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Not an insult when its a fact
RODV and the fight with the dark lady disproves that. Oh and he too used the force against a jedi during the purge. That pretty much disproves your speculation
Vader dropped his blade when he underestimated the dark lady and guess what? He used the force!
Your point falls
Says the one who cannot debate nor back up his claims
Uh huh. So because vader didnt use the force against maul means he is never going to use it against anybody? Perfect analogy friend. Seems i have answered the question i asked myself: why does no one take you seriously?
Obviously anakin fought along side mace during the clone wars, he knows the danger of vaapad and shatter point, he knows that if he were to face mace windu 1v1 in a lightsaber duel and he would get owned so because he is smart and has demonstrated it to use several times, he will use the force. proof? Rodv, jedi puege, dark lady, common sense,
Your point falls
For maul, it is a different case, Did he know mauls fighting style at all? He has never seen him fight, he only saw maul and the 2 jedi ignite their sabers. And even IF he did saw the entire duel, he wouldnt be able to register his opponents moves because he was not yet a jedi
Im still waiting for concrete proof he will not use the force against mace seeing that he has used the force on several other force users. Your point falls
That's gameplay from Empire At War, moron. I could have Han Solo shoot down a stationary AT-AT with his blaster in the video game. Obi-Wan, Yoda, and Luke could team up to fight Vadr and the Emperor. I could make pretty much whatever I want happen in the game - that make it canon? No.
Seriously, think.
Who the hell are you to call anyone else a noob? And Mace's display of telekinesis in Shatterpoint is well beyond anything Vader has ever canonically displayed. Mace owns Vader in a duel, wins a moderately difficult battle in an all-out fight, and may or may not win a very hard Force competition.
This makes no sense at all, but good job.
Against several lesser Jedi that any SW great could beat, yeah.
I don't really see Mace winning in a force fight against a Vader who has trained under Sidious for the past 20 years and mastered the dark side to a very high magnitutde. Then again, Mace does have Vaapad which was good enough to beat Sidious.It's possible that Vader has certain techniques that could get through Mace's defenses, but I'm not too sure what he possesses in his arsenal as of ANH. I'm sure there are sourcebooks that list this. However, in a saber fight, Mace would wtfpwn Vader.
I'd lean more towards Vader in a Force battle simply because he's a pretty strong Sith Lord, and so is obviously going to have more offensive powers at his arsenal than Mace.
When did he use the Force against the Dark Woman? I seem to remember him having his blade the entire time (and in the end, cutting down a tree). Yes, he did use the Force to help the tree fall over quickly, but he first used his saber to weaken the tree's support.
True, he did use the Force against Roan Shryne.
Says the one who debates with insults and when asked for proof, replies saying he wants proof of the opposite.
Since when has Roan Shryne been several Force Users?
I also remind to see, in this same game, Mara Jade destroying a tower with a blaster...
Well, maybe that's why windu deflected sidious' lightning back to win and completly melted his face. Great example...
So, you are still to prove that vader>windu in the force. Also, i dare you to prove me that windu had less then 80% from sidious potential. By the way, don't forget to tell us who the half machine sith will beat windu when he beat maul with simple luck, lost to padawan skywalker (holding back or not, he canonly lost, and if Luke had struck him down, Vader would be dead), had a draw with boba fett (windu killed jango quite quickly and easily) and is quite weaker then sidious in the force and even more with his saber, the same sith windu beat...
You see, when someone is this bias for a character, a simple feat is greatly enhanced and multiplied to incredible (and imaginary) levels...
Last edited by kamhal on Aug 22nd, 2007 at 08:20 PM
Registered: Jun 2005
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How bout learning to stfu an debate?
Answer:
I concede that point as i took it from gameplay.
When it was too late yes
If vader strikes with force crush first and if macedoesnt put up his defence in time
Simple luck in a Lightsaber duel moron, not with the Force
Luek himself stated that vader could have easily killed him and that was a post DE luke stating that vader was holding back.
You fail again noobhal,
Um imaginary? No. I tried using stuff from gameplay. Oh and about being bias iv seen you being really bias towards revan, You yourself tried using debatable quotes to put revan above exar that time
Registered: Jun 2005
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Um using the force to try to drown the dark lady?
