Originally posted by Nod
Before I say anything else I will tell you now that that is not a win over Shang Shi.He pulled the claws. Not a win.
How is that not a win? Shang-Chi attacked him... and Wolverine owned him. Shang-Chi was totally helpless. Wolverine came at him (talking smack the whole time) Distracted him with a kick while he force him low with a chop, fliped over him, got Chi in a head lock, grabbed a hold of his head an then swung him over his body in mid-air, wedging his head perfectly between the gate bars and popped his claws aroud Chi's head. Seriously... how is that "not a win"?
Originally posted by srankmissingninHmm, if there was only a revamped Wolverine Respect Thread to verify this battle.......😛
How is that not a win? Shang-Chi attacked him... and Wolverine owned him. Shang-Chi was totally helpless. Wolverine came at him (talking smack the whole time) Distracted him with a kick while he force him low with a chop, fliped over him, got Chi in a head lock, grabbed a hold of his head an then swung him over his body in mid-air, wedging his head perfectly between the gate bars and popped his claws aroud Chi's head. Seriously... how is that "not a win"?
Originally posted by srankmissingninThat was when Cap had just started his hero career. The captions regarding that story even say so.
Wolverine has saved Caps ass from a bunch of hand ninjas who were about to kill him.
Originally posted by srankmissingninI dare say he has. I'll look into it.
Wolverine pinned Shang-Chi in three panels. Captain America has never embarrassed a high end martial artist like that.
Originally posted by srankmissingninI remember that non-fight. What a waste of space. Nevertheless, Cap beat the crap out of DD in a fight. And DD beat Wolverine & several dozen ninjas in 'Enemy of the State.'
Wolverine easily got Daredevil in a full nelson in three panels after Daredevil attacked him without warning.
Originally posted by srankmissingninHurray for Wolverine.
Wolverine was beating Junzo, a guy who repeatedly beat down Iron Fist... easily.
Originally posted by srankmissingninAnd then Cap gave him a nice hook in the face.
Wolverine said he was better the Captain America.
Originally posted by srankmissingninThen Zartan is a Wolverine fanboy like others around here. And with a name like Zartan, he deserves to be.
Zartan went after Cap to redeem himself for losing to Shang-Chi. He went after Wolverine to redeem himself for losing to Captain America.
Originally posted by srankmissingninSpiderman thinks Cap is the greatest and Wolverine couldn't hold a candle to him. The opinion of the greatest hero in comics vs. the opinion of a 2nd string character with the most unoriginal name next to Professor X? Parker ftw.
Mr. X thinks that Captain America is a nobody, and feels Wolverine is a worthy opponent.
Originally posted by srankmissingninYay. Cap beat Red Skull with the cosmic cube.
Even Stick thinks Wolverine is the man... in fact Stick wasn't even able to land a hand on Wolverine when Wolverine didn't want him to.
Originally posted by srankmissingninHe might rival Cap's skill in fighting. He does not rival his will, nor his strategery. Wolverine's a lot shorter then Cap. Healing factor, schmealing factor.
You think Captain America takes the majority against someone who his equal in terms of skill, physically his mirror image and on top of it all has a healing factor that allows him to shrug off punches from the likes of Hulk. Yeah... I'm the unreasonable one. 🙄What, pray tell, do you think Captain America is going to do to Wolverine? Punch him into submission? I think there is a little too much rum in your egg nogg champ.
Cap could bleed Wolverine out like Daken did in Wolverine Origins #13, or like X-23 did in X-23 #5. Oh yeah, it was Cap that eventually subdued X-23 in that comic also after she f'ed Wolverine over.
Cap 6/10.
And didn't you know? Wolverine's healing factor becomes negated when Cap uses his secret technique #2354-alpha, the "Heal this." attack. 😂
Originally posted by Badabing
Hmm, if there was only a revamped Wolverine Respect Thread to verify this battle.......😛
Yeah, yeah, I know, I'm horrible procrastinator. I only have about 15-30 minutes worth of stuff to do on my end before its ready... I just keep putting it off. 😮
Don't worry I'll get Jinzin my stuff soon. Not to night though... I'm just about to head out to a Chirstmas party.
