An abstract-level entity (doesn't have to be Omega; substitute Stranger, a Celestial, the Watcher, In-Betweener, etc.) was blinded by Spider-Man's webbing.
If I told you-on-pane-Eson the Searcher or Uatu or Arishem was blinded by Spider-Man's webbing, would you say that's a good showing for Spider-Man? Would you say a bad showing for Arishem? Or would you say an IMPRESSIVE showing for Arishem?
Omega was beaten by an explosion that was 1/2 of the explosion that Galactus survived in the Hunger story. Omega is supposedly 2X of Galactus' power, so as far as concerning on panel feats, Omega is actually 1/4 of the power that he was stated to have in the very same comic. Not impressive.
Take into consideration that with less then a week of prep he stop nearly killed Galactus and took down Hunger when he enter 616 he didn't stop him completely but slow him down quite abit.
He wasnt even finished. Thanos didnt budge him with a blast while he sent Galactus flying. Galactus depleted vital energies piercing one Thanos shield while Omega easily waded through three.
Omega had weaknesses that Galactus doesnt have but i clearly more powerful. Dnt ignore the writer's intentions simply because you dont like it.
Galactus was almost destroyed by a planetary explosion in Thanos own series.
It took away his sight for a moment and their resistance wasnt doing a thing to him.
The Watcher was recently beaten down by Rulk so I think its rather humorous you would bring him up.
Omega had flaws,but power wasnt one of them.
Reread my other post to see more of me just shredding the Omega hate in favor of galactus which doesnt make any sense and ignores the writer's intentions.
When did "active ALL defensive shielding" turn into one shield? And Galactus was already at that point of time weakened, hence he depleted energy Omega was at full power and still at the beginning struggled to get past one Shield.
Don't ignore the on panel feats and numerous showings just because Thanos says that Omega is supposedly at least twice as powerful as Galactus something Omega never showed anything to support.
Galactus was almost "destroyed" after having used energy on breaking all of Thanos shields and having battled Hunger, and still a planetary collision and the bombs placed by Thanos wasn't sufficiant to Kill Galactus, but a planetary explosion was enough to kill a full powered Omega...
Galactus called it a mere force field. Meaning one. Thanos activated all defensive shielding available to him at the time into one field. Galactus needed to feed because of all the energy he depleted in doing so.
Thanos created Omega who also knew Galactus had a 60 percent chance of surviving the Hunger blast. Genis-vell also agreed with his cosmic senses that Thanos was correct about Omega being more powerful. I have had this out on herochat and looked into it.
Galactus isnt more powerful,but is more durable than Omega. Omega also had slower reaction times and was unfinished by Thanos. This is all explained in the comic.
It killed Omega because he relied on his ship. Omgea was clearly more powerful as it was stated by Thanos,backed up in the comic,and backed by Genis-vell.
You did not shred, there are huge logical flaws in your argument friend.
Despite the fact that the attacks were doing nothing...Omega shouldn't be effected AT ALL by a street leveler. Isn't the inherent appeal of abstracts, cosmics, etc. that they are so far above the wolverine's, the hawkmen, the batmen, the iron men of the comics world that the standard rules that apply to spider-man and nightwing are irrelevant once we move into the cosmic scene?
The webbing is straight out a very pathetic showing...it doesn't matter if Omega was fighting the Living Tribunal and Spectre at the same time or even Jack Kirby himself...the bottom line is that street level techniques work on Omega, a supposed 2X an abstract-level entity.
I'm sure you'll agree with me that age of apocalypse wolverine slicing the silver surfer in half with adamantium is ludicrous (aside from the fact that it's an alternate reality). Galactus X 2 being blinded by webbing??? Even more ludicrous.
Anyway here is the major flaw. You keep mentioning the writer's intentions. What are starlin's intentions? The fact that he wrote that Omega was 2X galactus, or the fact that he drew Omega to be blinded by webbing, and eventually killed by a planetary blast? You are saying Starlin's intentions are just the writing ("don't ignore the writer's intentions"). By saying that, you implicitly are stating that you are unaware that starlin not only wrote, but drew infinity abyss. The whole damn comic, writing AND art, is his intention. You ignore 50% of his intention, and propose the other 50% as 100% of his intention.
On the other hand, we have the Hunger story, also written AND drawn by starlin, just like infinity abyss. If we're comparing the stories side by side, everything that has occurred within the comics is 100% starlin's intention. And his intent was to show Omega was immensly powerful but clumsy, had brute force but had no strategy, and was a relentless but angry, imprudent abomination, the result of an imperfect genetic engineering experiement and quite the opposite of Galactus and Thanos individually, and a total failure when looked at them combined.
And Thanos called it All so who should we believe, Thanos, that also stats that Omega is twice Galactus, ore Galactus? Galactus needed to feed because he hadn't feed during the entire hunger act. That was the reason he had already teleported himself into the midst of a supernova and gathered all the Infinity Gems without absorbing a planet a single time.
