he stepped on Earth. It also means he was able to create a pocket dimension on the same spot where Loki was standing!

Doesn't matter how physically powerful Loki is. Strange's magic could even defeat the Hulk if need be!

Strange>Loki.

Time Stone=Mind Stone

You do know that prep doesn't need to be measured in days to be considered prep right?

If Strange knew that Loki was on earth as soon as Loki got to earth then Strange had at least a minute of prep when Thor and Loki were talking in front of the demolished building, then Strange spent another few seconds building the portal in Loki's feet before actually getting it to open. All this done when Loki had no idea he was being attacked. That's prep time.

Then Strange went through a bunch of books in the sanctum figuring out how to open the portal to Norway then opened it before he dropped Loki. So when Loki decided to attack the portal had already been opened (again with a lot of prep) and all Strange needed to do was move the portal in on Loki.

In short, Dr. Strange had the benefit of being able to prepare his attacks even before Loki was aware of them. That's some pretty concrete prep.

^

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
So, when the OP says Loki gets the Mind Stone, does that mean he gets it in the scepter, like he had it for Avengers?

I don't think it really matters. The mind gem is great for making puppet armies and subterfuge but in a straight up fight it doesn't really add anything for Loki. If he's already close enough to Strange to touch him with the stone/staff to brainwash him then he'd be better off just putting a knife through his heart.

The only real advantage is that the scepter can make for some pretty powerful energy blasts but compared to the time gem's ability, that's a pretty crappy swap in a straight up fight.

Originally posted by FrothByte
You do know that prep doesn't need to be measured in days to be considered prep right?

If Strange knew that Loki was on earth as soon as Loki got to earth then Strange had at least a minute of prep when Thor and Loki were talking in front of the demolished building, then Strange spent another few seconds building the portal in Loki's feet before actually getting it to open. All this done when Loki had no idea he was being attacked. That's prep time.

Then Strange went through a bunch of books in the sanctum figuring out how to open the portal to Norway then opened it before he dropped Loki. So when Loki decided to attack the portal had already been opened (again with a lot of prep) and all Strange needed to do was move the portal in on Loki.

In short, Dr. Strange had the benefit of being able to prepare his attacks even before Loki was aware of them. That's some pretty concrete prep.

Lol!!!!!

Okay. When i said Strange had no prep time, i wasnt being literal!!!

But thanks for admitting Strange doesnt require much prep time to defeat Loki!

Considering that the scene from where Loki arrives to Earth to the moment he was captured was arround a minute.

This means Strange had 1 minute to:
A. Find out Loki was on Earth.
B. Decide what to do.
C. Create the pocket dimension.

Its clear Strange's magic is far superior to Loki's.

Now that you mention it.

I review the scene. Strange clearly states that he must make sure the spell works the same way for Asgardians.

So it isnt like Strange didng know how to open a portal. He was just making sure Thor appeared the same way on the other side of it.

Else who knows...Thor's head could appear on his ass...

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Lol!!!!!

Okay. When i said Strange had no prep time, i wasnt being literal!!!

But thanks for admitting Strange doesnt require much prep time to defeat Loki!

Considering that the scene from where Loki arrives to Earth to the moment he was captured was arround a minute.

This means Strange had 1 minute to:
A. Find out Loki was on Earth.
B. Decide what to do.
C. Create the pocket dimension.

Its clear Strange's magic is far superior to Loki's.

Now that you mention it.

I review the scene. Strange clearly states that he must make sure the spell works the same way for Asgardians.

So it isnt like Strange didng know how to open a portal. He was just making sure Thor appeared the same way on the other side of it.

Else who knows...Thor's head could appear on his ass...

Ok let's start simple: What's the fastest we've seen Dr. Strange open a portal? And I'm talking about a scene where we actually see him start to make a portal to when he completes it, so don't give me a feat of where the portal is already open without us seeing how he did it.

And then tell me how fast Loki makes illusions and throws knives.

P.S. - I'm not disputing that Strange is a more powerful magic user. I'm saying Loki's skills give him the advantage in a straight up fight.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
He already survived a seemingly bottomless fall at the end of Thor1.

We don't see him land though so it's hard to say what impact that had on him. Maybe Thanos had him slowed down and caught safely.

I bring this up because a fall from the helicarrier KO'd Hulk and scared Thor. Neither of those falls were 30mins

Originally posted by juggerman
We don't see him land though so it's hard to say what impact that had on him. Maybe Thanos had him slowed down and caught safely.

