John Preston/Agent Zero versus Wesley Gibson/Fox...
John Preston and Agent Zero's names come up in the loom of fate. Wesley Gibson and Fox are assigned as a team to take them out.
They track Preston and Zero down to Nakatomi plaza. The cleric and the mutant are on the top floor looking down on Fox and Gibson as the assassins enter the building. Gibson and Fox know where they are, they must make their way to them and kill them. The plaza is deserted except for the four combatants, it is fully lit and fully powered.
Preston and Zero are obviously working as a team here. Can they beat the bullet bending assassins, or do the weapons of fate win?
Preston is armed with his twin pistols, Zero is armed with the pistols he had in "Origins."....Fox is armed with the gun she had against Cross in the drug store, and Gibson has twin Beretta's.
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All the ways you wish you could be, that's me. I look like you wanna look, I **** like you wanna ****, I am smart, capable, and most importantly, I am free in all the ways that you are not.
Well, by the very nature of his technique, Preston is done for.
Gun Katas teach to anticipate the trajectory of bullets. He won't have a clue that he's fighting people that can bend them, nor will he know that can be done. Thus, he has no way of getting around it. So that's him dealt with.
As for Agent Zero, I haven't seen anything that'd suggest he has what it takes to beat either of the others.
Thing is, the bullet benders have never been shown shooting rapid fire bullets out of the air, Preston, in the first scene in "Equilibrium", used rapid fire.
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All the ways you wish you could be, that's me. I look like you wanna look, I **** like you wanna ****, I am smart, capable, and most importantly, I am free in all the ways that you are not.
He, Preston? Gotta remember that the bullet benders can slow everything down with their panic attack thing.
As for Zero, here:
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All the ways you wish you could be, that's me. I look like you wanna look, I **** like you wanna ****, I am smart, capable, and most importantly, I am free in all the ways that you are not.
Well, this is the MVF, hollywood is what we discuss here. Wanna talk comics? Mosey on back to the comic forum, pardner, you seem to have quite the fanbase there. Comics mean shit here.
Yeah, and the bullet benders suck ass with weapons right?
K.
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All the ways you wish you could be, that's me. I look like you wanna look, I **** like you wanna ****, I am smart, capable, and most importantly, I am free in all the ways that you are not.
Mhm, I got that, and there is also a side order of "tsk tsk all you know is the movies, RJ."
I'm quite aware of his love for the comics. He claimed Zero had no movie feats that can compete with the bullet benders, I provided feats for him, simple as that.
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All the ways you wish you could be, that's me. I look like you wanna look, I **** like you wanna ****, I am smart, capable, and most importantly, I am free in all the ways that you are not.
As for this, they have general knowledge of each other. The bullet benders know what Gun Kata is, and they know Zero is a mutant with mad skills.
And Preston/Zero know what the bullet benders can do.
My fault for not saying so in the OP.
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All the ways you wish you could be, that's me. I look like you wanna look, I **** like you wanna ****, I am smart, capable, and most importantly, I am free in all the ways that you are not.
Zero is the most skilled gunfighter here. I also agree that the gunbending ability will cause Preston problems. The katas aren't designed to anticipate this tactic.
Are you legitimately going to pull that stuff on me, when I spent time trying to explain to you why you couldn't use Star Wars books? It's nice that you've finally accepted the rules and that I was right, but don't act like you always have.
Also, I wasn't involving comics. You should know I wouldn't do that. I have, however, seen the movie. You could never educate me on anything comic based. Don't presume you could. I know the characters involved.
Nice to see you've been stalking me, though. It's flattering. Venturing into forums you have zero knowledge of just to observe me. So flattering.
Feel free to quote me saying that, feel free to quote me saying: "He has no feats that can compete with the bullet benders.".
You'll actually find I implied that I favour him more than them.
By the way, it was never stated he's a mutant in the movie. He exhibited no abilities that were said to be a result of mutation.
All the ways you wish you could be, that's me. I look like you wanna look, I **** like you wanna ****, I am smart, capable, and most importantly, I am free in all the ways that you are not.
Last edited by Impediment on Feb 14th, 2010 at 04:10 AM
Him knowing what they can do doesn't mean that gun kata was created with bullet bending trajectories in it's training regime. Which clearly it wasn't and any implication to make it so would be changing the character beyond screen feats. So...In short, Preston "knowing" about bullet bending doesn't mean he can do anything to counter it. Knowledge isn't power...Acting upon knowledge is power. It's not enough to know about bullet bending. He has to be able to do something to stop it killing him...He can't....So he dies quickly.
