Originally posted by Zack Fair
if only Vegeta got a SSJ3 upgrade.Ah well. Forgot he is only useful when the plot demands someone get his ass kicked.
Originally posted by Bro SMASH
Not if it's a bad one. A character can change but it should at least be a good change.
I remember playing Budokai 3 and upon realizing that you could make the AI fight itself I instantly made Goku and Vegeta fight to settle who was best.
They wrecked everything. By the end of it Goku was Super Saiyan 3 and Vegeta was Super Saiyain 4. Both did a final blast attack and it ended in a double K.O. Was amazed.
I'm just saying it could have been much better. I know a lot of people who first starting watching the series have been wanting to see Vegeta's character change but when you look at what actually changed him, it seems kind of...awkward. It made him too soft and inconsistent.
If what I hear about Bulma seeing him as "lonely" being true and if that really is the case with Vegeta, then I think it goes against his character. Vegeta was always a loner and from the looks of it, that's how he prefers it. Even after Trunks was born, he was still the same old Vegeta as if nothing happened. That alone throws the whole "loneliness" thing out the window. It was a sloppy character development that didn't mesh well with the actual character. It made it seem like the whole Trunks thing was just thrown in there just to have an excuse for Vegeta to develop.
Originally posted by Ridley_Prime
Of course it does; it even has perfect Cell!
Yet we all know what happened to him. 😂
Originally posted by Bro SMASH
I'm just saying it could have been much better. I know a lot of people who first starting watching the series have been wanting to see Vegeta's character change but when you look at what actually changed him, it seems kind of...awkward. It made him too soft and inconsistent.If what I hear about Bulma seeing him as "lonely" being true and if that really is the case with Vegeta, then I think it goes against his character. Vegeta was always a loner and from the looks of it, that's how he prefers it. Even after Trunks was born, he was still the same old Vegeta as if nothing happened. That alone throws the whole "loneliness" thing out the window. It was a sloppy character development that didn't mesh well with the actual character. It made it seem like the whole Trunks thing was just thrown in there just to have an excuse for Vegeta to develop.
Yet we all know what happened to him. 😂
TBF back then I only wanted Vegeta to own people and beat the shit out of Goku. I couldn't care less if he was good or back. In fact I felt trolled because all good ole Vegetable did was talk shit and then get his ass kicked. It was only after the years when I realized he was better off the way he did getting the character development he did. Could've always just ended up being another Yamacha, Tien and/or Piccolo. If you know what I mean.
I'm sure many people think that. Heck even I thought that he was better off with that character development. That is, until I started comparing him with similar characters like Hiei and Aoshi. I liked how they developed because even though they changed, they still kept a lot of their traits that makes us remember who they are. You'd never once question their development because it's completely understandable
But in Vegeta's case, it's like "oh lets just throw him a son in there so that Vegeta can change when something happens to him...even though he clearly doesn't even care about the mother of his son, the other fighters, or anybody else". I mean, it almost seems like a fanfic or something.
Originally posted by Bro SMASH
Yet we all know what happened to him. 😂
But really, I don't quite see how what changed Vegeta is awkward, inconsistent, or whatever. His change was something that started out as slow and grew, and then became complete near the end of DBZ when he finally admitted Goku was better. shrug By then he had started caring for his family more too, because development. I mean remember his reaction when Goku told him that Buu had absorbed them all when he was convincing him to fuse? It was only during Android arc when he didn't care for them as much at first, and while he can be considered a loner in some instances, that's not always the case.
Originally posted by Ridley_Prime
Yeah, the earth proved it wasn't perfect enough for him to destroy.But really, I don't quite see how what changed Vegeta is awkward, inconsistent, or whatever. His change was something that started out as slow and grew, and then became complete near the end of DBZ when he finally admitted Goku was better. shrug By then he had started caring for his family more too. I mean remember his reaction when Goku told him that Buu had absorbed them all when he was convincing him to fuse? It was only during Android arc when he didn't care for them as much at first, and while he can be considered a loner in some instances, that's not always the case.
Like I said earlier, Vegeta admitting that Goku was better than him is really the only good change he made because it actually related to what his character is mostly about; surpassing Goku. It opened up more opportunities for him to change because he finally came into terms with his place as a fighter, something that he always bout with. His storyline was a great build up to that development.