I bring this up because a fall from the helicarrier KO'd Hulk and scared Thor. Neither of those falls were 30mins

In that same vein, we don't see what/where Loki was falling through for that time period. He might have been falling through a dimension where gravity works differently to Earth. If he hit Strange's floor at terminal velocity, he would have at least visibly damaged it, even if not damaging himself.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
In that same vein, we don't see what/where Loki was falling through for that time period. He might have been falling through a dimension where gravity works differently to Earth. If he hit Strange's floor at terminal velocity, he would have at least visibly damaged it, even if not damaging himself.

Good point. My initial response was going to be "magic floor" but that same argument could be used for the actual falling.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Ok let's start simple: What's the fastest we've seen Dr. Strange open a portal? And I'm talking about a scene where we actually see him start to make a portal to when he completes it, so don't give me a feat of where the portal is already open without us seeing how he did it.

And then tell me how fast Loki makes illusions and throws knives.

P.S. - I'm not disputing that Strange is a more powerful magic user. I'm saying Loki's skills give him the advantage in a straight up fight.

https://youtu.be/KmSb4VYAUhU

Minute 2.

I counted 2-3 seconds... you?

Loki isnt Hela. He can summon knives...not create a rain of knives.

Considering that, Strange's Energy shields and whips plus his Reality Warping abilities 》》》》》》 Loki.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
No.

Time Gem = Mind Gem.

But Strange is already > Loki when magic is concerned.

Not all the gems are equal. The time gem is far more powerful than the mind gem it seems. You can't die with the time gem. We saw Loki needed to make physical contact with a person to put them under his control.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
https://youtu.be/KmSb4VYAUhU

Minute 2.

I counted 2-3 seconds... you?

Loki isnt Hela. He can summon knives...not create a rain of knives.

Considering that, Strange's Energy shields and whips plus his Reality Warping abilities 》》》》》》 Loki.

I think you'e a bit off. From the moment Strange moves his hands to the moment the portal is set enough to step through, takes him 3-4 seconds. But fine, let's keep it at 3.

Loki in comparison makes illusions instantly as we've seen him do multiple times before. He can throw a dagger in a fraction of a second.

So if Strange takes 3 seconds to build a portal, that means he could be riddled with at least 3 daggers before he's through. That's not even taking into account Loki creating illusions all around him and all attacking him at the same time.

Strange can protect himself by creating shields, but he can't create portals while holding his shields.

Originally posted by FrothByte
I think you'e a bit off. From the moment Strange moves his hands to the moment the portal is set enough to step through, takes him 3-4 seconds. But fine, let's keep it at 3.

Loki in comparison makes illusions instantly as we've seen him do multiple times before. He can throw a dagger in a fraction of a second.

So if Strange takes 3 seconds to build a portal, that means he could be riddled with at least 3 daggers before he's through. That's not even taking into account Loki creating illusions all around him and all attacking him at the same time.

Strange can protect himself by creating shields, but he can't create portals while holding his shields.

3s then.

Thats assuming Strange is in close proximity to Loki.

Since the OP never stated it, starting distance is 100m.

How long does it take a dagger to reach its target?

Strange can fly and take distance from loki.

Isnt like he will fight him head on.

Strange has also fought several foes at a time. He should have trouble facing a couple of Loki's illusions.

Originally posted by Surtur
Not all the gems are equal. The time gem is far more powerful than the mind gem it seems. You can't die with the time gem. We saw Loki needed to make physical contact with a person to put them under his control.

Each gem represents an aspect of the universe.

None is above the other. Its just a matter of how you use them and for what.

Mind Gem=Time Gem.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
3s then.

Thats assuming Strange is in close proximity to Loki.

Since the OP never stated it, starting distance is 100m.

How long does it take a dagger to reach its target?

Strange can fly and take distance from loki.

Isnt like he will fight him head on.

Strange has also fought several foes at a time. He should have trouble facing a couple of Loki's illusions.

I thought default starting distance was 100 ft and not 100 m? But ok, let's say 100m.

The velocity of a thrown knife is 60 kph, thrown by a professional human knife thrower. That's around 16 meters per second. Which means it will take around 6 seconds to cover 100m. But we also know that Loki is a lot stronger than a human. If he can double the speed of the thrown knife then the knife hits in 3 seconds. Pretty sure Loki is way stronger than just 2x human strength which means he should be able to speed that knife up more than just 2x normal speed.

And even if Strange gets his portal up before the knife hits, so what? If he creates the portal next to him he'll still need to push it the 100m towards Loki. If he tries to create it beside Loki then Loki can simply sidestep it. That's not even taking into consideration that Loki can just immediately create illusions of himself from the getgo so Strange won't know which Loki to hit.

