Disagree, Nabu was still going to toe to toe with Mordru during the Crisis, and they were all ants next to Spectre's power[even Nabu took note of this and wondered why he wasn't killed outright.], who Captain Marvel was comparable to.
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Mordru wins, imo. Here's my opinion on the matter...
We saw Billy put up a decent fight against Spectre -to the point where Spectre was "nearly" depleted of power- before getting owned. We then saw the wizard Shazam himself put up an even better fight against Spectre -to the point where Shazam could detect "no" power within Spectre- before he too was owned.
Thus it could be argued that base-level Mordru =/> Shazam > Billy. Adding Mordru's JSA amp to the mix only serves to widen the gap. Also keep in mind that Billy's inherent weakness is that he was unable to sustain the vast powers he had for very long before burning out. Mordru never had that problem.
Good argument except for this part ^
Shazam put up a fight and I admit I thought Spectre was in real trouble but he regenerated from that attack, grabbed Shazam and look what happened.
You completely missed my point. When Spectre got "serious" he owned everyone in his path with little difficulty. I am just talking about who did better against him between Billy and Shazam- and Shazam definitely takes the cake there.
Like I said: it took MOST of Spectre's power to beat Billy -- but it literally took ALL of his power (and then some) to beat Shazam.
One thing to remember is that Billy was suddenly cut off from his power source. Is that the case here as well?
Also, the Wizard obviously had no clue how much power Spectre had.
He sense no power, and then Spectre stood right back up and called him an ignorant backwater conjurer for thinking such a thing, then owned him promptly.
__________________
I am God's mighty fist. I am God's strength made manifest.
Sig by: Skeets, S.S, thesilverspider, Sir SKEETS Alot
Spectre mentioned that exhaustion is one of the key elements that led to Billy's downfall. His body simply isn't used to wielding that much power- thus he burned out toward the end.
Shazam certainly had a clue how much power Spectre had. Shazam knew he couldn't kill Spectre, but he also sensed that there was no power left within him at that point in time. What Shazam was unaware of is Spectre's ability to absorb magic from anywhere- which is ultimately how he was owned. Either way, it's pretty clear (imo) that Shazam was victorious in 'round one' of their battle. The same cannot be said about Billy.
No you got it backwards. It took most of Spectre's power to stalemate Billy, but really nothing to murder Shazam.
Only Shazam's artifacts mounted the offense. Who's to say that attack wouldn't have done the same to Mordu. Other than that, Spectre proceded to call him ignorant and said that he is power. He drained him, murdered him, destroyed ROE and left in perfectly good condition.
Spectre admitted he was drained of power (in sharp contrast to what he said to Shazam) and sensed Billy was too. Then he unleashed 1 last attack leaving Billy face down while Spectre had to be carried off.
"You're nearly as drained of magic as I am." Spectre's statement implies that, while his magical energies had substantially decreased, they were not completely depleted- he still had quite a bit of power left to spare.
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Other side of the coin, here's the first conclusion of Spectre and Shazam's battle (ie. "round ONE"): http://img33.imageshack.us/img33/98...dscanned16r.jpg http://img545.imageshack.us/img545/9917/73222031.jpg
"I detect NO power left in him." Shazam's statement implies that Spectre was completely powerless at that point in time. It was only AFTER he absorbed the RoE's magics that Spectre went on to trounce Shazam (ie. in "round TWO".)
So like I said: It took most of Spectre's power to beat Billy, but it took ALL of his power (and then some) to beat Shazam.
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And because you're likely going to be inclined to say something like: "Hey! Spectre couldn't have been powerless, cuz his mangled body got up and talked to Shazam in the same scan you posted!!11!!!!1!" -- I'd like to remind you that Spectre can be fully functional and completely powerless at the same time. Case in point: when Black Alice absorbed his very essence: http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/...edscanned21.jpg http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/...edscanned22.jpg
Because Shazam said so? Spectre contradicted him in the next panel
I don't get how this is absolute proof of him having no power. If we take Shazam's statement about a completely nother character at face value, then why don't we take a statement made by Spectre about Spectre as the same?
I understand this. He only had enough for one more attack. He had to be carried off after that.
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What difference does it make if he was actually powerless or not? He still stomped him. He didn't stomp Billy. He let Shazam know that attack was basically a joke and that he is power. The key point is that it didn't keep Spectre down unlike his fight with Billy. Therefore Billy fared much better than Shazam. It's irrelevant if Spectre had any power left or not. Bottom line is he easily killed Shazam but had problems ith Billy.
If he can still be fully functional, what's the big deal about him being powerless or not? There was no mocking or joking with Billy. No tricks left up his sleeve like absorbing any remaining magic. It's not that hard to compare the two fights. How can you say Shazam fared better when Spectre basically laughed off his attack, murdered him and left under his own power? After fighting Billy, he could hardly stand up.
Good point.
One more thing. Spectre said to Black Alice that "without my power nothings left but empty spirit". Meaning he would've been in an astral type form like shown here:
The fight with Billy drained him- I've stated that much numerous times. But he was not completely drained of power, as he was vs. Shazam.
You may want to brush up on the story again. Spectre was powerless after "round one" of his and Shazam's battle. He only "contradicted" Shazam after he absorbed extra power from the RoE (an ability Shazam was unaware of.)
You're ignoring the gargantuan difference between Spectre's battle with Billy, and his battle with Shazam: ie. his absorption of extra magical energy during the battle.
During Spectre's fight with Billy, he didn't have to absorb magical energy, because he beat Billy before the need arose.
To the contrary, Shazam effectively beat Spectre- that is to say: he owned Spectre to such an extent that he could sense no power left in him. But then Spectre displayed a power Shazam was unaware of: the ability to take magical energy from anywhere- even the RoE. Once Spectre absorbed that power, he killed off Shazam. That's why I keep saying: It took most of Spectre's power to beat Billy, but it took ALL of his power (and then some) to beat Shazam.
Nabu and Shazam are Lords of Order. Nabu is the most powerful Lord of Order, this we know.
If Shazam drained Spectre of all his power, and Spectre had an easier time with Nabu than Shazam, then from where I'm sitting one of the following must be true:
1. It was Shazam's prep that enabled him to perform as well as he did. He is not normally capable of that level.
2. Spectre was more powerful when he fought Nabu than Shazam (absorbing the RoE increased his power)
3. Shazam did not perform better than Nabu
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KMC Community Forums
Sep 21st, 2011 10:58 PM
You still aren't seeing my point...