But the whole Vegeta becoming a family man after the death of his son who he wasn't even trying to get to know (much like how he is to everyone else) just seems kind of forced. His character didn't build up to that kind of change yet and up until that point, he was still the same Vegeta who previously didn't even try to save Bulma and in his infant son from Dr. Gero's attack. Now he suddenly makes this big change out of nowhere and even though he's still a hot-head, he's no longer the badass lonewolf he was before. He's now just an arrogant family man. It somewhat came into conflict with his character.
Yeah, I know he cared about Bulma and Trunks during the Buu saga. At that point, it was necessary due to the changes he been through so I'm concerned about that.
Originally posted by Zack Fair
Agreed Prime. Vegeta developed throughout 300+ Chapters. I don't care if it took forever. I'd rather him take his time like royalty. At least he avoided being a joke until GT.Sigh Babysitter Piccolo.
When you say Babysitter Piccolo, I guess you mean during the Buu saga where he did nothing but babysit Goten and Trunks when they were practicing fusion? Yeah, that was a letdown. He was my favorite of the Z-fighters until that point at least. Him kinda babysitting Gohan while preparing for Nappa and Vegeta was more necessary for his development though obviously.
Originally posted by Bro SMASH
Like I said earlier, Vegeta admitting that Goku was better than him is really the only good change he made because it actually related to what his character is mostly about; surpassing Goku. It opened up more opportunities for him to change because he finally came into terms with his place as a fighter, something that he always bout with. His storyline was a great build up to that development.But the whole Vegeta becoming a family man after the death of his son who he wasn't even trying to get to know (much like how he is to everyone else) just seems kind of forced. His character didn't build up to that kind of change yet and up until that point, he was still the same Vegeta who previously didn't even try to save Bulma and in his infant son from Dr. Gero's attack. Now he suddenly makes this big change out of nowhere and even though he's still a hot-head, he's no longer the badass lonewolf he was before. He's now just an arrogant family man. It somewhat came into conflict with his character.
Yeah, I know he cared about Bulma and Trunks during the Buu saga. At that point, it was necessary due to the changes he been through so I'm concerned about that.
And him admitting Goku was better being the only good change he had? How about his motif for sacrificing himself against the fat Buu (which he didn't do for himself, but for Trunks, Bulma, and even Goku) ? Methinks you're not giving the Saiyan prince quite enough credit.
Originally posted by Zack Fair
He did spend 2 years in the hyperbolic time chamber with Future Trunks. I know he was mostly alone, but people do grow on you.BTW Prime you're racist. SSJ3 Vegeta looks good uhuh
Anyways. LoL SSJG.
lol Something about SSJ3 Vegeta's design just struck me as weird, but it was still a cool form for something game exclusive.
Until we see what SSG actually looks like or what Goku or whoever can do in the form I'm gonna reserve judging it for now, as corny and fanboyish as the form sounds currently.
Originally posted by Ridley_Prime
I kinda have to say both yes and no @ Vegeta not being a joke in GT. Didn't like how he had to have that blutz wave machine to be able to transform to SSJ4 at all while Goku could just do it at will, though I guess it saved him from the painful process of having his tail pulled back out like Goku. Had mixed feelings about him being the main vessel for Baby as well. Being possessed by a Tuffle certainly did his character no favors. And SSJ4 Vegeta should've at least had a victorious moment like destroying one of the shadow dragons, though as someone said, we all know that GT stands for Goku Time..When you say Babysitter Piccolo, I guess you mean during the Buu saga where he did nothing but babysit Goten and Trunks when they were practicing fusion? Yeah, that was a letdown. He was my favorite of the Z-fighters until that point at least. Him kinda babysitting Gohan while preparing for Nappa and Vegeta was more necessary for his development though obviously.
I think even during the Android sagas he cared about them to some degree, but just didn't show it, or didn't realize he cared much until he saw his future son death beammed upon Cell's return. Dr. Gero crashing Bulma's ship just wasn't enough to get through to him at the time like that moment was. Kinda see where you're coming from more now though.
And him admitting Goku was better being the only good change he had? How about his motif for sacrificing himself against the fat Buu (which he didn't do for himself, but for Trunks, Bulma, and even Goku) ? Methinks you're not giving the Saiyan prince quite enough credit.
Oh yeah, there was the hyperbolic time chamber thing too.
lol Something about SSJ3 Vegeta's design just struck me as weird, but it was still a cool form for something game exclusive.
Until we see what SSG actually looks like or what Goku or whoever can do in the form I'm gonna reserve judging it for now, as corny and fanboyish as the form sounds currently.
At least Piccolo was still a threat in the Saiyan saga. Plus his babysitting was brutal and Piccolo-like. I don't even recognize him in the Buu saga.