Originally posted by srankmissingninI'm sure it will be worth the wait. Enjoy the party. 😎
Yeah, yeah, I know, I'm horrible procrastinator. I only have about 15-30 minutes worth of stuff to do on my end before its ready... I just keep putting it off. 😮Don't worry I'll get Jinzin my stuff soon. Not to night though... I'm just about to head out to a Chirstmas party.
Originally posted by Battlehammer
..........you mean the tired old feat you always show of capt pressure point pym?Ya epct the fact a 30 foot guy pressure point would be easy as hell to hit and would not be hard to accomplish in the least............it was handed to capt on a silver platter.
The pressure poiitn still ahs duperhuman durability. Cap was in a weaker dying body and used one finger....not supesharp claws.
Originally posted by Battlehammer
did I say it made him a better fight? No I said he retains his skills and amps his stats.
Yeah because amping your stats doesnt make you a better fighter dur
Originally posted by Battlehammer
again I your susing examples from the past. Logan since then ahs been written rather calm over time.Your first scanns you for get to mention that logan mind was messed up and was scared shitless and was not thinking straight. Oh and you forget to mention the fact it before wolveriens character development or healing factor.
Originally posted by Alfheim
..and before somebody tells me that Proteus ****ed up Wolverine. So what? Wolverine could have serioulsy messed up Cyke or worse. Baron Zemo hospitalised Hercules and Jarvis, pyshcologically abused Cap and after a fight with Wrecker still kept his cool and tried to save Zemo's life.Caps temprament >>>>>>>> Wolverines
Oh yeah and theres point 3. Secret Wars as well Cap was more calmer.
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
And in reguards to this "fight" being an excuse for Marvel to make Captain Amerinca look bad, all I have to say is GTFO! This issue (entire arc actually) was one giant Captain America cockstroke.
You dont get to tell me to GTFO when you constantly make excuses for Wolverine. Yopu dont get to tell me to gTFO when you say things like "Shang Chi can amp to Spiderman levels", and then provide no evidence. 😬
Originally posted by srankmissingninMr. X thinks that Captain America is a nobody, and feels Wolverine is a worthy opponent.
Who gives a **** what X thinks. Even Wolverine gives him props. Who beat Mister X again?
http://img160.imageshack.us/my.php?image=page116fq.jpg
Spiderman + Daredevil + Wolverines opinion >>>>>> Mister X
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Even Stick thinks Wolverine is the man... in fact Stick wasn't even able to land a hand on Wolverine when Wolverine didn't want him to.
Im pretty sure Wolverine has been made to look stupid lots of more times than Cap. Wrceker made him look stupid Od made him look stupid and quite frankly he didnt seem too intelligent. Od couldnt stop himself from being punched by a weaken Collosus but Cap rolled with the punch of a Skrull Collosus.
Skrull colosus > Very Weakened Colosus
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
That was when Cap had just started his hero career. The captions regarding that story even say so.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
I remember that non-fight. What a waste of space. Nevertheless, Cap beat the crap out of DD in a fight. And DD beat Wolverine & several dozen ninjas in 'Enemy of the State.'
Originally posted by OneDumbG0Was this before or after Wolverine gave him a blood clot?... 😕
And then Cap gave him a nice hook in the face.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0🤨
Then Zartan is a Wolverine fanboy like others around here. And with a name like Zartan, he deserves to be.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Spiderman thinks Cap is the greatest and Wolverine couldn't hold a candle to him. The opinion of the greatest hero in comics vs. the opinion of a 2nd string character with the most unoriginal name next to Professor X? Parker ftw.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Yay. Cap beat Red Skull with the cosmic cube.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
He might rival Cap's skill in fighting. He does not rival his will,
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
He nor his strategery.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0And? He STILL has a longer reach.
