__________________ "Happiness is a lie. Life is horror. The light is always dying all across the universe. The last star will flicker out someday, when it does, all that remains is shadow. And I will be its king!"'-Amahl Farouk
I can see Nite Owl using his superior fighting skills to get the win, but I don't know if he could break her bones. Only thing that managed to do so on the show was getting hit by a truck, IIRC. Nite Owl hits hard, but he doesn't hit that hard. He should be able to hit hard enough that a couple of solid hits should KO her though.
__________________ Never take life seriously. Nobody gets out alive anyway.
And I don't even see Nite Owl ko'ing her period. She took hits from a mind controlled, non holding back Cage. And his trailer alone shows just how strong he is. She'd have to stand there and let him have a ton of free shots to the jaw/temple for him to take her down imo. Because this is JOnes when PIS isn't involved to keep PM save for another episode. Like getting hit by a 130lb ginger waif with a 2x4 and going down.
So I re-watched Jessica's fight with Luke and she did much better than I initially remembered. Still not sure she'd be able to win and unlike Luke she's not "unbreakable". While Nite Owl would need several hits to bring Jessica down, all she needs is to connect once to secure a win.
If anyone wants to reference said fight I'll post it here:
Yeah, I have to say, kind of unsure now, rechecking the fight. Luke >>>>> Nite Owl in strength, and she managed to soak up multiple blows from him. And as KingD pointed out, the latest trailer gave us a more explicit showing of how strong Luke actually is, stopping a large, speeding SUV dead in its tracks, and wrecking the entire front of it in the process.
__________________ Never take life seriously. Nobody gets out alive anyway.
Yeah, but both those instances required her to job to allow Kilgrave to escape. He was making a run for it when she had to fight the guys with stun batons, and he was tied up in her apartment when the ginger knocked her out. And that doesn't dismiss the truck hit, or her fight with Luke, or surviving her multiple "guided falling" landings without injury. Jessica has low ends, but she also has high end showings. What did Nite Owl do, other than beat up some street and prison thugs? Fact is the only person Nite Owl ever fought with enhanced durability (Ozy) soaked up his hits without much hassle.
Put it this way, how long do you think Nite Owl would last against a Luke Cage out to kill him? I don't see him lasting very long at all.
__________________ Never take life seriously. Nobody gets out alive anyway.
She also got easily cut by shards of glass. I won't ignore her low showings and just focus on high showings, same way I won't consider Michael Jordan's best game as indicative of his usual game. So I'll take the average.
In any case, it's clear that Jessica can be hurt by normal humans. Yes she's more durable than most but the skill difference between her and NO is too big IMO. He might have trouble taking her out but I doubt she'll land even a single hit on NO.
Blunt force v piercing damage has always been a different category in comics. We all know this. Sure a sword would mess her up as she's durable to blunt force damage only...like Nite Owl punching and kicking her.
Which brings me back to my example of security guards being able to hurt her with punches, kicks and stun guns. Or of the redhead who knocked her out with a 2×4.
Vault and myself have already explained it. It's a clear case of PIS, as her low showings all coincide with her being in the vicinity of Purple Man, and about to take him down.
But he had to survive until the end of the season, so her durability dropped sharply every time he needed to escape. Look at her fight with Luke. If she can take that amount of punishment and walk away pretty much fine, how in the hell could that redhaired b*tch(because I really hate her) with a 2x4 knock her out? She couldn't, except the plot demanded it. It can't be explained any simpler than that.
There was the security guards and Nuke that were able to damage Jessica. From what I gathered watching Jessica Jones is that while it takes more hits to bring Jessica down, she appears to take damage like a normal person.
Purple Man's security guards, who delayed her, surprise, just long enough for him to escape. Nuke, even on his pill was able to hurt her by his own admission because she was injured from getting hit by a delivery truck going 45mph. He said if she was at 100%, she'd have kicked his ass by then.
