I made this thread for one simple reason. Some people were gettting the impression that Naruto characters were more powerful than Bleach ones, and I intend to prove here that this guy isn't going to get beaten by any ninja. (please log in to view the image)
Ichigo wields a sword known as a zanpaku-to aka, the soul slayer. A zanpaku-to directly reflects the power of its wielder,and can be considered a shinigami's reiatsu given physical form. While they mostly look like any other katana an old-time samurai might carry around, zanpaku-to's are far from normal. The foremost difference is the zanpaku-to ability to harm shinigami. Since shinigami are spirits, normal blades and weapons can't touch them. In fact, "zanpaku-to" literally means "soul cutting sword."
The other major point that separates them from plain ol' swords is a zanpaku-to's ability to transform. Each blade has up to three distinct forms which its wielder can access according to their strength and skill. The first one that doesn't take any effort to attain, is the blade's normal form. With a few exceptions, a zanpaku-to's normal form is indistinguishable from that of a plain katana.
The second form is called "Shikai", or "first release". The key to Shikai is learning the zanpaku-to's name. Discovering it is not the easiest thing in the world; some Shinigami never do manage it (for example, Kenpachi). But for those that do, they gain a whole new level of power. Easily triggered by an incantation unique to each sword, a shikai zanpaku-to changes immensely, often becoming a weapon far removed from a sword. Also, shikai zanpaku-to usually has special powers a shinigami can use, such as poisons, illusions or power blasts.
"Bankai", the third form, means "full release". Only shinigami that are at a Captain's level, or highly powerful Vice-Captains can acquire bankai. Increasing the zanpaku-to's power by as much as a factor of ten, it takes many decades of intense training to learn bankai (or three days of cheating courtesy of Urahara and Yoruichi. ^^) Triggering a zanpaku-to's bankai needs only a one-word incantation: Bankai.
Bankai zanpaku-to get additions to their names, indicating it is New and Special, and it changes even more drastically, usually (presently with only 1 exception) becoming something far, far larger than the wielder.
SHIKAI:_Shikai Zangetsu looks more like an elegant cleaver than a formal "katana" (looks like a huge arabian sword). He has no crossguard and no proper hilt; what Ichigo holds is the cloth-wrapped tang. Zangetsu is as tall as Ichigo, but the blade is hand-width only at it's base. From there it tapers in one long arc into a sharp, pointed tip. The cloth wrapping on the tang seems to react to Ichigo's will, changing length at a thought or twining about the blade in an impromptu sheath. Instead of the heavy belt for Zangetsu's sheath, a red chain of interconnecting triangles (one that looks a lot like a spinal column if you look right) runs from Ichigo's right shoulder to left hip. There's no connection or anything, he just puts Zangetsu across his back and the blade sticks. Shikai Zangetsu's power is simple but deadly. He can translate Ichigo's spiritual pressure into tangible energy. The resulting crescent moon of light is called "Getsuga Tenshou" (Moonfang Skyshock) and it can slice cleanly through anything; rock, buildings, people.
Ichigo's Bankai:
The one exception to the "bankai is big" rule, Tensa Zangetsu is actually very small. In fact, this is the only form in which Zangetsu looks anything like a normal sword. He is still as long as he always was, but he now has a formal hilt, crossguard and blade. Instead of the cloth his Shikai form had, a short length of chain dangles from the base of the hilt. He finally gets a crossguard, though it isn't normal. Four prongs bend out to form the kanji for "ban", with the base of the blade at it's center. And every last square inch of him is dead black. Even his Getsuga Tenshou is pitch black. As for Tensa Zangetsu's ability, he takes everything that most bankai's put into being big and translates it into speed boosts for Ichigo. Like Renji, Ichigo himself also changes appearance, albeit very slightly. The top half of his shinigami blacks becomes a sort of suit topcoat instead of a kimono, pinned together at one spot, then left to flare out into ragged ends.
Vaizard: Vaizard is ichigo's most powerful current form and results from him harnessing the power of the hollow that grew within him due to an accident in his training. In vaizard form Ichigo's power, speed, durability, and strength increase at the same amount with the increase comparable to the difference between Shikai and Bankai.
erm? why create a respect forum simply as an opposition to naruto vs bleach. every1 knows this about ichigo already. but nuthing there makes me think he can go up against kyuubi chakra naruto{normal naruto he might take as naruto is not so fast in normal form and cant use the body flicker technique} or sasuke etc.
First of all this is just a general respect thread, and I haven't yet gotten in any of the scans yet, so please withhold your opinion. Please don't spam up the respect thread.
Ichigo's capabilities as a base level shingami(no shikai) with his sword in the unreleased form.
