Riddick VS Batman

Originally posted by jinzin
"But you are not the only one who has taken taken martial arts, and i am more than willing to bet that my experience is more varied than yours."

Yes, I have taken martial arts, get your **** straight. And varied,,,,,,perhaps, more or better,,,,,,,well that's debatable.

"I'm certain you are one of those who got their first black belt when they were in middleschool and think kicking above your head or knowing how to flip nunchaku makes one a master. I've met many as such. "

As have I, and I was almost to assume the same of you. However the fact that you would so easily assume what my experience is much less my style of fighting only goes on to show you're ignorance. Despite not being any of your concern since you seem so ready to assume, I'm still working on my Black Belt in a style of martial arts that takes itself very seriously.

"We actually made their sifu (chinese equivalent of sensei)"

You must assume I'm inexperience to not know what this is. pffft.

"A person with brown belts in 5 martial arts, and trains a lot, will defeat a person who has a sho-dan black belt in a single martial art (and i am assuming both of them did not come from some 50 dollar a week neighborhood 'studio' where their 'sensei' promised to teach them moves that would 'impress their friends and astound their enemies' or such hogwash). "

I might even believe you if I didn't know what I was talking about,,,,however I've more than easily delt with more than a few practitioners of multiple styles. What you're saying is an opinion not a fact. The fighter has to have an active and a reactive mind as I'm sure you know, if one can't adapt themselves so fighting another who possesses multiple styles than they are not a true master of their artform (and just to be clear I am in now implying that i am a master myself), and whats worse is that that implies they don't have the correct mindset for fighting.

Let me just say this. I've studied several styles for slightly over 2 decades (i started at the age that you say you started at). My arts range from Japanese to Chinese to Filipino to one Israeli. I've learnt things in the several Chinese styles i take that i never learnt from the Japanese. And the Filipino introduced new concepts and principles that were innovative.
Basically it has allowed me to develop quite a varied and eclectic pool to draw form, and i do not mean techniques (most of the people here in the states just study techniques). I mean mindsets as well. And i have never met a single person who practices just one martial art that i could not, simply put, overwhelm. I'm not saying this out of hubris, just facts. A couple of these guys have had belts higher than me (my highest is a ni-dan - 2nd degree black belt - some of the guys were san-dans and yo-dans,higher belt levels than i was). But they only knew one art. And while they were good, i was better because i knew almost as much as they did in their particular art, but i was at the same time highly ranked in several others.
It is like going for a quiz against a math genius (but the guy only knows math), while you are exceptionaly bright in Math (though not a true genius, but still exceptionally bright), as well as exceptionally bright in geography, physics, biology and art. And the quiz is a general knowledge type of quiz that can ask any question from any field.
The math guy will do well in the questions dealing with math, but will falter if asked about world history or tectonic plates.
Same thing.
A real fight is a general knowledge quiz. There are no set rules, no stances or poses (as i said it always makes me smile whenever someone would take a stance), and no expected moves. If Joe knows just one style it means that he may be great, but will fall if he goes against another person who knows Joe's styles at Joe's level, as well as several other styles at an equally high level.
Let me end by putting it this way. I'm glad that you started the martial arts young, and you do seem quite dedicated. And you say you are still working on your black belt 'in a style that takes itself seriously.' That is great, and again i wish you the best. May you master your style.
But once you have mastered it it might be prudent to look into augmenting your style with something else. Knowledge is not supposed to be stagnant. If you master your style (as i did Shotokan) it is time to mvoe to something else and master it (which is why i constantly work at Jeet Kune Do, Arnis, Krav Maga, Lian Shi, Judo and Ving Tsun). And while in most of these i have also reached over blackbelt equivalency, i still consider them to be just progressive steps along my Shotokan start (even though i am actually better right now at Jeet Kune Do and Lian Shi than i even was with Shotokan, even at Ni-dan level). It is just another step in the journey.
Once you master your art it might be wise to see how you can make your art better for YOU. Become better than your sensei/soke/sifu (and sorry for thinking you were too dumb to know what a sifu was - i thought i was dealing with another snotty kid who got a black belt in sixth grade - you saying you were still working on a black belt made me realize you might actually be putting serious work into this). Reaching a certain level, and staying there, is stagnation.
On the other hand never mastering a single art but jumping from one to the other as if it was some sandwich bar is even worse (maybe that is what you thought i was saying). One has to become adept with each art and not just 'sample' different styles lookign for some new 'cool' move.
Anyways, believe it or not, but being adept at different styles is a boon.

