UFC Style VS Tournament Lightheavy Div Please Read rules and regulations

Batman never goes anywhere without a beltful of gadgets. Cap is much faster than Batman. Captain America only weighs 30 more pounds than Batman, and Captain America has virtually no body fat. Being bigger does not necessarily mean being slower. Muscles are what make people fast. Who do you think is faster, Batman or Hulk? Hulk of course. His leg muscles are too much stronger. He'd dust Batman. The same holds true for anyone else with superhuman strength. In human physiology, leg strength = speed.

Captain America is much stronger than Batman. There is no way in hell a 210 pound human can lift 600lbs. No way in hell. That's nearly three times his body weight. Batman's strength is in the 200-350 pound range, maximum.

Captain America is indeed Superhuman. The super-soldier serum accounts for this. There is no way any human, no matter how hard they train, can lift nearly four times their body weight.

If Captain America decides to wrestle, or better yet, use American Kick-boxing, (his usual fighting style,) He will overpower Batman.

We do have to distinguish between raw speed (i.e. how fast your muscles can accelerate your body) and what people typically mean when they say "speed". Real speed in combat isn't just how fast you can run or even your reflexes, but a complex of positioning, muscle power, subconscious conditioning, control and technique (eliminating extraneous motions, for example), clarity of mind and purpose, etc. etc. In that sense, Batman may have edges in some aspects, but he definitely loses elsewhere. Folks, there's just not much you can do if someone runs circles around you and batters you senseless. The only possible edge is that Batman has martial arts training that includes an incredible variation of techniques whereas Cappy may be a little more limited, but I don't think knowing the crane stance will help Batman in this case.

Originally posted by long pig

About fighting people who are stronger, well, remember Royce Gracie? He weighed 170lbs(he benched 200lbs) and always fought 300lb boxers, streetboxers, Kick boxers and the like(who normally benched 400-500lbs) and never lost,

He did?? *cries* I had a chance to be trained by him also, and I missed it cause I didn't have a way to get there. WHY WHY WHY! I coulda been so much better probably then I am now.

Anyways..Its not about size, and strength when it comes to a fight like this I've taken out guys twice my size, and strength. Its basically how much you can take, and about how skilled you are, and how good you are at getting out of stuff. The best person I know is like smaller then me, and fast.

I'm being ganged up upon here!
Wouldnt have it any other way.

Want an example of someone who is outmatched speed-strength but has superior h2h and wins?
Elektra vs Wolverine
her strenght was like 200 maybe...his is 800 you know the rest.

batmans skill, speed and agility will win this fight.
Batman IMO is more driven to win a fight.
Cap is just cocky.

"Who do you think is faster, Batman or Hulk? Hulk of course. His leg muscles are too much stronger. He'd dust Batman. The same holds true for anyone else with superhuman strength. In human physiology, leg strength = speed."

Well, hulk can lift over a 100 tons with his legs and only weighs a ton or so which means...c'mon its obvious. That isnt a very good example.

Here is a good one, Who is faster? The Rock or a profesional Track and Field competitor? Of course Bulky muscle makes you slower.

Wrestling and american kickboxing are two of the weakest forms of h2h combat in the big O.
a wrestler or a kickboxer cant do shit when the kick they threw is grabbed and ankle locked. SNAP.

Batman wins through wither pressure points, or joint breaks.

Cap is by no means an easy guy to beat and this could go either way but I'd bet for Batman, even if i dont like him.

Originally posted by Kento
He did?? *cries* I had a chance to be trained by him also, and I missed it cause I didn't have a way to get there. WHY WHY WHY! I coulda been so much better probably then I am now.

Anyways..Its not about size, and strength when it comes to a fight like this I've taken out guys twice my size, and strength. Its basically how much you can take, and about how skilled you are, and how good you are at getting out of stuff. The best person I know is like smaller then me, and fast.

Originally posted by long pig
He lost ONCE by accidently breaking his toe and finger.
He was the toughest most skilled fighter ive ever seen....bruce lee? hah!
Too bad he retired, he is still teaching but not fighting anymore.
The whole gracie family are basically brazlian judo mix masters....they amaze me.

