Well its like some member said once (can't remember who or what thread) Luke isn't going to know who the **** that is. For all he knows its some random ghost getting free entrance to the Endor party
But when the face is revealed at the end of ROTJ there is no way on earth he can relate that to the face of Hayden at the end. Thats why I felt it was a big mistake including Hayden in the re-mastered version because it doesn't make sense. Because Obi-Wan was old when he died, hence the old spirit. Vader/Anakin died old also but somehow got a young spirit-it makes no sense.
Because, back then, when Vader turned, it was amazing. It was a dramatic and sudden turn. When Vader slumps to the ground people are like "Holy crap".
Now, because the prequels are so duel-intensive, it makes that final scene look weak in comparison, mainly due to expectation.
Things weren't always settled with a lightsaber, unlike now where a duel is the be-all and end-all of everything these days.
Also, The Emperor wasn't written as a saber wielder, that's another piece of information Lucas has made up in the last twenty years since ROTJ's credits rolled. He was just a dude who could throw lightning.
Another thing back then, it was about Luke Skywalker, not Darth Vader. Vader was the secondary character to Luke in the OT. Only once ROTJ was done and dusted did Lucas come up with the idea of telling Vaders story. It's all about perspective. When the OT was first made, STar Wars had one perspective: that of Luke. Now the PT is trying to alter the perspective and make it all about Vader, when it clearly isn't.
Lucas suddenly doing a 180 and saying its all about Darth Vader is actually another thing he's plucked from his ass in order to do the prequels and justify Lukes (the hero) absence. Now its Anakin who is the hero with all this Chosen One BS. Talk about re-writing.
It was all about Luke in the OT. If you just watch the movies you can understand this. It's just another case of Lucas flitting from one idea to another, neither here nor there, and he's hurting his brilliant movies because of it.
Last edited by Red Superfly on Apr 25th, 2005 at 03:25 PM
Red Superfly, I totally agree with you, that in the original movies, that ending of vader simply turning and quickly throwing him over the pit is probably the only way to end it, because the duel already took place. Luke is the central character back then, and he already defeated vader. So back then it was a great ending, and a very good one.
However, I'm taking this thread to be about what we would change right now, in this day in time. Now that we have 6 movies, and it totally changes things to make Anakin the central character from start to finish, the last scene could be changed to reflect that aswell. Now that the movies follow the life and times of Anakin from start to fnish, it really makes the ending of ROTJ weak imo. That's what I would change if I could, a final battle to end it all would be awesome.
When there was only 3, it was a good ending I think. Now that there is 6, it's really weak imo
Ya it wasen't broken before, but in light of the new episodes, it definitely is now. The release of 1,2, and 3 clearly make the story now about Anakin, not Luke as it always use to be. That means that the end battle is incomplete now. Luke vs Vader is not what the story is about now, it's much more about Sideous and Vader. Once episode 1 was released, a final battle scene between Vader and Sideous should have been added aswell to avoid the utter disappointment of people who are seeing the old ones for the first time now. Just would have been cool that's all...
I wouldn't change anything about the Original Trilogy to be honest.
This is one reason why the six movies can never be a full saga. It's too disjointed.
I simply like to see it as two trilogies. We have the classic OT where all the important (and best) stuff happens. The characters are great and it's a fun ride full of twists and drama. Then we have the PT which a neat little backstory.
I will never see the whole thing as one big saga. It just doesn't work. It's always going to be the classic trilogy first, and the enjoyable back story PT second. In fact I don't think anyone can truly view it all as one big 6 part saga - I'm sure deep down in everyone they all see it as two trilogies that are VERY different from each other.
I see it as one big (and much more complete) movie now. If you overlook the special effect discrepencies and some minor inconsistancies, it fits pretty well. You just have to change your focus from it being about luke, to it being about Anakin. After all, Darth vader is the coolest character in the OT, so isn't it better this way that the story shifts to his life, not some tool like Luke
Sorry for the Zombie thread. I just found this doing a Google search.
There was another hint that they were brothers and sisters in ESB. When Luke takes off to Bespin, as he leave Yoda and Bens ghost (voice) are speaking and there is mention of "another'
What I am looking for and can't find anymore is a picture of the scene where Leia is kissing Luke in front of han & Chewie. Someone had Photoshopped a picture of Bens ghosts with an expression like this :O does anyone have that pic?
True dat red SF. Y'know, lucas says that the expanded universe is a parallel universe to him, when the PT should be the parallel. EU fits better than PT sometimes anyway. The only reason Ep III got so much hype was the action, and "The duel", the one we've been waiting for all our lives. After sitting back and overlooking the duel scenes, ep 3 sucks.
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HEIL BARON VON RICHTHOFEN! HEIL THE LUFTWAFFE!
i read recently that originally a Force empowered Yoda deflected the Emperor's lightning from Luke. He was invisible, escept when the lightning struck, when you could see his ghostly image between Luke and Palpatine. It would have been nice to see a rematch between Sidious and his "Little green friend" but I guess it would have detracted from Luke and Vaders redemption.
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I agree with you on the ending of Jedi, I bought the DVD edition and was totally disappointed in the way they changed my favorite movies of all time. What happened to my EWOK song.
Yep, that original song actually almost redeemed the inclusion of the ewoks. The new ending, featuring the interplanetary celebrations AND the inclusion of Hayden is fantastic but Lucas ruined it all by changing the end song. Someone should do a drugs bust at Lucasfilm.
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I don't think drugs is the cause of the PT mess. I blame Lucas becoming a family man. Back in the 70's, Lucas and his director buddies Speilberg, Coppula, DePlama were big into the drugs
Apr 25th, 2005 09:42 AM
