Yoda and Mace win.
Jacen and Bane win. Jacen probably dies though.
DE Luke with either Vader or Jacen, hmm.
Clearly DE Luke can rival Palps in sabers alone, what happens when Vader or Jacen are added to the mix? I'd say Palps still has the edge.
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Superior feats really. He's the better swordsman, probably equalish in speed (best speed feat for DE Luke?) and has the better telekinetic feats of the two, as well as incredibly potent Force Lightning. Did DE Luke even know how to block lightning at that point? And which Bane is this? The better one would be ROT Bane imo. Those Orbalisks are really too much of an advantage to pass up.
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Last edited by Nephthys on Feb 17th, 2011 at 10:06 PM
Luke basically dismissed a laser blast from a walker, and brought that same machine down with TK, I believe. That seems better than anything Bane can dish out. DE Luke had been trained by Palpatine, so it stands to reason that he should be able to deal with FL. I leave that question open for anyone that has read the comic? And with regard to speed, Luke fought Palpatine in a youthful/regenerated body. Palpatine is known to draw heavily on Force speed (Shatterpoint, RotS Novelization) and Luke would have to do the same to keep up.
Without bothering to google anything, I'd say that this is a pretty even match, actually.
I recall that Sidious and Luke fought at bluring speeds, and that Leia was unable to even see them...
No not really. Luke Skywalker effortlessly destroys an AT-AT. Bane on the other hand, becomes exhausted after collapsing the entrance to an ancient temple. In fact that feat is wanked as hell, all Bane really did was crumble the entrance, which then caused the crumbling temple to fall apart. It's impressive, but not as impressive as certain people make it out to be, AKA "he force pushed a temple over!"
It's not some unique skill, one simply has to hold up the lightsaber and block it... Also the RotJ novel claims that Luke is somewhat repulsing Palpatine's lighting. Take that as you will.
Well it depends. Against Palpatine those Orbalisks may be more of a disadvantage. If one small dose of lightning gets through, Bane would likely be down for the count.
My mistake, I go onto autopilot when referencing the RotS fight; it is so often being used to help Mace that I sort of blanked out. Retracted.
[edit]
That's not how it works.
The orbalisks provide a positive feed back loop; the presence of Dark Side energy prompts a release of various chemicals that serve to aggravate and enrage Bane even further. The Dark Side energy from his own Force Lightning, fueled by the feedback loop from the orbalisks themselves, was the actual cause of the catastrophe. It is a misconception that Bane is particularly vulnerable to any lightning; the effect was only significant because it was his own lightning.
I think. I'd have to look up the quote. Mad bonus points to anybody that quotes the entire scene.[/edit]
Here is a quote from the novel.
"Somehow the Jedi's barrier had trapped Bane inside the center of the dark side storm. The electricity had enveloped him, millions of volts arcing through his body, cooking his flesh from the inside and throwing his muscles into an endless series of violent seizures that threatened to rip his body apart.
The energy had coursed through the orbalisks embedded in his skin, too. The creatures absorbed the power, hungrily devouring it until they became so engorged that the soft, pliant flesh of their underbellies had began to swell. Squeezed ever tighter against the unyielding chitin of their own exterior shells, they'd begun to burrow deeper into Bane. He remembered screaming as thousands of tiny teeth started sawing away at subcutaneous tissue, chewing through muscles, tendons, and even bone.
But burrowing deeper hadn't stopped the creatures from feasting on the electricity coursing through Bane's frying innards. They'd continued to expand until they had begun to pop, rupturing like overfilled balloons pinched beneath the hard shells.
Bane had stayed conscious through the torture of the electricity cooking him alive and the agony of the teeth burrowing into his flesh. But the indescribable pain from the chemicals released by the exploding orbalisks dissolving his body on a cellular level finally caused him to black out... only to wake up here."
I don't see anywhere that says it has to be his own energy; it simply states that the Orbalisks fed on the electricity until they burst. Granted it could be somwhere else in the novel, but it clearly is not here.
Here is a link to a download page for the book if you want to search yourself.
I can't recall how he brought down that walker actually, memory indicates that he either reflected its blast or tripped it. Bane can effortlessly disintergrate entire beings with his TK and can tear through master-level defences with it as if they were tissue paper. Personally I'd put him above Luke TK wise, on those grounds.
Why would Palpatine train him to defend hiself from the one attack Luke has no defence against? It seems unlikely that the one weapon Palps possesses that only he does and knows how to defend against would be the one that Palps would train him to defend against.
Luke was empowered by Leia and her unborn child at teh time. In fact I believe he was empowered by the entirity of the Lightside iirc. Earlier the Emperor beat him in half a page as if he was swatting a fly. Either way its not a speed he can replicate in a forum fight
@Ares
See above.
Personally I see disintergrating entire beings through telekinesis as the more impressive feat, yes.
No one doesn't. Lightning is not magnetically attracted to a lightsaber. The jedi has to draw the lightning into the blade or the arcs will just go around it and hit him anyway.
A) I'm discussing Luke vs Bane, not Palpatine vs Bane. I don't know if Luke used lightning by then, though he certainly is not aware of the orbalisks relative vulnerability to them.
B) It would take considerably more than one small dose. Earlier in ROT the orbalisks absorb over a million volts of electricity with not problem at all.
Also as Zam pointed out, they consume darkside energy.
I'm not having any luck finding the fight online, but from what I remember, no.
In ROT when he was fighting the technobeasts. Passages describe him as disintegrating technobeasts with waves of his hand. Note that some of those technobeasts were creatures as big as Rancors.
I see no reason why lightning would just be drawn to a lightsaber without some form of help.
When he's attacked by the Sith assassins in ROT. He just lets them hit him with their electricised pikes and the orbalisks absorb the electricity.
Obi-Wan could do it. I see no reason for him not to pass this knowledge on to Luke if the Emperor is still alive and he calls Luke their only hope of defeating the Empire.
__________________ Imagination is more important than knowledge.
Obi-Wan was dead after teaching him for a few hours. If anyone would teach him it was Yoda. Though if he had taught him that Luke wouldn't have thrown away the one thing he needed to stop Palpatines attacks.
Its pure speculation that he could do it unless we actually have some proof that he could.
Feb 17th, 2011 02:32 PM