Okay Froth, let me ask you this. Who do you think hits harder? Luke Cage or ginger-girl with a piece of wood? Fact is the fight against Luke Cage happened. And if you choose to focus on one set of feats, and give Nite Owl the win based on those, you can't fault other people for focusing on others, and disagreeing, especially considering the context of all the feats in question.
And that's the issue with JJ in versus matches. The plot-induced power fluctuations make it somewhat difficult to figure out a consistent level by which to judge her.
__________________ Never take life seriously. Nobody gets out alive anyway.
Okay the Nuke situation is an exception but Jessica didn't exactly shrug off that truck either. Though both situations are better showings of superhuman vitality/endurance rather than durability Í think.
I never said she shrugged it off. It sent her flying, knocked her silly and fractured her ribs. But it took getting rammed into by a 5+ ton truck going at least 35mph to hurt her to that point. That would have crippled if not killed Nite Owl.
Here's what I think: Jessica Jones has been shown multiple times to get hurt by things that hurt normal people. She might be able to tank it better and she seems to have some form of accelerated healing, but she can still get downed by things normal people get taken out with.
Luke Cage obviously hits harder than girl with 2x4. But girl with 2x4 took a cheapshot at Jessica when she wasn't prepared. Being prepared for a hit does wonders with how well you can take a hit.
Now she'll be prepared for NO obviously, but from what I saw of her fighting she seems almost clueless in terms of fighting style, depending instead on pure strength to pull her through.
My point is, it will take Night Owl longer to take her down as opposed to normal opponents, but I seriously doubt JJ can land a proper hit on NO. And considering that JJ can actually get hurt by security guards, eventually NO will be able to take her out.
And to address your first point: JJ fought Luke Cage once. That's 1 feat where she displayed the ability to tank superhuman hits. Getting KOd by ginger girl, cut by glass, getting beat up by security guards are multiple instances. I choose to go with multiple feats instead of focusing on just 1.
Even when she survived getting hit by the truck, she was still completely messed up by it. So yeah, that shows higher than human durability but not that much. Or at least not much in comparison to other action heroes.
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Last edited by FrothByte on Aug 15th, 2016 at 10:12 PM
Problem is there is no proof Nite Owl hits as hard as Cage, or a speeding truck for that matter. And she is not totally useless in a fight. She was arguably outfighting Cage. He was simply outmuscling her every time.
And as you said, the 2x4 was a cheap shot from behind. And getting "beat up" is a bit of an exaggeration. All they really did was delay her long enough for Kilgrave to escape. And no one said she was piercing proof. But being able to walk away from being hit by a truck (because she did walk away under her own power), and only fracturing some ribs, is WAY higher durability than a normal human. Then there is also the multiple instances where she has fallen impressive heights without any injury.
Fact is, if you go by low ends, then Nite Owl should win. But if you go by high end showings, Nite Owl won't be able to really hurt her. Because if you say you won't dismiss low-ends because she has high-end showings, I can flip that argument and say I won't ignore her high-end showings because she has some low-ends (many of which are tied directly to the plot).
Like I said, the issue is show inconsistency. The gap between Jessica's high and low end showings are so big, it's almost hard to believe it's the same character. Take another example. She can heal from a gunshot to the arm in a few days, to the point there is not even a scar. But a small scalpel cut behind her ear left a scar that appears permanent. And why? Because the plot needed that scar to be there so that Jessica could use it in her argument with Kilgrave.
__________________ Never take life seriously. Nobody gets out alive anyway.
NO doesn't need to hit as hard as Cage, he just needs to hit as hard as those security guards then hit her multiple times to take her down.
Jessica has never been shown to be impervious to hits that hurt normal humans.
Like I said in my previous post, JJ has way way more low end showings than she has high end showings. In fact she only has 1 high end showing (Cage fight) and one questionable showing (truck hit). The rest are low end showings. Don't know about you but I'd prefer to take the average.
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Aug 11th, 2016 10:45 PM
