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bigsef2
Senior Member
Registered: Nov 2001
Location: United States
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the eight person thing is NEVER going to be proven or disproven by "evidence." you have to look at different cultures and you either wonder why they all have a certain thread in common and draw a conclusion, or you can dismiss it because it would mean the bible said something that was in fact true. heaven forbid. 
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Dec 12th, 2001 10:12 PM |
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Ushgarak
Paladin
Registered: Sep 2000
Location: Chelmsford, Essex, UKCo-Admin
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Oh goody. Let's throw silly things like 'evidence' out the window, shall we?
Sorry, not playing ball. Back it with proof or it'll be ignored.
__________________
"We've got maybe seconds before Darth Rosenberg grinds everybody into Jawa burgers and not one of you buds has the midi-chlorians to stop her!"
"You've never had any TINY bit of sex, have you?"
BtVS
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Dec 12th, 2001 10:13 PM |
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yerssot
Senior Member
Registered: Jul 2001
Location:
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big, the bible has CERTAIN elements that are true...
like...
there was indeed a jesus christ...
but that 8 stuff? no way!
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Dec 12th, 2001 10:14 PM |
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queeq
Chaos
Registered: Oct 2000
Location: JP's bedModerator
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Well, you can't prove it didn't happen either, yerss. 
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Dec 12th, 2001 10:23 PM |
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Ushgarak
Paladin
Registered: Sep 2000
Location: Chelmsford, Essex, UKCo-Admin
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He can't disprove my theory about the flying mongooses doing the bolero, either.
__________________
"We've got maybe seconds before Darth Rosenberg grinds everybody into Jawa burgers and not one of you buds has the midi-chlorians to stop her!"
"You've never had any TINY bit of sex, have you?"
BtVS
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Dec 12th, 2001 10:32 PM |
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queeq
Chaos
Registered: Oct 2000
Location: JP's bedModerator
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Which is your best theory ever.
Difference is though, the concept of Flood is not entirely without any proof.
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Dec 12th, 2001 11:03 PM |
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Ushgarak
Paladin
Registered: Sep 2000
Location: Chelmsford, Essex, UKCo-Admin
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I thought he meant the eight people thing.
__________________
"We've got maybe seconds before Darth Rosenberg grinds everybody into Jawa burgers and not one of you buds has the midi-chlorians to stop her!"
"You've never had any TINY bit of sex, have you?"
BtVS
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Dec 12th, 2001 11:05 PM |
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queeq
Chaos
Registered: Oct 2000
Location: JP's bedModerator
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Ah no, I doubt there will be any evidence for that ever. Which of course doesn't prove it never happened, but just that we can't prove it or consider it a scientific fact.
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Dec 12th, 2001 11:18 PM |
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bigsef2
Senior Member
Registered: Nov 2001
Location: United States
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first of all, i will say that i never said that every culture said 8 people survived the flood. i said nearly every culture. what i did say is that nearly every culture that specified a number, said there were 8. and as far as the number being 8 people, what reason does anyone have to disagree? honestly. we obviously know there was more than 1 person who survived, and anyone who disagrees is a complete idiot.  ive yet to come across a culture that specifies a different number survived.
as far as the proof goes, there IS evidence to support the number as being 8. the bible says there were 8 and the bible is a historicaly accurate book. while i concede people may disagree with its religious teachings, the bible has consistently proved to be historically and scientifically acurate. there have been many instances where names and places in the bible have been thought to be made up, and the bible was discredited. then archeologists discovered those places and names. in EVERY instance, archeology has either proved what the bible says is correct, or is simply inconclusive because theres no strong evidence one way or the other. so thats one evidence.
another is the japanese character for "ship". its the symbol for "boat" with the symbol for "8" on top of it. no one can argue with that. that is another evidence. while not conclusive in of itself, it would be a very interesting coincidence. if someone has similar evidence supporting a different number, id be more than willing to hear it.
i would suggest that a moderator move this discussion to a general discussion area. im sure people are wondering why the hell theres a discussion about 8 people surviving the flood in a thread called "i am your father."
if no one wants to move it, i will give mad props to anyone that can tie all of this back in to our original discussion.
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Dec 12th, 2001 11:56 PM |
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yerssot
Senior Member
Registered: Jul 2001
Location:
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yeah, sure, the bible is historical accurate; if we want to destroy a city wall, we always walk around it three times and shout 
So... where is the hell? They haven't found THAT place yet, not talking about heaven here...
For that Japanese thing, I don't know Japanese that well, and I don't know the figure for boat, so I pass on that...
and because there are civilizations that said that there weren't 8 survivors, your story falls apart, because if there were only 8; why would another say something different? (espacially when they were with those so called 8 survivors)??