You contradict yourself, First you said because he didnt use the force against maul so it means he wouldnt use it against mace which also means he wouldnt use it against any one
says the one who never proves anything
Did you read my posts? I said the dark lady and the jedi from purge
The point im argueing to this guy is vader would use the force weather he will win or lose.
He is disputing that because he didnt use the force against maul so it means he is not going to use it against anybody including inferior jedi
Well, what if Mace strikes Vader with the force crush? Because windu's force crush against the super battle droids in Dantoine and later against Grievous was quite impressive too...
I saw Maul killing the Nightsister while being target by a force lightning. Prove me that Vader could have used the force to beat him then. And after that try to prove the same for windu, who is undoubtly stronger then maul in the force, and also a power house in physical strength (though not as strong as Maul). You see, to beat someone with the force you need to be quite stronger then him or at least caugh him off guard.
Ah, by the way, you are also quite a big moron too.
Happy to see that you ignored boba fett and sidious reference.Anyway, my point was, even that it's true that Vader could have (PROBABLY) used the force to beat Luke, if Luke had actually strike him down he would be dead. So, like it or not, he was defeated.
The point is, Revan is only a RPG character, so obviously i have to use quotes from the game to explain and justify his power. Also, the game is quite precise when it comes to canon, putting his characters in levels of power viable for the star wars world. Now, when a game allows a tower be destroyed by a blaster, this shows how close the game is from the star wars reality.
and vader doesnt know maces power or abilities because it was said that vader forgot about his past except for padme, yoda, and obi wan, and tatooine. he probably wouldnt even know who mace was
In force, it could go either way. Mace has at the very least, enough skill to use Force Crush. Given Anakin's physical state, such an attack could be devastating. On the other hand, Anakin has at the very least Force Scream and Choke. I believe Mace may take this simply because I've never really seen too much offensive Force use from Vader besides punishing his minions.
Registered: Jun 2005
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Seriously kamhal. Who EVER takes you seriously here?
Maces force crush was unable to kill grievious while vaders force crush was able to destroy an entire medical room with ease. And he used it by just getting angry and imagine the amount of damage he can unleash if he actually used a technique.
Oh and vaders apprentice whom is weaker than him was able to destroy a star destroyer with the force. Easily as well.Want to call me a liar? Watch the force unleashes trailer then
so? Can you prove that he couldnt? He has used the force to kill his opponents several times. The feats that vader did with the force clearly > mauls i believe. Unless you want to prove maul > vader in the force which you will never will even if some one else did
He sent a thug crashing into a wall and send tark flying in the air onto the ceiling against the flow of gravity
And vader wins a fairly hard fight with mace in the force. He has studied under the most powerful with lord in history for 20 over years Get over it kamhal, Most of us here agree vader is slightly stronger than mace in the force
so? Um no, your the only moron here trying to be a debator who have yet to even say anything logical
[/B][/QUOTE] so?
Uh big deal boba escaped vader so it means he is weak. Very good analogy
Uh no. Luke himself stated vader could have easily killed him with the force if he didnt hold back. Get this in your head moron
Uh and he was holding back. So like it or not, vader held back and didnt use full power
Quotes which are debatable moron. You could have used revans feats and the statement in POD to put revan > exar which i would agree. But no, you had to be stupid to use a quote coming from a fallible third party character
[/B][/QUOTE]
So i get that nihilus did lift a fleet of starships as said by tobin when out of universe sources said he only lifted the ravager?
There prove to you that third pt characters are fallible.
Precise my ass. Kreia even stated the ancient sith will make the masters of her era look like children with toys when all we see about the ancient sith is that ludo couldnt even block a brick thrown by sadow
While vader destroyed a tank in gameplay, I dont see why he cant do it canonically. Given his force mastery and skills
He would, He still remembered darth maul when he met him
Registered: Jun 2005
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Then its settled. Your disputing that because he didnt use the force against maul it means he is not going to use it against anyone.
Why would he use it against mace? Because he knows mace is going to mop the floor with his ass if he engages him in a pure saber fight. As if vader doesnt know mace moped sidious ass when he was in a saber only match.
Use a bit of logic darth sith. Now i will not insult you seeing that it is childish doing so(except for kamhal)
settled
That is not an isolated case, remember him choking a jedi while fending off 2 other knights with a lightsaber? He is using the force. And when did he use the force against the dark lady?