Wolverine's a lot shorter then Cap.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Healing factor, schmealing factor.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0Because Wolverine's Healing Factor will be slowed down from trying to keep him alive from a wound from the Murumasa bla... oh wait.. no it won't...
Cap could bleed Wolverine out like Daken did in Wolverine Origins #13,
wait it's cause Cap has effecient eviscerating weaponry like Dake- oh wait.. no he doesn't...
No I know what it is! Because Caps as fast as Daken moving faster than Wolverine ca- No.... wait... that can't be it either. 😬
So how does Cap do this again?
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
or like X-23 did in X-23 #5. Oh yeah, it was Cap that eventually subdued X-23 in that comic also after she f'ed Wolverine over.
D-did you read the book? Or just look at the pretty pictures? Do you understand why Wolverine was there and what he was trying to do, are you telling me you think that's Wolverine's fullest fighting capacity?
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Cap 6/10.
Ah Yes, lets' give this to the man who's practially Wolverine's mirror image in physical strength, speed, stamina, skill and durability even though he lacks the damage soak that Wolverine can take, has breakable bones, and one weapon opposed to Wolverine's 2.
The Damage that Cap dishes out Wolverine can take in spades, Cap is not bleeding Wolverine out. Do you know how ridiculous that sounds for a guy who's fought off lady deathstrike AND Sabretooth at once, Entire hosts of Brood, the entire N'garai nation, 2,000 ninja, 100 samurai, multitudes of Nafarian Were-monkeys without going down to blood loss. You think two skewed examples take precedence over an entire career of that?
Cap can't win through brute force, he won't win through a bleed out, and at best he only MIGHT get lucky with pressure points.
Wolverine CAN win through stabbing, he CAN win through slicing, he CAN win through brute force (if his punches or kicks landed, adamantium bones vs. human bones hmmm), and if he lands pressure points, they'll sure as hell be a lot more effective than the other way around since Cap doesn't have a healing factor...
With all their similarities it comes down to who can take it, Wolverine's obviously the favorite when it comes down to that.
Any fantasies that have Cap winning with punches, sheild tosses or "strategy" are nothing more than wishful thinking that opts to ignore Cap's limitations against the bulk of Wolverine's entire comic book career.
Wolverine wins this.
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
How is that not a win? Shang-Chi attacked him... and Wolverine owned him. Shang-Chi was totally helpless. Wolverine came at him (talking smack the whole time) Distracted him with a kick while he force him low with a chop, fliped over him, got Chi in a head lock, grabbed a hold of his head an then swung him over his body in mid-air, wedging his head perfectly between the gate bars and popped his claws aroud Chi's head. Seriously... how is that "not a win"?
He got him on the ground. Big deal there is no reason to believe Shang couldn't have got out of it seeing as he got out of worse before.
He pulled out the claws and had to use them to end it. That takes away his victory.
So if someone else had to end the fight with a weapon its a win for them as well? 🙄
Originally posted by jinzinWoopdie-doo. Cap's got more fighting experience then Wolverine. The Korvac saga of timeline reboots gives Cap far more fighting experience measurable in lifetimes. And Ogun's mystic training hasn't give Wolverine much tactical advantage in his recent one-on-one's against Wild Child, Sabretooth or the Gorgon.
And? Both Wolverine and Cap have increased their fighting capacity by leagues since then, but only Wolverine had the mystic training under Ogun.
Originally posted by jinzinOnly, Wolverine ended up getting skewered in the fight... not DD.
DD didn't beat Wolverine, he was on the defensive that whole fight, and started losing the fight after the hand ninjas became a non-factor.... He only "won" through a plot device when he knocked the brain washing out of Logan for a moment. If it wasn't for that he would have been skewered.
Originally posted by jinzinWrong. He remembers everything he did. That's garbage.
Not to mention.... BRAIN WASHING... you get that concept right, I mean you understand Wolverine wasn't in his right mind at the time, hell, he doesn't even remember very well what he did when he was under the Hand's influence.
Originally posted by jinzinBefore he gave him the blood clot. Also before Cap forced him to surrender and military march.