"It is like going for a quiz against a math genius"

no it's not, it's like fighting nuff said. You may have handled your share of single-styled "masters', however, in the same regard, I have delt with my fair share of mutli-stled fighters too. Like I suggested before, it truley does depend on the fighter. If one is a true practictioner of their style they should be able to let it evolve and adapt it to what works for them best. When I say multiple styles makes it harder to learn and correctly practice martial arts I'm talking about the basics of moving one's body, not knowing diff meathods of fighting such as boxing, martial arts, grappling, wrestling, chin-na, etc. I'm reffering to the simplicity of basic kicks and punches becoming mangled once the technique leaves the mind, putting the body in motion. I've fought guys where this has happened to them in the middle of the fight and seen it's adverse affects.

"If you master your style (as i did Shotokan) it is time to mvoe to something else and master it "

now i understand the evidence of your misconception of my style. In my style we never truely master it. That's the goal of course, to be perfect, but our lives are a constant striving for that perfection never to be attained, each day bringing a new lesson. Two of the 2nd degree black belts have been so for nearly a decade now, and each day they practice to become better still.

"and sorry for thinking you were too dumb to know what a sifu was - i thought i was dealing with another snotty kid who got a black belt in sixth grade - you saying you were still working on a black belt made me realize you might actually be putting serious work into this"

apology accepted,,,,and thankyou.

"On the other hand never mastering a single art but jumping from one to the other as if it was some sandwich bar is even worse (maybe that is what you thought i was saying). One has to become adept with each art and not just 'sample' different styles lookign for some new 'cool' move."

perhaps, The problem is that i don't think one can ever truley 100% master their style, and in that same notion it would be ridiulous to attempt to "master" multiple styles given the volume of our lifetime,,,however i digress, to each his own.

Are you kidding me?
Batman without any gadgets?
WIN?

Riddick is a anti-hero potentially built upon the very idea of fist fighting, Batman relies on gadgets and what melee combat he can execute, he hardly ever relies on just Melee, I dont think ive ever seen a comic of his where he hasnt used one gadget of some type.

I'm confused. A true master of their art would be able to adapt and apply their skill against any opponent. Even if the opponent had mastered multiple 'styles', they should still be able to adapt to each one even though they've only mastered one 'style'. Even mixing Mantis, Aikido, Karate, Gung, Drunken, etc shouldn't matter to a true master of their respective discipline. Even if the other combatant was of the same level in their discipline, the best they could possibly acquire was a draw more times than not.

Throwing a different style or styles at a true master would simply make him/her adapt and counter it.

I think 'style' is the weakness. If your you're truly a master, your opponent's style wouldn't matter in a conflict. It's not like a true master karate practitioner would be out of his element just because the opponent mastered crane. In unarmed combat, that would imply that the other arts are superior.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by jinzin

no it's not, it's like fighting nuff said.---Jinzin

It is. Fighting (and i do not mean kumite where there are rules) has no set rules. Anything goes. In a dojo or dojang there are certain requirements, in the streets anything goes. My quiz analogy was actually quite appropos.

When I say multiple styles makes it harder to learn and correctly practice martial arts I'm talking about the basics of moving one's body, not knowing diff meathods of fighting such as boxing, martial arts, grappling, wrestling, chin-na, etc. I'm reffering to the simplicity of basic kicks and punches becoming mangled once the technique leaves the mind, putting the body in motion. ---Jinzin

Maybe for you. Personally it has made me even better at what i could do before. More fluidity, better cadence, faster speed, more honed skill. The only way more knowledge and experience could 'mangle' a person is if the person really did not know what he was doing before. What you are saying is akin to stating that moving to higher be;t grades 'mangles' ones abilities. That is not the case, unless ofcourse (like the case above) the person really did not know what the heck he was doing in the lower grades.

I've fought guys where this has happened to them in the middle of the fight and seen it's adverse affects.----Jinzin

You must have been fighting people who were not adept enough to know how to match cadence, or who 'thought moves' instead of being one with the act. If someone is mentally switching from capoiera to ving tsun that would cause serious cadence problems. IF the person is not well versed in either art (aka a wannabe). A true exponent would have no problem merging everything into one fluid form. Hence you must have faced rank amateurs, or what we call 'technique collectors' (whereby they pick a move from this art and a move from that art and think they are something else).

..now i understand the evidence of your misconception of my style. ----Jinzin

I do not even know your style, and do not think highly or lowly of it (it would be foolish to since it is not the style but the exponent that matters to a large degree). You are actually the one (if your first post) who was claiming that you had started martial arts since you were 4 and i did not know what the heck i was talking about. And saying i was posting nonsense when i said Batman knew 127 styles (which he does - since he is a comic and in comics people do things like shoot fire from their eyes, breath in water, wear their underwear outside their pants, and know every single martial art in the world).

In my style we never truely master it. That's the goal of course, to be perfect, but our lives are a constant striving for that perfection never to be attained, each day bringing a new lesson. ----Jinzin

And in my various styles we continuously nurture our growth by adding to it, and add to our growth by nurturing what we already know (in two of them, Krav Maga and Jeet Kune Do, this is actually expected). Different paths, same goal. Unless you want to argue over semantics.

