You guys should really read ahead in the post, the "only" reason The Hulk beat Gladiator was because of his recent defeat of Superman in the amalgam crossover comics...They wanted to show the "true" marvel fans that the hulk in an all out battle would defeat Superman by beating his marvel counterpart, Gladiator....Thus we we're reduced to seeing the hulk stop "every" tactic Gladiator threw at em'(i.e every attack a Superman fan would use in a debate) and finally by some stroke of genius finds out Glad's weakness and beats him into the ground..
Now as for Daredevil defeating Gladiator, come on get real, Daredevil is on the level power-wise as spiderman, captian america, and the wolverine..It would take a team effort for DareDevil to even began to topple the Gladiator...DareDevil's no mutant, meaning that he can be affected by bullets and hard blows from humans, now if Gladiator a being whom punches planets in pieces and moves at the speed of light lands "ONE" solid blow its over...Add about 10 more daredevils to your assumption and then you're saying something...
Tron: As for the cartoons not being credible, it seemed pretty hard for you to recall which cartoons you seen that don't follow the storylines..Meaning that majority of the cartoons you DO see actually follow at least 80% of the actual comic storylines...you having to sit back and "think" of the specific cartoons that shows that most follow their comic counterparts..Every now and then they DO stray off too far I must admit but not enough for me to say "Hey I'm gonna stop watching this cartoon, it has SHIT to do with the comic"...They do stray and I'm not denying that but not enough to not be somewhat credible...
I tried to stay out of this but if anybody had any concept of how powerful Gladiator and Superman is would Know that Hulk does not stand a chance against either guy. Hulk is powerful but Gladiator has too many resouces to fall back on to kick the $hit out of Hulk just like Superman did. The only problem is Gladiator is a 3rd tier character and Marvel wont allow him to beat the fan favorite Hulk. The better match would be Gladiator vs. Superman. Hulk is outclassed in every category including strength. By the time he got to Gladiators level he would be pushin daisies.
__________________
The price of fame is high and the Thing cant pay the way.
Yes he is, he's an old Daredevil villain wearing a helmet. He used to think he lives in ancient Rome. He gave Daredevil trouble, but Spider-Man beat him with one punch lol.
__________________ The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.
Well, it seems pretty hard because it's actually been quite a few years since I've sat back and watch most of those cartoons. ANd as for your percentage, is that actual fact that they follow at least 80% of comic storylines? If so, then I want to see some sources on that. Yeah, they do work with storylines from comics, but that's only SO they have a storyline to work with, rather than come up with something totally original, which they do at times, but not very often. They take some parts from storylines, and add on and make changes to fit the cartoon's continuity. Now if they did actually come as close to following mainstream storylines as you say, then the seasons would be far longer than they actually were. Anyways, we go by actual comic continuity here because it shows actual events showing characters doing what they would actually be able to do (with the exception of a very few, thanks to mis-informed writers). Think about it; Gladiator not budging from a punch from Juggernaut, then a few episodes later having trouble with Rogue, that doesn't seem funny to you? If anything, the rolls should of been reversed. And if you don't believe that, then check out Uncanny X-Men #218, where Rogue hit Juggernaut so hard that every window on the street shattered, and Juggernaut just stood there looking at her with his arms crossed. For a man that's given Hulk trouble on a couple of occasions, to say that punch he gave Gladiator (in the cartoon) would never move him is asinine, in my opinion. Now back when I first saw that episode, when I knew very little about the characters, it was believable sicneI didn't know. Of course I know better now, enough to know that if it were to happen in the mainstream, that it would go down far differently. That's more or less why we don't go by anything done in cartoons, mainly because mainstream is more reliable when it comes to characters. So if I were you, that's what I'd try to stick to, not that you don't have to, you have a right to do so, but no one in here will take any comments from any animated series seriously, unless it's specified that it's an animated version of the character.
Tron, your point about Gladiator no budging from a punch from juggernaut and then getting easily toppled by rogue in the cartoon is a mistake that happens in "ANY" cartoon, it has nothing to do with any comic credibility..Hell, I've seen plenty of comics where the hulk stands up unmoving from a tank shot but yet is toppled by a blow from spiderman...That's just a contradiction of the writers and it happens in comics, movies, cartoons, alike.....
My point is that you guys act like the cartoons goes completely "overboard" with their characters storylines, battles, looks etc...You say a cartoons not "credible" just because your favorite character's blows don't "effect" the enemy as it should, I admit the cartoon doesn't follow the comic down to a tee if it would then comics wouldn't sell a lick because the cartoons would do the comics job...The storylines are basically the same just a little bit rushed and fast-paced...and they tone down the violence to meet channel requirements, so NO they CAN'T follow the comics as accuarately as "You" may want them..
You guys act like the cartoons go so far as making Jubilee DESTROY apocalypse or morph defeat magneto...Of course the cartoons aren't going to be "dead-on" with the comics if it would they would be no use for the comics period..My mentioning 80% was just my way of saying that "majority" of the storylines in the comics are used in the cartoons..
juggernaut74: I see that someone on this board sees where I'm coming from...
Actually, from what I've seen, the most Spider-Man has been able to do to Hulk is make him stumble, and that was a feat for Spidey in itself. But that's another issue altogether...