Was this before or after Wolverine gave him a blood clot?... 😕
Originally posted by jinzinWrong. He was not practically healing factorless. That's garbage and consistently been exaggerrated to the point of ad nauseam.
Consider what you just said about Zartan, then look at this "point" you're trying to make again... ohhh the irony.And he couldn't down a practically HFless Wolverine.. how sad.
Originally posted by jinzinYou are wrong again. Trust me. Cap could do all those things. And there are side-by-side instances where Cap's will has proven stronger then Wolverine's. New Avengers #5 for instance. Cap resists the mutate's powers and Wolverine is out. Show me an instance where Wolverine's will clearly surpasses Cap's in the same situation and I'll consider that his will surpasses Cap's. Until then, it only threatens to rival Cap's and in side-by-side, it was lower then Cap's.
He beat back pheonix's mind control with will power. Shecouldn't even restrain him.
He willed himself to stand up to a prolonged kiss from Rogue without going down.
He willed himself out of Mesmero's mind control.
He wills himself back from death every time he gets aced.
How you think his will can't even rival that of Cap's is nothing more than wishful thinking.
Originally posted by jinzinOne feat of strategy leads you to believe that Wolverine is more strategical then Cap? Not even the wildest of Wolverine fanboys would agree that Wolverine is more strategical or more tactical then Cap. And I'm not suggesting that Wolverine couldn't win through strategy. In fact, I think strategy would win Wolverine a few fights.
Except for the fact that he did that in their last fight.... 😐
Originally posted by jinzinWrong yet again. Cap's shield provides him greater reach then Wolverine's claws.
And? He STILL has a longer reach.
Originally posted by jinzinLike Wild Child? Like Sabretooth? Like Gorgon? Like Spider-woman? Like Cap in the "Heal this" scan? Okie dokie.
Tell that to Hulk, The Brood, and well... pretty much anyone who's had to fight the guy when he has one that's working.
Originally posted by jinzinWrong yet again. You're going for the record. You want me to show you where Cap has beheaded opponents and lopped off their limbs? Trust me, he could slit Wolverine's throat, or gut Wolverine with that shield's edge.
Because Wolverine's Healing Factor will be slowed down from trying to keep him alive from a wound from the Murumasa bla... oh wait.. no it won't...wait it's cause Cap has effecient eviscerating weaponry like Dake- oh wait.. no he doesn't...
No I know what it is! Because Caps as fast as Daken moving faster than Wolverine ca- No.... wait... that can't be it either. 😬
So how does Cap do this again?
And he'd do it the same way he's been able to whack him with his fists and his shield. You appear to suggest that only an opponent whose speed far surpasses Wolverine's can hit him. Well... considering that Cap has hit him plenty of times with his fists, kicks and shield... I suppose you conclude Cap moves faster then Wolverine. But wait, Wolverine has tagged Cap also... so he must be faster then Cap. Oh wait... Wolverine tagged Daken also... he must be faster then Daken... OH BUT WAIT... Cap > Wolverine > Daken. Yay! Cap beats Daken! Your logic is singular and it phails utterly.
Originally posted by jinzinI read the issue. I own it. Wolverine was not trying to hurt X-23 at first. Then he gets sliced up a bit and decides to get serious. And even more telling, even after realizing what X-23 had been doing, he was unable to counter it and went down. By far, a serious feat for X-23.
D-did you read the book? Or just look at the pretty pictures? Do you understand why Wolverine was there and what he was trying to do, are you telling me you think that's Wolverine's fullest fighting capacity?
Originally posted by jinzinCap has more impressive strength feats and more impressive speed feats (running wise and dodging lazers-wise anyway).
Ah Yes, lets' give this to the man who's practially Wolverine's mirror image in physical strength, speed, stamina, skill and durability even though he lacks the damage soak that Wolverine can take, has breakable bones, and one weapon opposed to Wolverine's 2.
