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he had never been seen in comics before the mini series Manjaro the backstory was made up:-
One of the many examples from the web
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/t...428747?v=glance
Collecting The Sentry's five-issue mini-series, along with the five subsequent one-shots, Sentry: Fantastic Four, Sentry: X-Men, Sentry: Spider-Man, Sentry: Hulk and Sentry vs. The Void, this has to be one of the most overwrought, anti-climactic, and ultimately pointless marketing stunts ever. [Marvel claimed The Sentry was a long-lost Silver Age creation of Stan Lee's that pre-dated the Fantastic Four.] To reinforce that fact, it includes a series of "interviews" between Stan Lee and Marvel EIC, Joe Quesada, that plays along with the hoax; reprints of various Wizard articles that ran in support of it; and a note from Wizard Staff Writer, Chris Lawrence, vainly attempting to rationalize the whole thing: "The goal wasn't to mislead anyone or betray anyone, but to get fans to further suspend their disbelief, to lead them to better appreciate the intricacies of Paul Jenkins' plot, to help them have fun."
Gee, I remember when it was the quality of the work in question that got fans to "suspend their disbelief" and "have fun." Silly me!
The mini-series introduces Bob Reynolds, a potbellied, alcoholic schlub who wakes up one stormy night remembering he was once the greatest superhero the world had ever known, and the realization that his greatest enemy had returned. What follows is a mildly intriguing piece of Rashômon-style meta-fiction that tells the story of a superhero no one remembers and the reasons why.
The whole thing is one big fanboy circle-jerk as writer Paul Jenkins has a good time with this ridiculous - though, at times, clever and entertaining - retcon of the entire Marvel Universe that makes Straczynski's recent "Sins Past" sullying of the sainted Gwen Stacy look timid in comparison. The mini-series and the final one-shot, Sentry vs. The Void tell the meat of the story, from Reynolds' efforts to figure out why no one remembers The Sentry - including the various heroes he fought alongside, many of whom even attended his wedding, not to mention Peter Parker whose photograph of The Sentry won him a Pulizter Prize! - to the final confrontation with his arch-nemesis, The Void. The other one-shots flesh out various characters' memories of The Sentry through some achingly navel-gazing exposition that mostly serves to reinforce just how great a hero The Sentry was.
One could argue that the story's conclusion, with the Sentry once again forgotten, is a dig at Superman himself, taking the stance that for every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction, and as such, a being as powerful as Superman (or the Sentry) would necessitate an equally powerful evil that would ultimately doom the world. It's an interesting concept that Jenkins pulls off more in the subtext than on the surface. On the surface, it's similar to most time travel stories where, if you look at them too closely, the "logic" holding them together falls apart.
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herd behavior is a comical thing - Thanks Silver Spider
ummm my point exactly i guess. :/ this is just an attempt to refresh him without having to explain all the back story stuff. intsead of going thru the drama of finding out where he came from and all that he was just thrown in and it was like" he killed his wife and turned himself in, and he's been in prison all this time." and ppl are like oohhh ok, and its left at that. so i say just give him some time to make up his mind if he wants to be a hero or not.......you know cuz every returning hero in a tattered costume has to go thru some inner conflict. PIS at its finest but im ok with this one.
The more I read about his backstory, the bigger that 'ripoff' label sits on the Sentry's chest. It's Superman and Mr. Incredible and the forgotten memory ideas from Miracleman and early Thor. The harder Marvel tries, the more I feel Sentry being shoved down my throat, when we should try to grow to like him. And the costume is blah. Christ.
Thor can't return too soon for me.
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"I'm not smart so much as I am not dumb." - Harlan Ellison
Could someone explain to me why Sentry got all this power from a chemical serum ???????? What the hell did it do to him ? How does being out of sync with time give him his powers ?
Well, we'll see. After all this hype, Marvel isn't going to back down and get rid of him. Let's see how he evolves.
Maybe they should take a page out of the 'Supreme' title, when Liefeld brought in Alan Moore to write it. Moore might be amused at writing Sentry - like a character he's written before.