Thanos knew that weakened Galactus had a 60% chance of surviving a planetary collision coupled with numerous bombs placed, Thanos also knew that Omega at full power wouldn't survive a planetary explosion.
Sorry but Galactus durability is combined with his powerlevel. The reference should be clear, Teleporting into the midst of a supernova later (when he has stated that he had depleted energy) he was visible hurt when the two planets collided. Need I say what is most powerful?
So in that Scenario Thanos can be used as a source but he cannot be used as a source in the scenario concerning his own Shields interesting. It was far from backed up in the comic, I didn't see a single outburst of power that comes near what Galactus can accomplishe when he is low on power in case you need to refresh you memory see annihilation 6, How many times have Genis-vell encountered Galactus after he has feed on three planets?
__________________
Last edited by Utrigita on Nov 4th, 2008 at 08:14 PM
Ok,slow down guys. Im putting up most of these scans before I reply to either one of you.
This way people can see it is I who am correct while you both are twisting things and ignoring the writer's intetnion simply because it doesnt sit well with either of you.
(please log in to view the image) (please log in to view the image) (please log in to view the image) (please log in to view the image) (please log in to view the image) (please log in to view the image) (please log in to view the image)
He wasnt even paying attention because he couldnt even phase him. LOL at both you making this into something which it clearly wasnt. He blocked his vision for a moment thats all.
(please log in to view the image) (please log in to view the image)
Omega wasnt affected at all. Spidey just blocked his vision for a second and didnt even pay attention to him.
You are mainly basing your entire flimsy argument off of Spiderman blocking his vision for a second. Thats all you have. Stomp your feet for all I care you are clearly pissed that this character was more powerful than Galactus.
Starlin had Thanos create Omega and speak about his power levels when asked which he did. Genis confirmed it. Case closed. Thanos couldnt budge Omega while he sent Galactus flying. Galactus also expended lots of energy on one field while Omega was fine after shredding through three.
Omega has more flaws than Galactus but was clearly more powerful which is stated in the comic.
Thanos created him and Genis backed it up with his comsmic senses. You disagree because you dont like it. too bad.
Galactus was well-nourished during the Hunger arc. i suggest you reread it. I have already been over this on herochat while you seem to be forgetting things.
Omega is more powerful than Galactus not more durable. With his ship he would have survived and been powered up by the explosion. How can you accept Thanos knowing Galactus' survival vhances but disagree with his power level of Omega?
That has no relevance when the statement and Omega's actions were very clear.
It was one shield. I explained that. All defensive shielding which Galactus explained was one shield.
The Galactus feat in annihilation was after these two stories and by a different writer. If galactus consumes the multiverse that has no bearing on Starlin's intentions. Give it up you have lost.
I disagree because I base my judgement on more then two statements concerning a character, especially since one of the characters that are making the comment has to my knowlegde never faced Galactus after he has absorbed three planets. That is what Genis was placing his statement concerning Omega on, Omega's current powerlevel at that time was full power (three planets), Galactus "normal" Powerlevel is hungry (in need of one planet).
Based on Thanos's observations on the Astral Plan the very same Thanos that you say are wrong concerning the number of shields he placed, Because obviously ALL defensive shielding cannot simply he one shield, the reference to ALL excludes the possibility of it being one.
Really, Based on what? Two statments? I have already given a example to illustrate how Galactus durability is combined with his powerlevel, and nothing changes the fact that a depleted Galactus survived a Planetary Collision while Omega didn't survive a planetary explosion. So Omega cannot even absorb a planet without his ship and you say his powerlevel is above Galactus.... I simply used you own words Quanchi if you recall it you said 60%. Not I.
His actions certainly wasn't clear enough to in any way justify Thanos statement that Omega > Galactus.
All defensive shielding obvious cannot only mean one shield when Thanos demonstrated during the confrontation with Omega that he had more then one shield.
The fact remains that Galactus has shown a far greater level of energy then Omega, ore perhaps you can provide me with a scan where Omega teleports a Galaxy.. Thought not...
quanch, your logic is flawed. You're also confusing my rational and logical deconstruction of your argument for anger. You need to return with logic on your own end.
Galactus was not refering to Thanos' shields in a literal term. I am extremely good at writing and being articulate when I need to-this means I can interpret in kind.
Galactus uses the term "a mere force field" as a DESCRIPTIVE term. How do I know (and how do you, and the reader know, that it is a descriptive term)? Because Galactus states it in a comparitive context. Thanos activates all defensive shielding (i.e., more than three shields, unless you want to argue that he has different levels of shielding per each individual shield-that burden of proof is on you) but no matter how many shields he throws up, 1 or 1000, the main objective is that the shields form a primary barrier for means of defense. Galactus uses the term "a mere force field" to be dismissive of Thanos' overall attempt at defense, not the quantifiable number of methods he uses.