Originally posted by jinzinCap fought Lady Deathstrike and didn't even get hit once... And bleeding him out isn't the only viable tactic Cap can use. And although you don't like it, I've already presented you with two very recent instances where Wolverine goes down from bleeding out. Wolverine has also been beaten by simply getting knocked silly. In the first raid in 'Agent of Shield,' Wolverine just gets clubbed silly by Gorgon wielding a wooden beam. And let's not forget the "Heal this" attack!
The Damage that Cap dishes out Wolverine can take in spades, Cap is not bleeding Wolverine out. Do you know how ridiculous that sounds for a guy who's fought off lady deathstrike AND Sabretooth at once, Entire hosts of Brood, the entire N'garai nation, 2,000 ninja, 100 samurai, multitudes of Nafarian Were-monkeys without going down to blood loss. You think two skewed examples take precedence over an entire career of that?
Originally posted by jinzinThanks for letting us know of another way that Cap could win. Cap certainly is better at using pressure points and focusing on a person's joints. I don't know why he only might get lucky, but then again, I haven't seen Wolverine go down from pressure points. Also... I never really have seen anyone utilize them against Wolverine. Have you? I'm asking an honest question. Either way, until we see those situations, I don't think it's safe to assume Cap could easily win through pressure points or that Wolverine would easily defend against the attack would be presumptuous? Agreed?
Cap can't win through brute force, he won't win through a bleed out, and at best he only MIGHT get lucky with pressure points.
Originally posted by jinzinMore effective the other way around. Yes I agree. And to be honest, your thoughts are not that far off then mine. But you're extremely selective. Because you like to think about Wolverine in general terms of his career. Because I can generalize also. Cap has rarely lost a fight. And Cap's career has him facing far more impossible odds then the ones Wolverine could ever impose. And yet, Cap still wins through his own will, strategic mind, tenacity and prowess. So if you really want to be general, you tell me how Wolverine imposes far greater odds then Cap has been confronted with his entire career? All I'm arguing, is that Wolverine does not.
Wolverine CAN win through stabbing, he CAN win through slicing, he CAN win through brute force (if his punches or kicks landed, adamantium bones vs. human bones hmmm), and if he lands pressure points, they'll sure as hell be a lot more effective than the other way around since Cap doesn't have a healing factor...With all their similarities it comes down to who can take it, Wolverine's obviously the favorite when it comes down to that.
Any fantasies that have Cap winning with punches, sheild tosses or "strategy" are nothing more than wishful thinking that opts to ignore Cap's limitations against the bulk of Wolverine's entire comic book career.Wolverine wins this.
Cap 6/10.
Originally posted by Nod
He got him on the ground. Big deal there is no reason to believe Shang couldn't have got out of it seeing as he got out of worse before.He pulled out the claws and had to use them to end it. That takes away his victory.
So if someone else had to end the fight with a weapon its a win for them as well? 🙄
He was totally dominating that fight, I think the oh shit expression on Shang's face really tells us more than any of your speculation ever could. He lost.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Woopdie-doo. Cap's got more fighting experience then Wolverine. The Korvac saga of timeline reboots gives Cap far more fighting experience measurable in lifetimes. And Ogun's mystic training hasn't give Wolverine much tactical advantage in his recent one-on-one's against Wild Child, Sabretooth or the Gorgon.
I'm with Srank on his inpretation of the Korvac saga. Likewise, I think you missed out as we've been over this before. Ogun gave kitty pride a lifetime of experience and training in a matter of days.. Ogun trained Logan for years worth with that same training. You honestly think Cap has a massive experience advantage? Hardly.
Wild Child was an ambush with poison,
Cap wouldn't fair any better against the other two so I don't see how that helps.
Likewise, Caps lifetimes of training haven't seemed to help him much while fighting Black Panther, so that door swings both ways...
Anyways, we're getting off track. Wolverine had to save Cap's ass.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0🤨 I said HAD THE FIGHT CONTINUED... as in if it kept going he would have been... there's nothing wrong about that, DD was already on the defensive, he already took a slash to the gut and he was out of billy clubs, if he hadn't of had the plot device of Wolverine's brain washing getting jumbled then he would have died/lost... please try to understand the concepts of the english language.
