http://www.dccomic.com/secret_files/dc_character.html?sc_dc_itemCode=bmbatgirl
http://www.dccomic.com/secret_files/dc_character.html?sc_dc_itemCode=ladyshiva
Batman could use the surrounding area to his advantage provided that he has the time to analyze his environment and concoct a plan. However in straight out hand to hand combat fight, Batman would probably lose.
Yeah we are verging off topic.
okay it saids that Batman hasnt beaten her as of yet cause always someone interfered.
Im still looking for where Batman admitted that Batgirl was a better hand to hand fighter. someone else said that
Check out "A Death in the Family", the story arc in which
Jason Todd died. The Shiva/Batman fight was in part 2 or 3.
Batman won, but only after the Boy Wonder kicked her in the _back.
though to me it was pretty even fighting, no one had the advantage of it
Bats vs. Shiva is "usually" Batman takes s_ix out of ten.
Point taken. It would be nice to see an actually no holds barred fight between them for once. Batman has admitted that Batgirl is better fighter than him sproadically over the Batgirl series. Most recently was in an issue where Batman fought Batgirl in a graveyard. I doubt Batman could truly defeat Lady Shiva in hand to hand combat. He has a better chance than most to win though.
I remember an issue where Cap and some chick where running from an army and he tells her to keep running and he'll hold of the army... and he does.
I have only read a few of my friends Batgirl issues (he loves the anything to do with the Batfamily) and in one issue Batgirl was trying to fight Batman for some reason but he didn't want and it was still a stalemate... had he wanted to fight I bet he would have won.
Batman admitted that Batgirl was the better fighter in an issue of Robin a couple of months ago, I believe. He then went on to say that she should team up with Robin because, despite her unsurpassed fighting ability, she lacked the skills to be a detective (like, you know, being able to read).
Like I said before, Batman is probably barely top five DC hand-to-hand combatants. But Batman's appeal is that he's so much more than just a hand-to-hand combatant. When Batman takes down Superman, does it have ANYTHING to do with Batman's hand-to-hand power? No - it would be meaningless against Superman. It has everything to do with Batman's ability to identify weakness and take advantage of it. Batman could take down Superman at 80 years old if he had sufficient prep time. The same holds true with the other top hand-to-hand combatants in the DC. He could defeat them all, in the same night if he wanted, just not with straight up fighting.
Originally posted by Draco69
To get back on topic, do you believe that Batgirl can beat Cap?
well the question was answer that she was just as skilled as Batman, so Yes!
I havent read alot of info on the gadgest that she uses though Captain America has only the sheild!!!
Seems Batgirl should take this one!
Originally posted by demigawd
Batman admitted that Batgirl was the better fighter in an issue of Robin a couple of months ago, I believe. He then went on to say that she should team up with Robin because, despite her unsurpassed fighting ability, she lacked the skills to be a detective (like, you know, being able to read).Like I said before, Batman is probably barely top five DC hand-to-hand combatants. But Batman's appeal is that he's so much more than just a hand-to-hand combatant. When Batman takes down Superman, does it have ANYTHING to do with Batman's hand-to-hand power? No - it would be meaningless against Superman. It has everything to do with Batman's ability to identify weakness and take advantage of it. Batman could take down Superman at 80 years old if he had sufficient prep time. The same holds true with the other top hand-to-hand combatants in the DC. He could defeat them all, in the same night if he wanted, just not with straight up fighting.
but that is what Im saying! You guys are saying that she is slightly better than him on hand to hand fighting though Batman has a superior Eistein brain that would make up for the defeciet and then some to get the victory over Batgirl or Lady Shiva
hmmmmm you have any pics on the net of that issue of Robin where he says that?? Sometimes Teachers tell that to their students that they are better than they are to get them to try and train harder so they can be better
We're not really debating anything because I think we all agree to two basic points:
1)Batgirl is a better hand-to-hand fighter than Batman.
2)Batman is so smart that he could find a way to beat her anyway. It just wouldn't be in straight hand-to-hand combat.
And I think that she could likewise beat Captain America, who is also good a finding a way to win, but would probably underestimate Batgirl, being a 5'5" girl. He could win a rematch, but it wouldn't be easy. And if you arm Batgirl with her assassin weapons (like when she was playing Kasumi), she's probably win a lot more often than not.
She fought a heavily armed Deathstroke to a draw, and Deathstroke DESTROYED Batman. I think most people believe that Deathstroke is a more ruthless version of Cap. Take away the weapons and the ruthlessness...Cap goes down.
No, I don't have any pictures of that issue of Robin, lol. Just sneak into your comicbook store and read it. It's a recent issue, so it'll still be on the stands.
Yeah...almost. 🙂
I think Conner is considered the #4 "non-enhanced" fighter in the DC universe or somesuch. IIRC, it's:
1. Shiva
2. Batgirl (though I guess she's #1 now)
3. Richard Dragon
4. Conner Hawke
5. Batman
I'd love to see a throwdown between any two of the people on this list. Or with Deathstroke (who didn't make the list because he's "enhanced"😉.
In the one instance where I remember Bats beating Cap it was more a fluke. That was in the DC VS Marvel line. The other two instances where they have fought Bats has addmited that Cap has an edge. The two fights that I have seen between Batman and Bat Girl they were more or less evenly matched. Again even if Bat Girl is more skill Bats(and Cap) have more experience. The Marvel Encyclopedia rates Caps durability at 3 which is enhanced. 2 is normal even guys like Daredevil and the Punisher have 2. I doubt Cap is going to underestimate any opponent 5' 5" and female or not. Its not in his nature. This does bring us to the other issue that peak condition for him and peak condition for Bat Girl are going to be different. He is going to be stronger, probably more durable, and a faster runner. Which means if needed he can make a tactical withdrawl and gain "higher ground".
Originally posted by demigawd
Yeah...almost. 🙂I think Conner is considered the #4 "non-enhanced" fighter in the DC universe or somesuch. IIRC, it's:
1. Shiva
2. Batgirl (though I guess she's #1 now)
3. Richard Dragon
4. Conner Hawke
5. BatmanI'd love to see a throwdown between any two of the people on this list. Or with Deathstroke (who didn't make the list because he's "enhanced"😉.
This may be a stupid question, but who is Richard Dragon?
Originally posted by x_danny_x
there was something to note about how she defeated Lady Shiva, it can be argue that it wasnt a true victory. She cheated somehow I heardWhere did Batman acknowledge where Batgirl was a better fighter than him in hand to hand combat!???
I always thought that nobody was a better complete fighter than Batman.
Im sorry but I dont believe that Batgirl or Shiva can beat Batman if he knows how to fight intellictually as well. He will find someway to defeat either woman.
Now you guys say he would defeat Lady Shiva in heart beat if she ever does something naughty because Batman has an Einstein brain, so you are helping prove my point