It's much more of a comparitive statement for Galactus to say "never before had I had to exert myself to pierce a mere forefield!" than to say "never before had I had to exert myself to pierce all the defensive shields of an opponent!" The bottom line is that Galactus is comparing Thanos' defences (his force fied) against previous experience. Again you can disagree all you want, but this is a matter of sentence structure and sentence intent, and I know I am right. If you want to disagree, fine. Analyze the sentence.
Anyway...I can use your own words against you and say you can stamp your feet all you want, it doesn't change the fact that Thanos quite explicitly said "activate ALL DEFENSIVE SHIELDING." Now you're welcome to argue that all defensive shielding still constitutes 1 shield for Thanos. Obviously, you will need to provide scans that show Thanos has different degrees of shielding, for each shield he uses.
RE: spider-man's webbing. It doesn't matter if you think I'm angry or whatever, this is a major sticking point. Street-level tactics by Spider-Man made Omega, a purported 2x an abstract power, to be blind. Because of Spider-Man's webbing, Omega was blind and didn't notice the heroes disappear, as you showed in the scans.
Contrast this to Secret Wars Galactus, who knew Dr. Doom was invading Taa II, hundreds of thousands of kilometers away from the surface of battle world.
From these scans you provided we know for a fact:
1. Omega needs to see to appraise a battle situation.
2. He has some cosmic awareness, but not anywhere near the degree of Galactus
Now you've admitted Omega has flaws, which is what I'm discussing above. My point is that these flaws DO NOT make Omega impressive, which was your original contention.
Omega can be hyped all you want, but at the end of the day
1. He pierced three levels of shielding, vs. Galactus piercing all of Thanos' shielding, unless you want to interpret it as one level, as I discussed above. For the sake of your argument, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and say Omega=Galactus in energy projection.
2. He is not as cosmically aware as Galactus.
Spider-Man webbing blinds Omega, allowing heroes to flee.
This is exactly equal to
Spider-Man webbing blinds the Black Cat, allowing heroes to flee.
Galactus>>>>>>>>>>>>Omega in cosmic awareness, situation appraisal.
3. You admitted Galactus is more durable than Omega, per the Hunger story. As Utrigita mentioned, Galactus' durability is directly commesurate with his hunger level, which is-surprise-directly commesurate with his powerlevel. We'll set that aside and just say that Galactus>Omega in durability.
Capt Marvel's statement: Omega is 2X Galactus in power
Omega displayed
1. Energy projection at best = to Galactus. advantage, neither (assuming you can prove Thanos has multiple degrees of shielding per each level of shielding. Otherwise, Galactus>Omega in energy projection)
2. Cosmic awareness<<<<<<<Galactus
3. Durability (by your own admission, and again proven by on panel feats)<<<Galactus
I'd say those three things (cosmic wareness, durability, energy projection) broadly encompass what we'd call Galactus' power.
Explain how Omega is impressive, based off those conclusions, one by your own admission.
__________________
"It is unwise to battle the Power Cosmic." - Silver Surfer
Last edited by Power Cosmic II on Nov 4th, 2008 at 09:06 PM
So, Tene your saying that spiderman effecting Omega is somehow different then The Thing knocking down Galactus. That doesn't make much sense either now does it. You don't think they try and incorporate favorite characters into storylines and have them do things that most likely wouldn't work for the sake of the story? This doesn't happen? I'll hope you'll be honest and concede that spiderman doing such doesn't take away from The Omegas power in the least.
The Thing knocking down Galactus is not to be dismissed. It is a low showing. But how do I know it is a low showing?
Thing knocked down Galactus in a comic that's what, 25, 30 years old? Possible older. There's a whole range of feats that Galactus has to measure against and know that thing knocking him down is a low showing.
How many feats does Omega have, aside from Infinity Abyss? NONE.
They're both low showings. The difference in Galactus' case is we know that it is a low showing as he's demonstrated powers much higher (holding off blasts from avengers+ff while near death, ignoring SS blasts, remain standing when shot by the phoenix force, etc.). Omega got blinded in his first and only appearance. If he comes tomorrow and gets blinded by still vaporizes all surrounding heroes, then i'll conceed it has nothing to do with Omega's powers.
But considering he got blinded in his debut, and not only that, his only appearence, by street-level tactics which allowed all his enemies to escape...it's quite sad.
You're asking me to conceed that it has nothing to do with Omega's powers....why does it have nothing to do with Omega's powers?
You want me to write it off because it shouldn't happen...and I agree it shouldn't happen.
However it happened on panel and Omega has not displayed anything subsequent to that display.
Galactus has been knocked down by the thing yet has vaporized multiple herald-levels in one attack, destroyed a watcher with one blast, etc. He has done these feats with some regularity.
What has omega done to convince me, to make me concede that Spider-Man blinding him is a low showing? What has he done that supercedes that?
Tell me and I will concede.
__________________
"It is unwise to battle the Power Cosmic." - Silver Surfer
Last edited by Power Cosmic II on Nov 4th, 2008 at 10:34 PM
KMC Community Forums
Nov 4th, 2008 06:53 PM