Two of the 2nd degree black belts have been so for nearly a decade now, and each day they practice to become better still. ---Jinzin

Do you know how many years i had to be in sho-dan (first degree black) level in Shotokan before i was even allowed to THINK about trying out for Ni-dan? You obviously do not, since i haven't told you, yet you have the temerity to tell me how your 2nd degree black belts 'train every day.' This morning i was training in Shotokan. Tonight i will be doing wooden dummy for ving Tsun. Maybe you think i abandoned my original system. I have not and never will, but i will add to it.

By the way, let me ask you a question. How do you think the founders of most styles started their arts? They normally were raised up in one style, then they found ways of incorporating principles from other styles into their seminal art, and making that art better for them. Were they stupid to do that? Were it the case then everyone would be doing Kalari Payat (the original style that came centuries and centuries ago from India through BodiDharma that gave birth to most modern styles after making its way through China, Japan and the far east). But people always tried to make the art they did better for them, and in the process variety came to be.

Anyways, let me end by putting it this way. I still think you are totally serious in your belief that knowing a single style and a single style alone is the true way. And that is ok, particularly if you really devote yourself to that style (but the way i am curious now about what style it is that you do. And i respect all styles, so i will not utter a single word of disrespect towards it. I also respect exponents who apply themselves with devotion, and you seem to. What i cannot stand is 7th graders having a black belt and not even knowing how to breath in the proper manner during a move). Anyways, it is fine to know one art.
It is also fine to know more than one. As long as the person is not a 'technique collector' (there is a word for that, but it is insulting. Hence the caps).
And there is more than one path.
Maybe in your art it is decorum to study it and nothing else. In others, for example Jeet Kune Do (which is itself a collection of several arts based on ving Tsun started when Bruce Lee decided knowing one art alone was too limiting) it is mandatory to know more than one art (and i mean know not merely collect moves and stances).
Again, more than one path.
And i am willing to bet that if you asked your sensei,sifu, soke, instructor, and he read our posts, that he would probably laugh and say we were arguing over nothing. That we both had correct points,and were both correct.
Anyways, JinZin, let me close by wishing you (again) the best. May you know your art to the best of your ability, and may i know mine to my best.

Batman always uses his eqipment and stuff Riddick usually uses a knife thats it, He has fought and taken down wild animals, bounty hunters, rooms of armed men, and not even broken a sweat the only guy who gave Riddick a run for his money was the Lord Marshal and thats only cause of his powers to move faster then the human eye can see. On the other hand Batman has almost been killed by a predator from what ive seen from the style of a predator Riddick could probably kill is since He Himself is a predator but in human form, He also may have latent powers since He is the last of His kind, He also seems to fear nothing, if you ask me i guess there equal in fighting in my point of view but yes i guess they would kick the shit out of each other before one of Them dieing but in the end i belive the winnder would be Riddick

Originally posted by jinzin
"fights extremely dirty"-batman wrote the book on this one.

"Also, just because you know 127 different martial arts doesn't mean that someone who has completely and utterly mastered just 1 discipline can't beat you"

tis true. in fact knowing more martial arts styles can actually hinder you due to the different techniques sed to shift weight and throw kicks etc...but that's not what comic would have us believe. lol.

Well Batman has completely and utterly mastered 127, not just kinda knows most of it.

I thought this was ridick vs batman not a martial arts argument. anyway ridick would crush batman, just like bane did.

Riddick isn't a brick guy like Bane, but he's stronger than Bats.Also, his experience can fill the lack of knowledge of martial arts, cause his life is a survival test since he was born.

I found a bio about Riddick

Richard B. Riddick -- Riddick started out life in a liquor store trash bin. From here his life took one ****ed up turn after another. He became an Elite company ranger assigned to the Sigma Galaxy. There he took on a job as a sweeper in his rookie days. Sweepers drew out the local wildlife, spitfires (huge, slimy, lizard-like creatures with motion sensors for eyes). Soon he was promoted to the prestigious Strikeforce Academy on Sigma 3's moon. There he learned all the ins and outs of killing. He was then turned loose to enforce security on Sigma 3, which was basically the police term for slavery. It was there that he learned that the company was running a crooked game everywhere it operated. After a while the murdering and torture became to much for him to handle, so he blew the whistle. But having the "wonderful" luck that he did he was branded a criminal for life. All the evidence that he had gathered mysteriously disappeared and he was put in Deep Storage. Before his third year out he overpowered a guard, took his uniform and got away. He shot 2 guards and a pilot escaping. The Company put a million-credit contract on his head. He became a wanted man pursued by every bounty hunter, bushwhacker and merc in the space lanes. And every time he killed one of them their deaths was added to his list of serial killings. Until Johns came along and blasted to kids to get two him and captured him.

Frank Laurie: Pitch Black book