Speed(unlike what many people have claimed, Ichigo has superhuman reflexes in this form, and easily blocks an arrow from ishida to his back with no warning from around 15 meters away( normal arrows average around 105m/s) Therefore Ichigo was able to turn around and block the attack in less than .14285 seconds. Note that the average time it takes an ordinary human to react to something is .5 seonds. So at minimum Ichigo's reflexes at this state were 3.5 times faster than any human. http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e...ch-06-02-10.png http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e...ch-06-02-11.png
Just to show that in bleach size really doesn't matter much, here's a pic of the size of the Menos(currently that just a footsoldier level creature in Aizen's army) http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e...ch_v6c6-114.jpg
Ichigo's speed at Shikai:
After several battle's in soul society, Ichigo is shown to have mastered Shunpo, and is able to keep up with Byakuya in a hand to hand battle. It is important to note that Renki states that in the Human world they were moving at 1/5th their normal speed and power. Therefore in soul society Byakuya is moving at around 2100m/s, and Ichigo is matching his speed.
Ichigo's Shikai power feats:
When Ichigo is forced to fight against Zangetsu he can can see the the force of the spirit pressure is literally vaporizing things around the blade, and that it makes a normal blade look like a stick. http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e...ch-ch111-05.png
What many people don't seem to understand about bleach is that the levels between ranks are amazingly huge. In this scan Ichigo blocks an attack that equal to 1 MILLION ordinary zanpaktou's with hs shikai. http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e...izen/151-06.jpg
This is where he starts getting really fast. Here's how i have chosen to calculate his speed in this case. First of all Byakuya has been calculated to be able to shunpo at speeds of up to 2100m/s earlier in the thread. The fastest any human can move is about 10/23 m/s (this is based upon the world record in the 100 meter dash). Therefore Byakuya can move at over 205.279 times faster than the fastest human ever, and since he can easily fight and react to individuals moving that fast as well his reaction times are proportional. That would mean that Byakuya's reaction time is under .0024357143seconds at the beginning of the fight. In the first scan we can see that Byakuya is standing 25 meters away from Ichigo http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e...izen/162-01.jpg
Yet Ichigo is able to move and put his sword at byakuya's throat before byakuya can react and he even can track him with his eyes at some times in the fight. http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e...izen/162-17.jpg http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e...izen/162-18.jpg http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e...izen/163-01.jpg http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e...izen/163-02.jpg
Ichigo is therefore moving 25 meters in less than .0024357143 seconds, which puts his speed at a minimum of 12316.71554m/s. For reference the speed of sound is 344m/s, so he's moving at Mach 35.8
Ichigo's Bankai Power:
In order to understand how truly powerful Ichigo's bankai is and therefore his vaizard form, it's important to understand how powerful his enemies are.
Here's an explanation of how the menos work. Note how all of the arrancar are ENHANCED MENOS'S, and the enormous menos Ichigo fought earlier was merely a footsoldier. If you want to get a sense of the difference in power levels, the difference between a gillian menos and adjuchas menos is about the same as between a shinigami lieutenant and a shinigami captain. http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e...ch-ch197-15.png http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e...ch-ch197-16.png
Ichigo's main opponent for much of the later half of the series was Grimmjow, an arrancar espada created from a adjuchas. Aizen's 10 most powerful arrancar are formed into a group known as the Espada and are ranked based on their comba ability. It is also important to mention that their power levels continually increase exponentially as they go lower in the order. In Bankai Ichigo is able to slice off the arm of the number 10 espada yami with his sword in bankai. This is despite the fact that all of the espada are described as having enhanced skin that enables them to easily stop blades with their skin.(note that Yoruichi severely injured her hands by punching Yami) http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e...ch-ch193-12.png http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e...ch-ch193-13.png http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e...ch-ch193-14.png
Now if we look at the fight with Grimmjow, we can see he's far above yami's level, showing the ability to catch Ichigo's sword with his bare hands and throw him. http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e...eachv24-106.png http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e...eachv24-107.png
Now all we need is respect thread for Yusuke Urameshi, from Yu Yu Hakusho .
As for Ichigo, he is pretty powerful, but he's still got a long way to go, in order to reach the levels of much stronger characters, like the higher ranked Arrancar and Aizen.
First of all, Chapter Black was the best damn arc in the series, for having the best plot. It was the arc that made this my favorite anime, and it was very addicting, and highly unpredictable at most parts. It was much better than a tournament, which was cool, but also really unoriginal. And Sensui was a much more unique villain than Toguro, IMO. Also, Yusuke has much more substance to him than either Hiei or Kurama. I mean, I like both Hiei and Kurama, but among YYH characters, they are definitely the most overrated.
Yusuke has a great sense of humor, that was done perfectly, seeing as how many other anime characters with a sense of humor, just turn out to be plain annoying. Hiei and Kurama were cool characters because they had interesting pasts and personalities. But neither of them had a whole lot of substance to them. IMO, Yusuke is the best character in all of YYH, just because he makes me laugh more than any other character, and because I like his overall personality. He is never annoyingly stuck-up, and hardly ever acts emo. And even when he does act emo, its not really that bad, and I don't get annoyed by it, like how I do with other anime characters who go all emo on everyone.
Also, what you just said is only "your" opinion, and I was only expressing mine. So stop trying to f*ing state your opinion to me as if its a fact !
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Aug 31st, 2007 04:00 PM
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