I never read Miracleman. I like the Sentry because it's interesting to see how the Superman archetype fits into the Marvel Universe, which has never had anything like that before. (Thor may be similar power-wise, but he's so dissimilar to Superman in personality that it's no comparison.)
I loved Paul Jenkin and Jae Lee's miniseries, and the new one with JRJR is good so far too. (Unlike others, I think JRJR is a good fit for the hyper-stylized stories the Sentry is built for, and I like his design on the Sentry's gauntlets.)
The Sentry may be cast from the Superman mold, but he's a much more realistic look at the character, in my opinion. Pretend you had the senses to detect someone in distress anywhere on earth, but of course you can't be everywhere at once--who do you save? When do you take time off for yourself, condemning people you could have rescued? How could a character like that NOT have an overwhelming dark side?
A great new character, in my opinion. The Sentry, unlike most new Marvel characters, has been lucky enough to land a high-profile position in the continuity. Others (Toxin, Gravity, etc.) have not been so fortunate. Despite my quickly-petrifying cynicism with the mainstream universes, I'm hoping against hope that the Sentry is just the herald of new characters to come, perhaps putting an end to the stayed and cyclic existence of characters that were once so dynamic.
Your opinion is noted. But SERIOUSLY, more realistic? Hah! Drinking a magic potion that gives you unlimited energies and the power of a million exploding suns, AND having a hard-light construct that occasionally comes out to wreak havoc is more realistic? No way in hell.
Again. This is a delibrate plagarism of Superman's persona. Heard of super-hearing? Telescopic vision. The guy can hear atoms scarpe together for god's sake. People in Marvel act like this a new take on the Superman persona. People, it ain't. Superman goes through exactly the same thing everyday. Except he holds up better than the other pansy.
Again. Superman. The themes you mentioned is purely and abudantly Superman mythology.
No he ain't. Supes is a boyscout. The Sentry's got ****ing Multiple Personality Disorder.
I meant realistic as in psychologically, as a character. I don't give a damn what pseudoscientific bullcrap they put into the backstory. I don't care how people measure up in feats. When I try to decide if I like a character or a story, my first thought isn't "HOW DOES THIS STACK UP AGAINST SUPERMAN? WHAT DOES HE LIFT? HAS ANYONE TRIED TO CLOCK HIS TELEPORT RAPIDITY THROUGH A CONGEALING HEMIGLOBULAR MATRIX OF INVERSED TIME BLAH BLAH BLAH" I just ask if it's a good story and a relatable character.
I know what Superman can do. I love the character, but he's totally unrealistic. Here's a guy who can hear kids in Africa screaming for their mother, dead from AIDS, to get up and feed them. Here's a guy who can hear Mary Lee in Deluth County getting beaten by her redneck boyfriend and getting ignored by social services. Superman can, while having a picnic on the Daily Planet roof with Lois Lane, hear some poor kid surfing in Australia get mauled by a shark. Or a woman in Johannasburg getting raped.
The fact that Superman ISN'T messed up makes him an unrealistic character. Sentry inverses that--he can hear all this, and to deal with it he delegates the decisionmaking to his computer C.L.O.C.K. Here's a guy who has the potential to save everyone but can't, and he has to live with that. Superman has NEVER seriously addressed this. If he did, he'd be just as messed up and psychologically damaged as The Sentry is, and he's not.
You know what? It doesn't matter. Why do we have Superman AT ALL, when the guy is a big fat ripoff of Jesus? Sent from above to protect humanity, died and returned to save us? Didn't we all hear this story in Sunday School? You think you can just give the guy a cape and call it new?
NOTHING is new. And if you get hung up on that, then you've got Simpsons Did It syndrome.
Character bashing in itself is absurd. There are characters I completely loathe, but I don't waste time dwelling on it. If you don't like the Sentry (or in my case Psylocke and Cable, the OP-bitches) then don't bother with them. It doesn't help to just knock the characters and irritate their fans.