He pulled a waterfall attempting to drown her and if you use the force to use the environment to your advantage, that counts as using the force against your opponent doesnt it. Im sure we can agree on that.
There you go. Iv answered your question.
And you need to note. If you were a powerful jedi and know you will lose to this guy in a saber fight seeing that he owned your master in a pure saber duel. Would you be
1) Foolish enough to engage in a duel
Or
2) use the force?
Im sure you would be smart enough to use the force especially when your strength lies in the force
Uh a few do when i bring up a logical point? To be honest, i do take you seriously and when i was flaming you the last few posts. I wasnt thinking and wanting to lash out. So you have my sincere apologies
Anyways about who wins this fight? Im sure mace owns him in a saber fight.
Vader wins a moderately difficult force fight
And as for an all out fight. It depends on the situation and what vader or mace choose to do.
Can we agree? Or do you want to get in a serious debate this time because im tired of argueing with kamhal who brings up absurd points
Kadesh, I was agreeing that Vader used the Force against Roan, and that it was a good point. But that once case doesn't prove that he'll use the Force against Mace.
Yet this is the third post you did to answer me...
First, mace's force crush was strong enough to making a deadly foe like grievous in a little pussy who was beat in 30 seconds by obi-wan. And did vader used force crush "to destroy an entire medical room with ease"? When this happens actually? lol... Besides, tell me one deadly force crush that vader had ever used.By the way, notice that grievou's body armor was made from duranium, whih "It was extremely durable, and was capable of withstanding a glancing blow from a lightsaber"- wookipedia.
Have you played the game already? Because you are using as arg some imagines from a game whose plot is unknown yet. And didn't want vader to use his apprentice to beat sidious? Also, prove me that vader's apprentice is weaker then him. Guess what, the game and storyline isn't even out yet...
So, i can't prove he couldn't, you can prove he could. Yet the true is that he din't use the force against him and maul almost killed him.
The same sith lord who was beat by windu? And this arg is quite stupid, anakin studied under obi-wan and yet he beat dooku, who was stronger then obi-wan, and qui-gon studied under dooku and was beat by maul, dooku's inferior. This proves anything?
So what? Now i have to subdue myself to "most of yours"? Now i don't have freedom to express a different opinion is that? What if most of us thought that you are an *******, this makes you an ******* (quite controversial affirmation since it may actually touches the true)?
I hope you noticed that i called you moron after you did the same to me for no reason at all. And I call you a moron again since you called me moron once more and since you seem to love using insults.
You should have a very low IQ. I never tried to arg against this affirmation, even though it can be contested, i was merely pointing out that if Luke would actually strike him down, vader's superior force pwoers would mean nothing, he would be dead.
Also, third time in a row you call me a moron. I think it's official that you lack proper social education.
So, you just said that, due to POD, you agree that revanZexar= Thank you for saying that, i will not forget it next time we have such debate. By the way, do you really think you are offending me? Perhaps if you washed your mother properly you wouldn't say so much sh*t.
I think you are greatly confusing KOTOR with KOTOR II. In case you failed to noticed, they are 2 different games made by 2 different companies. Besides, haven't we agreed that sidious had done better then nihilus already? Thus, making nihilus powers and techniques canon...
Registered: Jun 2005
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Seems the idiot never watched ROTS. Vader does it at the end
Lol yet obiwan was able to bend GG's armour easily and hacked of his arms. Nice try kamhal. As usual your an idiot
It was a cut scene in the trailer = it canon and it appears in concept art meaning it IS going to be part of the game
Actually he wanted to beat sidious WITH his apprentice because sidious > both of them individually
Your always asking for proof when you never prove anything except shit from wookiepedia. If vaders apprentice is stronger than him he would have killed vader and became sidious apprentice
Vader chose to engage him in a saber duel not knowing maul is better than him in sabers. Idiot if vader chose to use the force from the start he could have killed maul
Quit using a>b>c. And just what the bloody hell are you trying to say? Your english sucks thus why nobody wants to quote you and take you seriously
Cuz no one wants to take you seriously. I have yet to see you even win a debate. You always lose, ill tell you what goto lucasforums.com, They need morons like you
You ARE a moron. Get over it. You dont back up what you say and you make ridiculous claims
Then its funny i apologised to Darthsith except you. Why? I can take him seriously, he can bring up good points but you cant. Instead your an idiot acting like a debator which i think advent said in the past
Lol like you even have an IQ of 1
No, you were trying to dispute a ROTJ luke being superior[b/] to vader because he lost. I just gave you the facts.