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Dec 13th, 2001 10:47 AM |
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bigsef2
Senior Member
Registered: Nov 2001
Location: United States
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which cultures say the number is different than 8? i know cultures that spoke of a man that survived, but obviously there had to be one other person, a woman, otherwise we wouldnt be here. just because a culture doesnt mention a number, that is not an agrument that there were no others. especially in patriarchial societys like in those days. generally the head of the family is the only person beleived to be of importance.
about jerico, it IS proven that the walls of jerico fell, but theres no way to ever prove HOW they fell, unless you want to use your time machine and take a video camera and go back and watch.
and about hell, i DID say that the discussion was on historical matters, not matters of doctrine. that being said, hell is not a biblical teaching. it was actually adopted sometime in the third century by the etruscans, i beleive.
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Dec 13th, 2001 04:18 PM |
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yerssot
Senior Member
Registered: Jul 2001
Location:
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about the hell; so? it's still in the bible so...
and about the number 8: haven't find it yet, not enough time, but I know it's somewhere in North-America...
And Jerico; you said the bible was historical correct, so walking around and screaming has to be also correct!
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Dec 13th, 2001 04:22 PM |
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bigsef2
Senior Member
Registered: Nov 2001
Location: United States
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prove it wasnt. thats my point. the isrealites lost gods favor when they killed jesus, so god doesnt help them win wars anymore. you cant prove how the walls fell.
and finding a couple cultures that dont talk about the number 8, doesnt prove anything. i could find several that do. either way, its really a moot point. there were atleast 2 and probably more. 8 is not a disbeleivable number, and if you want to find some culture that says there were 6 instead of 8, then go ahead and beleive there were 6 if you want.
as far as hell goes, you have to remember that the bible was not written in engilsh. it was written in hebrew, greek, and parts in aramaic (spelling). the hebrew and greek words translated hell literally mean grave. so when the bible speaks of someone going to hell, its saying theyre going to the grave. so if any punk christian all high on himself ever told you you were going to hell, you can tell him he was an idiot and can kiss your @$$
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Dec 13th, 2001 04:51 PM |
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yerssot
Senior Member
Registered: Jul 2001
Location:
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well, if there are cultures that said that there were "insert number here, not equal to eight" then you can't say for 100% that the bible is correct!
god, you know a lot about that all!
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Dec 13th, 2001 06:01 PM |
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Ushgarak
Paladin
Registered: Sep 2000
Location: Chelmsford, Essex, UKCo-Admin
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Ok, this IS getting a little silly now...
__________________
"We've got maybe seconds before Darth Rosenberg grinds everybody into Jawa burgers and not one of you buds has the midi-chlorians to stop her!"
"You've never had any TINY bit of sex, have you?"
BtVS
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Dec 13th, 2001 06:09 PM |
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bigsef2
Senior Member
Registered: Nov 2001
Location: United States
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i would agree, and suggest AGAIN that if someone wants to continue the discussion of religious stuff a moderator move it to a general discussion forum. if not, then ill just try to put this thread back on track.
i would like to take a little poll. yay or nay. yay if you think the explaination of anakins having no father in TPM stands and no further explaination is necessary. nay if you think theres more to it than meets the eye, whether you think sidious is his father, or someone else.
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Dec 13th, 2001 06:22 PM |
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yerssot
Senior Member
Registered: Jul 2001
Location:
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probably GL will explain it a bit more, but he will only confuse everyone!
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Dec 13th, 2001 06:46 PM |
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queeq
Chaos
Registered: Oct 2000
Location: JP's bedModerator
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This is a SW forum here dudes. THis sounds more like something for the GDF.
I will say this though, bigsef. Saying the Bible is historically accurate and that archaeologists have proven that is actually up for a huge debate. THe current accepted view is that everything the Bible talks about BEFORE the reign of Rehaboam (around 900 BC) is pure myth, for one simple fact alone: lack of archaeological evidence....
Nevertheless, there are alternative ways of looking at it. But using the accepted dating methods by lineage, reign years and genealogies there never was a Jericho destroyed by Joshua. Here too is an alternative theory and it all evolves around DATING not so much in finding stuff. But this is not right the forum for it.
Get back on topic or this gets closed.
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Dec 13th, 2001 07:28 PM |
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yerssot
Senior Member
Registered: Jul 2001
Location:
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if you saw bigs reply, he suggested that a mod would move this to GDF, so closing is NOT fair!
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Dec 13th, 2001 07:43 PM |
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bigsef2
Senior Member
Registered: Nov 2001
Location: United States
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yeah, i suggested a change of forum several times if you were paying any attention. and if youll notice, we did in fact change our discussion. thanks though.
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Dec 13th, 2001 07:49 PM |
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