Uh. Yes. He is. Yellow paint + Superman + a funny shadow = Sentry. Nothing distinct at all. Read ahead for just how wrong you are....
That's fine and all good.
And he suffers through this every single day. He can't save everyone. He deserves a life too. THAT's why (if you actually read his comics) he focuses his hearing on Lois' heart. To block out the noise. Superman saves people when he can. But he will not and cannot let the people depend on him for situations they can handle themselves and can handle themselves. A giant alien spacecraft attacking Metropolis? Superman will handle it. A murderer killing his wife? That's up to mankind. Piedmon, there have been TONS of issues addressing this moral dilemma. So many issues, the dilemma has grown damn right stale. He recognizes his limitations but he also realizes that his limitations are nearly microscopic in comparision to others. He can't do EVERYTHING but he can damn near get close to doing EVERYTHING. But Superman believes himself not to be a god or some angel. But an inspiration for a better tomorrow.
As Superman said, "mankind has its own mountain to climb. We're here to catch them if they fall" No quote in existance perpetuates the EXACT idealism of Superman.
Again. Absolutely not. Seriously, there are TONS of comic issues addressing this problem. Hell, one time he got so fed up with all the noise and suffering he took over the damn planet. The JLA brought him back to his senses with Lois Lane's emotional support. Superman may seem sane. But he's not. Not really. Everything the Sentry feels, Superman feels tenfold. Why? Because not only does he have to watch out for planet Earth, the entire damn universe depends on him from time to time. The point you're missing is LOIS. Lois Lane is the ONLY thing keeping Superman sane. That's why Mr. Mxy explictly stated that Lois Lane is the 2nd most important being in the universe. Why? If something should ever happen to Lois Lane, Superman will snap. He'd go mad. Without some focal point to harness his hearing and sight on, he'd go nuts. Seriously, if you actually read his comics you'd know that Superman suffers from numerous psychological problems. Perfectionism. Obsessive Compulsiveness. Neutroticsm. A form of bipolar disorder. It's not stated explicted. But if you read his books, his mental state clearly is very fragile and entirely dependant on ONE woman. Which is why Lois Lane dying would make a GREAT storyline.
Actually he's more like Vishnu but whatever....
And no, there ARE traces of Jesus in him but it's almost entirely Judaic in nature. He was made to be a Jewish archetype.
I'm hardly hung up. I'm just a little peeved that people are saying Sentry is a completely new twist on Superman when it's NOT. Certainly not enough people read his comics and in the worst way do NOT understand his character. It really annoys me that people cling to this 1950's version of Superman when his character has GREATLY expanded as of thus. But people won't ever know nor will they have have the desire to know...
Sentry is a blatant rip-off of Superman. But his personal problems and moral dilemmas isn't a complete twist on Superman. They're identical. And people don't seem to realize this...
And South Park is WAY more original than Simpsons!
I'm not a fan of him but I don't really hate him. To be honest I'm indifferent to him. I couldn't care either way. What REALLY irritates me is when people say Sentry is more realistic than Superman or if they LOVE Sentry for certain reasons and HATE Superman for the EXACT same reasons because they don't understand Superman's character.
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Last edited by Draco69 on Nov 21st, 2005 at 11:26 PM
The more I think about it, the less like Superman Sentry is. I disagree that Lois is the ONLY thing keeping Superman sane.... I think, irrespective of realism, that he's a stronger person than that. He doesn't need crutches. But she does help. By contrast, Sentry's wife Linda (I think that was it) actually HINDERS him. She's made it very clear she's in love with The Sentry, not Bob Reynolds (and when she forgot Reynolds was Sentry, their marriage was in dire straits.) That brings me into my next point....
Clark Kent is a fabricated identity for Kal-El/Superman. Clark Kent is Superman acting. Clark Kent is, to quote Torantino, "Superman's take on the rest of humanity."