Man I wish I hadn't of lost my way to the thing he was teaching. My sensei got him to do a teaching thing, and I coulda been taught by him...I had the money, and everything but just a month before he was coming I lost my ride to get there.

I never even heard of him until my sensei said he was famous...I never knew he was so good.

Really? His father was more famous in the MA community than he was.
early 50's His Grandfather kick started the mix judo KB MA style in south america and made its way up to america.
people hype bruce lee, bruce has nothing on the Gracie family.

aw, im sorry to hear that, It'd been something I'da killed for too!

*laughs* The biggest MA people I know are Chuck Norris, Bruce Lee, Jet Li, Jackie Chan, Ernie Reyes, and Ernie Reyes Jr. The last one is about my favorite.

I'd have killed for it before I knew how great he was cause I live grappling stuff.

Me too, its crazy how easy you can take someone out with a simple ankle lock.

Yea, and how easy it would be to break somebody's ankle to. That's what I worried about with ankle locks *laughs* Cause person I would grapple would try to out last the pain until time ran out with ankle locks, and I'm not good at judging how much I can put on something before it gets to bad, and the person's a friend of mine so I'd stop the lock, and go to choke holds.

Long_pig and cosmic cube great answers so far its between you two. 24 hours left for this fight .... Still time for someone to step up and challenge Long_pig and Cosmic cube.... And please fellas and new comers READ THE RULES I let a few slide but no more once again great job Guys..

I must say this However fight can only end in Knockout or Death as the rules stated. And cosmic its is possible powerlift pro ken ross benched 722 at a bodyweight of 215 in 2001 I myself have benched as much as 612 at a body weight of 256 pounds...12 hours left so far a very good debate aLSO REMEMBER THIS tANK ABBOTT KEEPING WITH mY THEME one of the most powerful natural human beings who has bench 635 pounds curled 175 pound dumbells and one of the strongest strikers ever has a record of I believe 11 and 14 in the octagon SKILL beats one Dimensional fighters all the time Either by tiring out from throwing haymakers or getting caught by shots from being sloppy. You dont have to be the Strongest but if you are skilled with strength and heart and brains most of the time you win..

arek exelsior2 after reading your post you have put your self in a threeway dance with long pig and cosmic...I will give eachone of you one more comment on this fight to decide since you guys did so well this time with the RULES Knockout or Death....

Let's look at the scenarios and the characters.

Batman: An ordinary human. He may have access to conditioning regimens that ordinary individuals don't, but so does Captain America. He may spend all of his day working out, but so does Captain America. He also heavily relies on a full utility belt of gadgets. That means he's used to having gadgets for transportation, melee combat, distraction, etc. It's like the classic "ninja vs. samurai" fight, and Batman's the ninja. He has been trained by Lady Shiva and numerous other great masters of martial arts, meaning he may have ten to twenty forms under his belt.

Captain: Captain America is at worst a peak human, but looking at Marvel's ratings, he's a lot better. This means that he has conditioning from a cell of the US government with unlimited funds as well as a miraculous serum. He has taken hits that would cripple Batman. He thus has edges in the following areas: Fatigue resistance and endurance (remember that he literally does NOT get tired - the only upper limit is how much caloric capacity he has in him), reflexes, muscular power (particularly explosive muscular power), bone and muscle strength and mass (meaning Batman does less real damage per hit and is more exhausted), keenness of perception (meaning he can detect moments of weakness such as during stance shifts and react more quickly), and quickness of mind (in other words, his brain actually processes things faster in combat). He is a grand master of common American forms, including judo/wrestling and boxing/kickboxing, as well as anything else he may have picked up in the story arcs. He is used to having a shield, which means he may make a few mistakes with blocking. He also has decades of experience in context of the Avengers and World War II.

Simply comparing the two, we see that Batman is overpowered in a few key respects:

1) Raw physical capacity, in all of its forms
2) Reliance on gadgets (Cappy at best will be a little slow to block because of his shield, whereas Batman will be less prepared in almost every respect)
3) Arguably, experience

His only edge is his broader range of martial arts experience.