And so what if he was going to die if luke struck him with his lightsaber? This bears no relevance to a fight with mace windu.
See? Your just an idiot who brings up irrelevant points
Uh then you better get used to it. I have good friends IRL whom i can trust, seems your wrong and i dont like idiots acting like interllectuals
Lol so because you cant hurt me with simple words now you want to bring in my mother? LOL in the first place do you even have a father?
No! your a fatherless bastard friend and your mother sold you for 50 cents to a homeless dude who ****ed your backside everyday problably traumatising you which kind of hints to me why you are so stupid
So? The novels are also written by different authors. What is your point?
Pathetic rebuttals
Read ressurection. When vader met maul he shouts "DARTH MAUL??" and he knew maul was killed by obi wan
Im not really using that one case seeing that it holds no water
Anyways like i said vader knows how dangerous mace is with a lightsaber so it would be logical to assume vader is being smart to use the force at a distanct
Registered: Jun 2005
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@ Darthsith dont expect a reply too soon. I gotta go somewhere and may not be back here for maybe a month or two so i may not be able to continue the debate.
As for you kamhal. Go ahead and prove your stupidity. I wont even bother getting on a comp to argue with a prick like you. Say what you want, not like i will be reading it due to my absence so go talk to a wall
So know a force scream or a rage attack is force crush?
Note: i advise you to stop with the insults because you can't win anything with it since they mean absolutly nothing to me and even worst for you, they just make you looking rude and stupid, taking your credibility for debating.
Yeah, Obi-wan easily OPENED a duranium armour. Which this shows you? That mace's force crush was very powerful, in order to let his armour in such weak state. By the way, since you use insults in every single sentence you use, i will start to consider them as a compliment. So, please, you don't need to be so polite in every sentence ok ?
Then why Vader didn't use the force after maul disarmed him? Hmm...
Yet you answered to me again. And i am not using the a>b>c arg, if you can actually learn how to read you will notice that i was showing you that training under the supervision from a very strong jedi or sith doesn't makes you stronger then another person who was trained under a weak sith/jedi. But obviously you lack the intelligence to read a simple sentence and to notice such obvious thing. By the way, my english sucks? First, yours is not that good either, and second, I am not even from USA, UK or other native english speaker, what do you expect? And i didn't ask you to speak fluently portuguese did I?
So, i ask you why i have to subdue my opinions to other people's opinions, and your answer is "Cuz no wants to take you seriously". Lol, look, i am starting to think what kind of person you are because your speech is completly senseless. And i "lose" a debate? So, what i suppose to "lose"? And you are suppose to win what, a cup or something? And when did i "lose" a debate? Have a nice day once again.
Once again, have a nice day.
Insults again? You are so unoriginal. At least change the insult.
Hmm, do you want to my IQ? Last time i did a test from IQ i had 13 years old i took 140 from a adult test. Since them i can surely say that my mind is more developed. If you don't belive just send me a IQ test for me to make, but a dificult one please, the ones on the net are absurdly easy to do. Ah, and i forgot to say, i entered in Medicine this year with a candidature note of 19,3.
See what? Have i disagree that Vader>Luke in the force? If you read several points behind i was enumerating the foes that beat Vader. And it's not irrelevant because it shows who vader is reluctant in using the force in a fight, which i could use as evidence, saying that Vader would not use the force against Mace as he always did and so he would lost pretty badly.
Do you have good IRC friends? Thank good all my friends are made from bone and flesh and i can actually go out with them to the beach or the cinema
For your information i wanted to write "wash you mouth", but somehow your "mother" came out. I apologise for that, because even though you lack education as i already said, i will not put myself in such low level.
Godo to see you ignored the rest of the answer. In that case i will not answer you as well.
Last edited by kamhal on Aug 25th, 2007 at 03:17 PM
Aug 22nd, 2007 06:01 AM