The Sentry is a personality created by Bob Reynolds. Bob was born Bob. He had to become the Sentry--that right there greatly shifts the dynamic away from Superman. Superman is an alien, an archetypical overbeing of sorts who descends TO us, humanity. Sentry is one of us, a human, who has made that ascent to become the superheroic overbeing.
Anyway, from what you yourself just said, Superman is adjusted to the problem of being confronted with everyone's sufferings. He's got Lois, he's dealing with it. Rob Reynolds is NOT. That's why The Void is still there, and that's why Reynolds' instability makes him as much potential threat as savior.
If Superman thought that his powers could present a danger to the people of earth, I don't doubt he'd sacrifice them for the greater good. He's virtuous like that. Sentry had that very choice and chose to keep his powers. Why? He didn't do it for the people he protects. He did it because he likes being a superhero, he likes having powers. He is the Sentry out of a selfish desire, not altruism.
Didn't they just have one where she vanished and Superman couldn't figure out how to bring her back, causing him to go almost crazy for a while? Anyway, I'm sure you could point to at least one point in the various decades of his existence where that has been done. So why should I want to read it when I can scour out the original? Follow your own logic through to its end point, and why should they even keep writing Superman? We've seen him turn evil, we've seen him lose people close to him, we've seen every type of story you could possibly do with the character. Why not close the book on him?
Please don't get into semantics, life is too short.
Maybe not a complete twist, but 90 degrees at least, for the reasons I've just described and more. Besides, even if he was a Superman "clone"--maybe Paul Jenkins has a Superman story to tell that DC would never let him get away with? Dr. Manhattan wasn't Superman, but we all knew what he was meant to stand for, and that's what gave his role in Watchmen its bite. Paul Jenkins isn't Brian Bendis, and neither of them are Brian Azzarello, Greg Rucka, or Joe Schuster. Any of these guys could write a story about the exact same character and they'd be totally different stories, because all people are unique, and we each of us have our own slightly different angle to view Superman.
You're making quite an argument about something you're indifferent too.... I like Superman AND Sentry, I don't see why they can't coexist and compliment each other in the grand narrative of comic history.
I love Kill Bill by the way. But he was specifically refering to a long past dead Superman of the past. Superman is NOT Kal-El. He's Clark Kent. He's a Kansas farmboy who just happens to be A Kryptonian alien. Pre-Crisis (Christopher Reeve) Superman was in favor of nature. THIS Superman however is in favor of NUTURE. Clark Kent is not a fabrication. It's who he is. Who he was raised to be. And the moral foundation of what Superman is today. Clark Kent is the REAL Superman. Without the cape. Without the emblem. It's the persona where he can just lie back and act himself. Again, you misunderstand Superman's personality.
Superman is also a personality created by Clark Kent. A combination of his Earthly and Kryptonian ideals. A marriage of the epitome of human success and Kryptonian preservation.
Superman was not born Kal-El. Superman was born Clark Kent. Kal-El merely exists in name and homage to the past. Everything Superman is, everything Superman believes in, his ideals, his beliefs, his "Boy Scoutism" is purely and utterly Clark Kent. He was RAISED to be a farmer. He was raised to be a successor to the farm despite his powers.
No. It doesn't. The dynamic you speak of doesn't exist. You're relying on the dead past, my friend. Clark Kent had also had to become Superman. Did he want to fly around in a cape, saving damsels in distress at first? Hell no, he wanted nothing to do with it. But when he discovered the truth about his heritage and where he came from, he realized he had a higher purpose. He CAN'T just let his powers to come to waste. You see Superman could have NEVER come into being without the marriage of human idealism and Kryptonian preservation. Without this defining moment, Superman would have never come to past. As was shown numerous times in Action Comics...
No, no, no. Superman IS an alien who does not merely descend TO us. He GREW with us. He was just a babe. All his mannerisms, idealisms, cultural awarnesses, and sense of right and wrong all stem from us. WE raised Superman. WE in a sense gave birth to Superman. Truth, justice, and the American way. He "ascented" when he vowed to prevent what happened to Krypton from happening to Earth. Again, the marriage of Human and Kryptonian.