The battle is simply UFC-style ring combat. Captain America and Batman edge closer to each other, looking for weakness in stance or intention. Eventually, Captain America sees something Batman can't and rushes in. Batman may evade and get a hit, but Captain will undoubtedly salvage a punishing glancing blow. This will continue until Batman has been beaten down and surprised enough (since Captain America won't be getting harmed by any of this) to miss an essential clue and get put into a lock. That's all she wrote.

The super-serum not only increased Capatin America's
strength, but his agility and reflexes as well, which, when
combines with all the subsequent training and fighting,
means that he will have a bodily advantage over Batman.

Where batman will have the advantage will be in fighting
skills.

Another, not touched upon, but may or may not be
important, is psychology. Both men are not really killers,
but where as Captain America is pretty much a human
Superman, that is a boy-scout, Batman is very much
willing to do anything and everything shory of murder.

Still, in the end, after a long tough fight, with maybe
Batman getting in a few good shots, including even a
couple of cheap shots (he's more willing to fight dirty),
Captain America's superior speed, agility, reflexes,
and durabiltiy (including stamina) overwhelm Batman,
sort of like Bane.

Boy scout beats play-boy.

I don't think he'll kill him though.

Even though my fight senario does not count I will anyway just for the hell of it.. This fight will be utter hell two of the most respected men in the universe. Both have Tremendous heart, Skill goes to batman strenght to cap its not how long you fight its the quality and the ability to adapt and make changes with that said heres my sceanrio.... Start of the fight they feel each other out cap explodes landing big shots bats comes back short uppercuts getting inside they go toe to toe cap devastating power punishing but then bats makes an adjustment becoming a counter fighter circling setting traps using his elusiveness his defensive dodging caps oncoming bombs waiting a frustrated one dimensional fighter that cap is loads up a shot to finish a battered batman. And then it happens caps unleashes a right cross from hell batman side steps counters with a Muy Tai knee right on the button cap drops to his knee batman then finish it with a streaight right KNocking out cap fight over Winner Batman... Thats how I see it Batman Like I said they make that adjustment hes to smart to just go toe to toe even though he started out like that cap never seen it coming Like Roy jones said after his last loss by knockout its the punch or kick you dont see that hurts but that how I see it.... It would be one hell of a fight...

6 hours left

Though it is not widely known, Captain America is also a martial arts master. He has mastered an unknown multitude of fighting styles, and in "TOHOTMU Avengers:" Cap is listed as a master of all forms of combat. He has fought in several wars, totally unarmed, save his shield (he's not bulletproof.) His hand to hand combat skills are at least eqivilant to Batman's.

Benching isn't the only way to lift, or display strength. Cap can lift 800 pounds over his head. Can Batman do the same?

Another category Batman is outclassed in is endurance. Captain America is in constantly peak human condition. That's more than Batman can say. Though he may be in excellent physical shape, his condition fluctuates, as do all humans. The Super Soldier serum prevents any of this from occuring in Captain America's body. His muscle will deteriorate faster than Captain America. He will build up lactic acid faster than Captain America. He will take more damage from attacks than Captain America. Captain America will certainly last much longer than Batman.

Captain America is solid muscle. Solid muscle will not weigh you down: muscles support themselves. Captain America is far faster than any olympic sprinter, and he is more agile and balanced than any gymnast or acrobat.

Captain America, like Batman, is a brilliant strategist. He will strategize this battle with unfailing accuracy, just as he has done in the past.

In every category save intelligence, Captain America meets or exceedes Batman. As a fighter, Captain America is all that Batman is, and more.

After reviewing everyones argument Cosmic cube wins it it was close disscussion for all particpants I want to thank all for contributing Cosmic cube wins this fight and will advance to championship fight in three days. King_Burger and long_pig, Arek_excelsior has a shot at joining him IF you can win the Next fight. Thank you all once again and Remember Come strong or not at all...

This thread is closed...