Only, Wolverine ended up getting skewered in the fight... not DD.
Wrong.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
He remembers everything he did. That's garbage.
ORLY? ppfffft
http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/584/wolverine4502ec5ue3.jpg
Originally posted by OneDumbG0Lol, and you miss the point yet again. Wolverine got the upper hand in that fight.
Before he gave him the blood clot. Also before Cap forced him to surrender and military march.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0Trust you to tell me about a character I know more about than you do? I think not. If you have a problem with what happened that's fine, but don't deny it...
Wrong. He was not practically healing factorless. That's garbage and consistently been exaggerrated to the point of ad nauseam.
You are wrong again. Trust me.
Daniel Way is a writer who thinks Wolveirne's capible of this:
Wolverine gets blasted by a plasma weapon that reduces him to an admantium skeleton, the next panel he's shown in he's already covered in flesh, and after a few more short minutes he's nearly fully healed:
1. http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/9547/thesuitwf0.jpg
2. http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/4983/thesuit2kp9.jpg
3. http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/1226/thesuit3jb9.jpg
And in this story after the Origins and Endings arc where Wolverine had to eat his own arm for nurishment, Wolverine can't even heal from a bloody nose by Nuke.... You think his HF was at full capacity?
Please say yes, and show us what a clown you really are.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Cap could do all those things. And there are side-by-side instances where Cap's will has proven stronger then Wolverine's.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
New Avengers #5 for instance. Cap resists the mutate's powers and Wolverine is out. Show me an instance where Wolverine's will clearly surpasses Cap's in the same situation and I'll consider that his will surpasses Cap's. Until then, it only threatens to rival Cap's and in side-by-side, it was lower then Cap's.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0Never said that, I'm implying that I think Wolverine can rival him in strategy since you said that he couldn't... and for someone who like "side-by-side" comparisons, WOLVERINE DID... now you want to ignore it? Hypocrite.
One feat of strategy leads you to believe that Wolverine is more strategical then Cap?
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Not even the wildest of Wolverine fanboys would agree that Wolverine is more strategical or more tactical then Cap.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0No, his shield provides him a RANGED option, reach is still fully to Wolverine's advantage, so I'm not wrong. Once again, get a grasp of the English language.
Wrong yet again. Cap's shield provides him greater reach then Wolverine's claws.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Like Wild Child? Like Sabretooth? Like Gorgon? Like Spider-woman? Like Cap in the "Heal [b]this" scan? Okie dokie. [/B]
Originally posted by OneDumbG0I was mocking you, how was any of that wrong, I was just repeating back your own argument.
Wrong yet again. You're going for the record. You want me to show you where Cap has beheaded opponents and lopped off their limbs? Trust me, he could slit Wolverine's throat, or gut Wolverine with that shield's edge.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
And he'd do it the same way he's been able to whack him with his fists and his shield. You appear to suggest that only an opponent whose speed far surpasses Wolverine's can hit him.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Well... considering that Cap has hit him plenty of times with his fists, kicks and shield...
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
I suppose you conclude Cap moves faster then Wolverine. But wait, Wolverine has tagged Cap also... so he must be faster then Cap. Oh wait... Wolverine tagged Daken also... he must be faster then Daken... OH BUT WAIT... Cap > Wolverine > Daken. Yay! Cap beats Daken! Your logic is singular and it phails utterly.
Lol and I was only joking about your language comprehension problem..
There's a MAJOR discrepancy between getting hit by someone, and getting blitzed by them so fast that you can't even see where they went before they're behind you stabbing you in the back... HOW ON EARTH don't you get that?
Originally posted by OneDumbG0He wasn't fighting at full capacity, he didn't want to hurt her, he wasn't there for a fight end of story, if he was serious that fight would have ended about as fast as their second encounter. One snatch out of the air and she was done.
