"But Traya underestimates her disciples' depravity. They turn on her and drain her Force powers."
-- KotOR CG
"Sion learns much from the shrew, but grows frustrated with her abstract teachings. He conspires with Darth Nihilus to strip her powers and eventually severs Traya's hand."
-- KotOR CG
"Ousting Traya with Sion's help, Nihilus binges on the Force, nearly extinguishing the Jedi forever at Katarr."
-- KotOR CG
At the end of the day, just about everybody reckons that Nihilus is vastly more powerful than Traya by this point. So why does he need or want Sion's help? He doesn't need backup if he's vastly more powerful than Traya, since he might as well oust Traya by himself and become the undisputed ruler of the Sith Triumvirate - Sion can't possibly challenge him on his own. And Sith don't form alliances unless it's absolutely necessary - especially Nihilus.
For that matter, why would he wait until he was vastly more powerful than Traya to oust her? The nature of Sith is to claim the highest position as soon as you become more powerful than the top Sith. Nihilus was also impatient with Traya because she was denying him the freedom to sate his own hunger. I don't think anybody here would accept the idea that Nihilus actually needed Sion to help him against Traya (ie. Traya's still a bit more powerful than him at this point), but without that explanation, how do you explain Nihilus' need for Sion's aid?
Last edited by SunRazer on Jul 14th, 2016 at 05:39 AM
Nihilus was never meant to be vastly more powerful than Traya. Yes, he's starved here. And again, because you seem to keep ignoring this, the Ravager was just caught inside a gravity well. It wasn't buried into the surface of Malachor somewhere. Do you not know what a gravity well is?
Well, the game files have Surik only being in awe of Nihilus' power, but fair enough.
Anyway, you have yet to clarify what your original question in the thread was. Also, I don't recall him being starved, nor did I insinuate that this version is more powerful than future versions (obviously not the case).
And you still haven't answered my actual question, which is why Nihilus needed Sion here.
Based on what is it not buried in the surface of Malachor?
"Penetrating several kilometers into the ground" sounds like buried to me.
Last edited by SunRazer on Jul 14th, 2016 at 06:51 AM
I think just about nobody here will accept the notion that Traya's more powerful than the same Nihilus who resurrected the Ravager and potentially the rest of his fleet from the gravity well, but if nobody can propose a good answer to my question, then yeah, that's the only logical avenue left.
When has Avellone confirmed this? And what evidence? That Traya's attention was divided between Nihilus and Sion when Nihilus TK'd her into the wall or that Sion canonically helped Nihilus oust Traya?
In the same email where he stated that Traya's quote about the ancients was legit, he said that Nihilus didn't need Sion's help, and that Nihilus used Sion as a sort of "physical reminder," directly comparing it to how Sidious would use Maul.
__________________ ”You presume limits to my power. There are none.”
In the CG you're talking about it talks about his constant hunger and need to feed, you talk about him attacking her because she won't let him feed, but he's not starving?
Because he's weaker than Traya, or at least she's comparable? The implication was obvious. Nihilus was becoming progressively more powerful throughout KotOR II, something Traya herself brings up. Plus, you know, he's eating planets. 2+2=4.
The loading screen that flatout says it's in a gravity well.
Said loading screen: (please log in to view the image)
Which is why everyone has to keep telling you it was in orbit. It was not buried anywhere.
"Starving" is defined as a severe deficiency. I doubt it was severe at this point.
Also, I was talking about Traya not letting him mindlessly feed off Jedi, which he wanted to do. Surely when she taught her how to Drain others, he'd have to have something to feed off?
Ah, so you do think that Traya > Nihilus at that point.
And I just posted a more recent quote (ergo, a retcon) that states the ships were buried on the surface.
And even if it wasn't buried, the feat's still impressive, and Traya's superiority moreso.
No, you posted a quote that said hundreds of ships where buired into the surface. Not that every ship was. Wreckage still orbited the planet.
It requires far more power to remove an object from the ground and then through the atmosphere, than just pushing it towards the natural direction gravity goes towards in a well.
Jul 14th, 2016 05:36 AM