As shown above, that's exactly what Superman did as well...
Duly noted. And quite possibly the only minor divergance in the Superman mythology, the Sentry is portraying.
Which is why he makes several characters like Batman keep kryptonite and other "anti-Superman" plans to prevent his powers representing a threat. And they do. Everyday. Superman continually struggles to limit his powers to a very base level. Which is why he has trouble with losers like Toyman. He can crush the planet with his bare hands. Burn the atmosphere to sparse molecules. Render the planet as lifeless as it's moon. Superman IS a danger to the world. And while people love him, they will not hestiate to turn him the moment he makes a wrong move. They fear him. And yet they need him. He keeps his powers because the world would be ****ed without him. He'd love to give up his powers. But he can't.
I disagree. Sentry is clearly under the pressure of saving the world thrice every hour. He has a dark personality that stalks his mind. He "feels the weight of the world on his shoulders". And does he give up his powers despite the danger to his own life and the world? No. Because the world needs him. They need him to prevent world disasters no single superhero except him can handle. See the similarities?
No. Hardly. You didn't read the story correctly. Albeit it was confusing... Anyhoo, Superman (due to the self-repression of building the Vanishing Machine) subconciously knew that Lois was still alive and well. Which is why he didn't go completely nuts. He WAS unstable but it's not anywhere near the crazyiness that Superman would experience if Lois was actually dead.
Pfft. Please. Let's look at your sig character for example. Wolverine's character has been shredded, eaten, microwaved as leftovers, and whatever scraps that still remain have been turned into soup. There's nothing left him. Ooh. "I can't remember my tortured past." Been done a hundred times. He remembers his past now. That bites the dust. Marriage? Failed twice. Kids? One dead, one a clone and one is god knows where. Romance? Wolverine has ****ed nearly every female in existance. There's no suspense anymore. Wolverine is dead as a character. So is Spider-Man. So is Batman. And yet we keep reading these comics because they all possess timeless elements that keep us coming back. Sentry doesn't have timeless elements of his own to speak of. Which is apparent by his low sales of his comics and the clamoring of many Avenger-fans to ditch his butt and bring back Thor. Believe it or not, Sentry is only temporary. He's a fad character. Like Apoc or Prometheus. They're big for a few weeks but they die out in favor of the originals. Sentry doesn't have any apparent longitivity. He'll finally go crazy later on in a year or so. Another Onslaught-esque saga. Lots of useless heroes die. And everything is well again.
Please don't be pompous in grammatical structure and arguement analysis. Especially considering the lighteness of the subject...
Your reasons have been rebutted on count of your complete lack of Superman's characters. It's more like a 178 degrees. The 2 degrees go to his way of getting his powers and his Void personality. Only new material. And damn boring at that.
Thing is. The story has been done. Lots of times. Especially in alternate universes...
Red Son Superman anybody? The Nail?
Yes. Dr. Manhattan is a Superman clone. But at least they gave him some original twists on his character without completely plagarizing his character.
They could post different angles all they want, the picture of Superman remains the same. You're reaching.
I said I was indifferent to Sentry as a character because I recognize that his longetivity as a long-term character is about the same as a condom in Anna Nicole Smith's pocketbook.
I am NOT indifferent to the complete misunderstand of Superman's personality and character, as well as how Sentry is ANYTHING but a twist on Superman. He's Superman with yellow paint and an imaginary foe.
They CAN coexist. I never said they couldn't. But Sentry is by no means a new take on Superman. They're essentially to the bare bones the same character. And as shown in various polls and comic book forums, the Sentry's complete lack of originality spurs off alot of comic fans, both Marvel and DC alike. Marvel fans don't like him because he's too much like Superman and they don't want a Superman in Marvel. DC fans don't like him because he's a complete rip-off of Superman and they already have a Superman. Thus by such a general consensus, I predict Sentry has a very short lifespan. All hype, really.
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Aug 29th, 2005 10:50 PM