I read the issue. I own it. Wolverine was not trying to hurt X-23 at first. Then he gets sliced up a bit and decides to get serious. And even more telling, even after realizing what X-23 had been doing, he was unable to counter it and went down. By far, a serious feat for X-23.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0I disagree, Wolverine has lifted a fully loaded elevator with one arm. I'd say that's more impressive than what Cap's done, Speetd wise they're the same.
Cap has more impressive strength feats and more impressive speed feats (running wise and dodging lazers-wise anyway).
Originally posted by OneDumbG0Bone claw Wolveirne has railed through deathstrike easily... More importantly though, has Cap done the same thing to Wolverine? Let me think..... hmmmm NO... 😐
Cap fought Lady Deathstrike and didn't even get hit once...
Originally posted by OneDumbG0pfffft it's BARELY an option he can use to beging with.
And bleeding him out isn't the only viable tactic Cap can use.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0Both are skewed by the ommision of plot devices. If Cap's bringing his trusty bag-o-plot devices to this battle then you might have a point, as it stands, you don't.
And although you don't like it, I've already presented you with two very recent instances where Wolverine goes down from bleeding out.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0By people in Cap's strength class? Like who?
Wolverine has also been beaten by simply getting knocked silly.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
In the first raid in 'Agent of Shield,' Wolverine just gets clubbed silly by Gorgon wielding a wooden beam. And let's not forget the "Heal [b]this" attack! [/B]
Gorgon- Faster than Cap, Stronger than Cap, Better than Cap.
"Heal This" - Let's not forget the fact that Wolverine was already taxed out... Or.. I guess we could just to throw you a bone right?
Let's also not forget that Wolverine's been in over 120 fights with characters of class 50 strength and above and has only been KOed a handful of times during those encounters. Cap's percentage chance to win by "knocking Logan silly" is SLIM at best.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0To be honest I think it's Cap's best revenue of attack. Depending on the speed in which Logan's HF is working he can be effected by pressure points. Sometimes they work, sometimes they don't.
Thanks for letting us know of another way that Cap could win. Cap certainly is better at using pressure points and focusing on a person's joints. I don't know why he only might get lucky, but then again, I haven't seen Wolverine go down from pressure points. Also... I never really have seen anyone utilize them against Wolverine. Have you? I'm asking an honest question. Either way, until we see those situations, I don't think it's safe to assume Cap could easily win through pressure points or that Wolverine would easily defend against the attack would be presumptuous? Agreed?
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
More effective the other way around. Yes I agree. And to be honest, your thoughts are not that far off then mine. But you're extremely selective. Because you like to think about Wolverine in general terms of his career. Because I can generalize also. Cap has rarely lost a fight. And Cap's career has him facing far more impossible odds then the ones Wolverine could ever impose. And yet, Cap still wins through his own will, strategic mind, tenacity and prowess. So if you really want to be general, you tell me how Wolverine imposes far greater odds then Cap has been confronted with his entire career? All I'm arguing, is that Wolverine does not.Cap 6/10.
But to answer your question... and the answer is simple, this is a stylized match-up. That's how.
Wolverine and Cap are FAR too competetive in terms of speed, skill, strength, OR experience for any of those to be a major deciding factor in the fight.
Wolverine is a severly dangerous threat to Cap, because for Cap this is like fighting a shorter hairier mirror image of himself. And what's more, Wolverine knows exactly how to push Steve's buttons as has been displayed on several occassions. But what it really comes down to is this... "for all their similarities in combat, how do these two characters differ greatly" and the answer frankly put is that Wolverine is a killer, and he can take more damage.
These are both tough guys but they're so close in every category that I can't possibly imagine that one's percentage chance of hitting the other greatly exceeds that other. They're so close that there's probably a 50/50 shot on who lands what punch where. But, because of Wolverine's healing factor, he can simply regularly take more than what Cap and regularly dish out. And at the end of the day that spells doom for the star spangled avenger. Cap has to fight flawlessly to win this, I don't see him doing that more often than not.