Okay, we're not, or I'm not, saying that cartoons go completely over the hill. I like most of the cartoons I've seen, some are the reason that some characters in comics exist today (the retconned Mr. Freeze and Harley Quinn from Batman: The Animated Series, and X-23 from X-Men: Evolution). They may do some things that can be compared to comics, of course because that's where their roots are. But, in a forum like this, it's not credible because it's NOT the same character from the comic, debate it all you want, it's the truth. They're displayed as the same character, do some of the same things, but, they're in different universes altogether. It's like comparing to what a character has done in an alternate universe comic, like a What If, or Age of Apocalypse (which is actually a What If if you think about it), etc. The characters represented there might do something amazing, or shitty, but it means little in the mainstream until it's actually shown for those characters to do the same. The mainstream is the backbone, and that's what we go on. It doesn't have a thing to do with favortism (it might with most people, but not the majority). And cartoons won't follow comics to a "T" (which I don't care about, like I said, I like most of them either way), but I won't bring it to a battle in here unless it's specified that it's the animated version of a character from a specific show. And as for storylines, they use the ones from comics, but they're actually used a lot more loosely than you're implying (from what I've seen anyways), which works fine for the cartoon's purpose, but doesn't make it close to the same as it's comic counterpart. Hopefully you understand what I'm telling you, and you can continue to use cartoons in your arguements cause you have a right to do so, only thing is other posters just won't take you seriously when you do, just to let you know. And, no one's denying Hulk cold lose. That comic was all PIS (Plot Induced Stupidity) and CIS (Character Induced Stupidity). It was made specifically for Gladiator to lose. Gladiator could easily beat Hulk on a good day, but, Hulk can beat Gladiator on a good day as well. As long as they're not making Gladiator as dumb as he seemed in that comic, he has a far better chance than what he was shown.
If the "only" reason Hulk beat the snot ouf of Gladiator was because Marvel wanted to give him a Push for his then recent defeat by the hands of Superman, then guess what: HULK SMASH. If Marvel's opinion is that Hulk beats out supe-types, then that's it...it's been established.
Hulk beating Gladiator makes no sense. Its just flat out bad writing made to keep the Hulk fanboys happy.
Gladiator has so many more dimensions than Hulk. Hes far too fast for hulk (which this along with his strength and invunerability alone make it a mismatch) but he can also fly, has that strong breath, eye beams.. Hulk cant beat that.
Whats next, Spiderman beating Mephisto in his own dimension?
I see your point in the cartoons not being taken seriously on this forum and yes I indeed understand your point, but I feel the cartoons are not an alternate reality than that of the comics, but rather a simplified, watered-down, toned down, depiction of what happens in the actual comic storylines..As for different universes altogther, I sincerely think not, they do TRY to depict an actual storyline from the actual comics, now I could realize your point if the cartoons did something SO absolutely far from the comics like creating a totally different storylines, character plots, and made-up villains..but THEY DON'T..And i'm not saying you should give cartoons credit but they do establish some form of truth to that of the comics...The cartoons I'VE seen thus far haven't strayed so far that they seem like an alternate reality to that of the comics..I understand that this forum doesn't use cartoons as credible and my point was to "challenge" that MOST cartoons I see follow the comics to some degree, in fact enough to say that this(cartoon) is at least in the same universe as it's comic counter-part...
JuggernautFan: You have to be a hard-core comic geek to sit there and say "hulk in the movie wasnt nearly as impressive as his comic book counterpart"..I mean I've said it before and I'll site it again, you severe comic geeks try and "intellectualize" EVERYTHING...Nothing can be perfect in a comic geeks eyes, no movie can be made well in the eyes of a comic geek..They'll always say something like "Spiderman is not as wittyin the movie as his comic counterpart" or "The hulk didn't growl enough for my taste"..You lack the money and creativity to make ANY comic book-based movie so just sit back watch the movie and nit-pick to another geek who strives for comic book-like perfection..The hulk movie was a whole helluva lot better than those Lou Ferigno movies that came out years ago..He had the giant-troll like characteristics, the infinite strength when pissed factor, the military on his ass, surviving the nuke...WHAT MORE DO YOU WANT!? They always be some "Fan" who'll sit there and say(despite the fact that they consulted Stan-Lee while making this movie) that it could've been better....The movie kicked ass, it sold millions, it didn't flop like so many other comic-adapted movies, it added ALL of his comic characteristics and thats a fact..So ask yourself this: Can you make a better hulk movie? Do you have the budget to make the movie..no
And I know you're entitled to your own opinion but damn, a movie has to be damn near flawless for some of you guys to like....
Last edited by SarKastic_OJ on Dec 7th, 2004 at 02:51 AM
wait just a second. we can give cartoons credit if you want, but you have to listen to what i said earlier. the cartoons do somewhat go off comics, but what happened to juggernaut from gladiator actually happened to firelord in the comics. they simply replace firelord with juggernaut because they felt firelord wasnt poplular enough with the fans. therefor enough "credibility" wouldnt have been given to gladiator. so while i agree in part you should understand the whole story to use it as an arguement
i'm doing nothing more than what you are doing... so you are just as much a "comic geek" as i am... i dont deal in comics much anymore.
read above
actually i loved the hulk move, and the spiderman movies. you are making rabid assumptions about me. which you shouldnt do because you are quite frankly wrong
read above. you are rambling basically about nothing. actually you are worse than a comic geek. you are a geek who likes to stereo type other geeks because you have no friends and nothing better to do
i like those as well, but i said nothing like that. i was simply saying that to use a cartoon is like using a movie. any of which brings far to many interpretations of the character into play.
i didnt say i wanted anything you rabid geek who makes fun of other geeks.
hmmm, i dont think the movie could have gotten any better. well maybe a little. but again i loved it. see what assuming does? normally they say it makes an A-S-S ouf of U and ME. but in this case it is just making an A-S-S out of YOU.
did i say i did?? did i say i want to?? actually if you read reviews on the movie, regardless of how much you like it. there probably wont be a sequel because of how ill it was accepted. but look at spiderman and x-men who did exceptionally well in the movies as well as sequels.
i have no idea why you particularly started with me. i was simply relating to you what its like using a cartoon as a reference. its just not... right.
KMC Community Forums
Dec 3rd, 2004 10:05 PM
