I myself am kind of torn. On the one hand I think the way people are trying to alter established terms manipulate our language to use terms like "undocumented immigrant" stupid, on the other hand I'm a big proponent of free speech. I mean I realize that no one's free speech is actually being threatened here because the rule only applies in an official capacity, but I'm wary of ANY efforts by the government to take control of the way people speak. I can't think of a way this particular restriction could set a precedent that eventually infringes on the rights of a private citizen but that doesn't mean there isn't one.
Anyway, does anyone else want to throw in their two cents on the matter?
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Last edited by darthgoober on Aug 6th, 2018 at 07:56 PM
"Undocumented immigrant" was coined to more humanize these people, make Americans view them more as people than as pest.
Trump is not liking that, so he's having shitty Jeff Sessions undo it as it's easier for people to not care about "illegal aliens" being abused than it is "undocumented immigrants". It's a marketing thing.
I don't really see how the term "illegal alien" actually dehumanizes them. I mean "Illegal" simply notes their legal status and "Alien" simply notes that they are foreign. I can totally understand people pushing back against the term "undocumented immigrant" given a lot of people's claims nowadays that there's no such thing as an illegal person because it's factually inaccurate.
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Last edited by darthgoober on Aug 6th, 2018 at 08:12 PM
What's a shortcoming? I just don't understand how an accurate description dehumanizes someone. Nothing about the term illegal alien suggested that they are less than human, simply that they're from a foreign land and here illegally.
I too am all for free speech. But lets take a step back. I imagine this is not the first time a phrase has been banned in this way. I imagine it's been going on for a while. So when did it start? When will it end? If this phrase should be allowed, what about the other ones barred, if they exist? If we come at it from a free speech angle, nothing would be allowed to be barred.
__________________ Chicken Boo, what's the matter with you? You don't act like the other chickens do. You wear a disguise to look like human guys, but you're not a man you're a Chicken Boo.
Yes but "immigrant" isn't always accurate. An immigrant is someone who takes up permanent residence. I prefer "Alien" to "immigrant" because it's accurate 100% of the time, whether legal or illegal.
I know, as I said I can't think of a way this could spiral out of control because it's limited to being barred in an official capacity. I just get paranoid easily when it comes to the 1st amendment. I actually created the thread in the hopes that my paranoia would be dispelled.
I personally am not worried about Trump truly encroaching on actual 1st amendment rights. If only because the conservatives have embraced free speech more than ever before in the face of what the left is doing. Trump might spew rhetoric, but I don't think he'd actually do anything to mess that up.
They are using it in a way that is getting people on their side.
__________________ Chicken Boo, what's the matter with you? You don't act like the other chickens do. You wear a disguise to look like human guys, but you're not a man you're a Chicken Boo.
Yeah but I'm paranoid because I think beyond Trump. I support the second amendment for the same reason. I don't think any current American politician is a tyrant in the making, but I think it's a mistake to make things easier for a potential tyrant in the unknown future. Precedents that we set today for our benefit always have the potential of being used against us tomorrow.
Re: Lawyers barred from using the term "undocumented immigrant"
I'm not for this at all, but I have to ask:
If the Obama administration initially ordered everyone use "Undocumented Immigrant" and avoid "Illegal Alien"?
Because whatever side you fall on, they totally should report that stuff even handedly. I'm not so sure they do, if it would damage "their" party..
__________________ What CDTM believes;
Never let anyone else define you. Don't be a jerk just to be a jerk, but if you are expressing your true inner feelings and beliefs, or at least trying to express that inner child, and everyone gets pissed off about it, never NEVER apologize for it. Let them think what they want, let them define you in their narrow little minds while they suppress every last piece of them just to keep a friend that never liked them for themselves in the first place.
Did the Obama admin try and bar "illegal alien" from its government use? I honestly don't recall.
For all the 'pro illegal immigrant' Obama gets slapped onto him and much of it true, his policies/enforcing [then] current laws deported more than 2.4million people, almost the same as Bush and Clinton combined.
I wouldn't absolutely be against Obama passing that kind of thing, even more than the current ruling on it. Mostly because as I said earlier "immigrant" isn't always and accurate descriptor.
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Aug 6th, 2018 07:46 PM