How anyone can consider Agent Zero's feats in better than Wesley Gibson's clearly hasn't seen the movies. Gibson wiped out the entire fraternity of extremely highly trained assassins. Zero killed a handful of militia. Gibson snipe at the end of the film was about 10 times the distance of Zero's shot into the barn. Presumably he was also aiming for Wolverine and not the old couple...So he missed...Gibson shot was also infinitely more impressive. Through a doughnut, through a tin, through several car windscreens etc etc.
True, true, but Zero is much more agile than Wesley. The fraternity members were just standing around. And he is a better shot, and WAY faster.
When the bullets start flying, Preston is gonna be like BAMBAMBAMBAMBAMBAMBAMBAMBAM, rapid fire out the yazoo, I don't think the bullet benders can shoot all his bullets out of the air.
__________________
All the ways you wish you could be, that's me. I look like you wanna look, I **** like you wanna ****, I am smart, capable, and most importantly, I am free in all the ways that you are not.
Last edited by Rogue Jedi on Feb 14th, 2010 at 08:11 PM
Granted Zero's reaction time and draw time is insanely fast and better than Wesley's. But Zero needs a line of sight...Wesley doesn't.
And they weren't just standing around...Why would they be? They were being over run by suicide bomber rats. Standing around would've been a stupid thing to do...Yes they were distracted but even then they were still far more dangerous adversaries than a bunch of African militia.
All right, they weren't "standing around", poor choice of words on my part, but compared to the way Zero can hop around like a cracked up Yoda, they might as well have been.
__________________
All the ways you wish you could be, that's me. I look like you wanna look, I **** like you wanna ****, I am smart, capable, and most importantly, I am free in all the ways that you are not.
I'd give Preston a victory, by himself, 6 out of 10 times.
Zero is just overkill.
He can beat them, by himself, 10 out of 10 times.
Reasoning: Gibson can stop 1 or 2 bullets...at the very most. He isn't stopping the rain from Preston.
Speed goes to both Preston and Zero. Zero has them all.
Skill: bullet bending is pretty much the only edge Fox/Gibson has. Preston is obviously more skilled with guns, H2H, and with swords. Not sure about Zero's sword skills, but I have to give him the edge over Preston on the gun skills, only because of his speed and obvious super-human agility/strength.
Intelligence - Preston, by far. Zero seems smart enough, but there's no reason to assume he's any smarter than Gibson/Fox.
Bullet bending does nothing to improve Gibson's or Fox's chances: the bullet still ends up in the same location they are intending it, it just travels in an arch. Preston is dodging the bullet, not the trajectory. Where the bullet ends up is what he dodges. I'm not even sure why any of you think that's a legit point.
Gun Kata is a fictional gun-fighting martial art discipline that is a significant part of the film. It is based upon the premise that, given the positions of the participants in a gun battle, the trajectories of fire are statistically predictable.
And a Cleric does not "dodge" bullets:
. By the same token, the trajectories of incoming fire are also statistically predictable, so by assuming the appropriate stance, one can keep one's body clear of the most likely way of enemy bullets.
It's like they know beforehand, and move/position themselves beforehand. Neo dodges bullets. YuLaw dodges bullets, Selene dodges bullets. Clerics do not.
But I agree that Preston/Zero win here, why? Rapid fire and Zero's agility/speed/mutant uberness are too much for the bullet benders.
__________________
All the ways you wish you could be, that's me. I look like you wanna look, I **** like you wanna ****, I am smart, capable, and most importantly, I am free in all the ways that you are not.
RJ is right. Gun Kata has nothing to do with dodging bullets. It has to do with staying out of the statistically predictable trajectories. Preston has no way to know where that trajectory will be coming from due to the bullet bending and so won't know which was is the correct one for him to move to be out of the way.
Fact of the matter is that Gibson's screen feats are vastly more impressive that Preston's or Zero's.
As for intelligence. How smart and skilled to you have to be to set up a shot like he did at the end of the movie?
Zero's 3 feats...An open shot snipe which Gibson's is infinitely more impressive than. Taking out a handful of militia in the raid at the start of the movie. Gibson's attack on the fraternity kills far more people who are far more dangerous. And he shoots the cigar out of Wolverine's mouth from 15 yards (woop-dee-doo)
Gibson's showing against the fraternity is also far more impressive than Preston's shootout scene. Gibson kills until weapons are expended and then snatches his dead enemies weapons from mid air before they've hit the ground in order to continue killing. He does this numerous times. Preston reloads from his clips in his cloak and the ones on the floor.
You can only go by what you see and Gibson's showing is far more impressive than either Zero or Preston...By a LOOOONNGGG way.
KMC Community Forums
Feb 12th, 2010 11:17 PM
Comics mean shit here.