Plus I have yet to see Strange fly AND create portals at the same time.

Originally posted by FrothByte
I thought default starting distance was 100 ft and not 100 m? But ok, let's say 100m.

The velocity of a thrown knife is 60 kph, thrown by a professional human knife thrower. That's around 16 meters per second. Which means it will take around 6 seconds to cover 100m. But we also know that Loki is a lot stronger than a human. If he can double the speed of the thrown knife then the knife hits in 3 seconds. Pretty sure Loki is way stronger than just 2x human strength which means he should be able to speed that knife up more than just 2x normal speed.

And even if Strange gets his portal up before the knife hits, so what? If he creates the portal next to him he'll still need to push it the 100m towards Loki. If he tries to create it beside Loki then Loki can simply sidestep it. That's not even taking into consideration that Loki can just immediately create illusions of himself from the getgo so Strange won't know which Loki to hit.

Plus I have yet to see Strange fly AND create portals at the same time.

And what if Strange just makes another pocket dimension and locks him there like in Ragnarok?

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
And what if Strange just makes another pocket dimension and locks him there like in Ragnarok?

He needs to catch Loki first. When he caught him in Ragnarok, Loki had no idea what was going on and it took a number of seconds for the portal to form around Loki's feet. Enough time that Loki could simply have stepped out of that circle.

In this scenario, not only will Strange need to catch a moving Loki with his portal, he will also need to do it while under attack from Loki and while trying to figure out which Loki is the real one among multiple illusions.

Originally posted by FrothByte
He needs to catch Loki first. When he caught him in Ragnarok, Loki had no idea what was going on and it took a number of seconds for the portal to form around Loki's feet. Enough time that Loki could simply have stepped out of that circle.

In this scenario, not only will Strange need to catch a moving Loki with his portal, he will also need to do it while under attack from Loki and while trying to figure out which Loki is the real one among multiple illusions.

OP didnt stated Prep time. What amkes you think he wont react the same this time?

You dont know if he could actucally "step outside the circle".

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
OP didnt stated Prep time. What amkes you think he wont react the same this time?

You dont know if he could actucally "step outside the circle".

Yes, there's no prep, which means Strange won't have the chance to prepare his portals in advance.

Loki won't act the same way because he knows his in a straight up fight and Strange won't have a chance to blindside him with a portal.

Unless you can prove that the circle has some form of force field around it, all we know is that it's a portal.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Yes, there's no prep, which means Strange won't have the chance to prepare his portals in advance.

Loki won't act the same way because he knows his in a straight up fight and Strange won't have a chance to blindside him with a portal.

Unless you can prove that the circle has some form of force field around it, all we know is that it's a portal.

A portal transports you from one place to another.

Loki was locked in a pocket dimension which is different to a portal.

Unless you can prove he can get out everything else is but speculation.

Strange will hold Loki long enough to lock him in the Pocket Dimension.

Loki doesnt have any clear advantage over Strange.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
A portal transports you from one place to another.

Loki was locked in a pocket dimension which is different to a portal.

Unless you can prove he can get out everything else is but speculation.

Strange will hold Loki long enough to lock him in the Pocket Dimension.

Loki doesnt have any clear advantage over Strange.

How exactly will Strange hold Loki in place? He doesn't have telekinesis that I know of. Do you have any feats of Strange holding someone in place while he makes a portal?

Once Loki is in a pocket dimension I agree he can't get out. That's not what I'm arguing. I'm saying Dr. Strange is going to have hell of a time putting Loki in a pocket dimension in the first place, considering that Loki attacks far faster than Strange can make portals.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Each gem represents an aspect of the universe.

None is above the other. Its just a matter of how you use them and for what.

Mind Gem=Time Gem.

Eh, I'd have to disagree, at least going by what we've seen so far. The time gem can make it so you can't be killed. The mind gem....someone under its control can be removed from said control with just a sharp blow to the head.

Even in the comics the gems aren't all equal, with the power gem supposedly having the capacity to tap into any super power in existence if you use it correctly.

Originally posted by Surtur
Eh, I'd have to disagree, at least going by what we've seen so far. The time gem can make it so you can't be killed. The mind gem....someone under its control can be removed from said control with just a sharp blow to the head.

Even in the comics the gems aren't all equal, with the power gem supposedly having the capacity to tap into any super power in existence if you use it correctly.

No. Isnt like one is above the other.

Isnt like they have a hierchy.

Each Gem has its purpose. Isnt like one is above the other.

In a combat however some Gems might result better than others.

Its a matter of what you need to do more thab which is more powerful.