Re: Re: Why do they call their priests "Father"?
Originally posted by Jackie Malfoy
I think and I may be wrong it is because the prist is under god and therefore is our father or something like that.JM 😮
Thus, they themselves proclaimed that: the "fatherhood" of the priests is somewhat likened to the "Fatherhood" of God.
This is the USURPATION of the title intended for God alone - the very thing Jesus Christ prohibited to use for any man.
Originally posted by JuryMan, that was a lonnnnnnnnnnngggg post.
[b]“And call no man your Father…”
Matthew 23:9“Catholics rightly, therefore call the priest ‘father’, not to the exclusion of their Father in heaven, but as a manifestation on earth of the supreme Fatherhood of God in the spiritual order, even as an earthly parent is a similar manifestation of that same Fatherhood in the natural order.”
- Rev. Leslie Rumble
Another Thousand Radio Replies
p. 75Catholic priests are called “Fathers” although they are forbidden to marry and are thus theologically forbidden to have children. They are called fathers in spite of the biblical prohibition which we can read in Matthew 23:9. Catholic authorities assert that a priest is a spiritual father like God who is the Father of spirits.
1. What does the term “father” mean? When is a man called “father”?
2. How is God a “Father”?
3. What fatherhood did Jesus mean when He prohibited the use of the term “father” as a reference to any man?Let’s answer those questions one at a time.
1. What does the term “father” mean?
When is a man called “father”?father (n):
(a) he who begets a child, the nearest male ancestor, a male parent
(b) a forefather or forebear, a lineal male ancestor, the progenitor of a race or family
(c) oldest member of any profession or body, a leader or head of the community
(d) one who creates, invents, makes, originates, or composes anything, the author, former, or contriver, a founder, director, or instructor, the first to practice any art======
Sources: Webster’s New Universal Unabridged Dictionary, Webster’s Dictionary
=======By the given sets of meanings above, we can determine which fatherhood did Christ mean when He prohibited the use of the term “father” in reference to any man in Matthew 23:9.
(a) The first set of meanings is not what our Lord Jesus Christ alluded to in Matthew 23:9, because in Matthew 15:4 God commanded, “Honor thy father and mother…” In this verse, the father to be honored is not the same “father,” which is forbidden to be called on any man in Matthew 23:9.
(b) The second set is not referred to in Jesus’ prohibition, because this is where the fatherhood of Abraham belongs. Abraham, as we all know, is called the father of the Israelites.
(c) The third set is apparently not referred to by our Lord Jesus Christ as prohibition since this fatherhood is alluded to the leaders of our communities. The senators of ancient Rome were called by this term. They were called “Conscript Fathers”. The term is also used to mean the legislators of any nation or state (e.g. city dads).
(d) The fourth set of meanings is not what Christ had in mind in Matthew 23:9, since this term is commonly applied to philosophy, science and art; such as father of epic poetry (Homer), father of printing (Gutenberg), the pilgrim fathers, among others.
Some application of the term “father” is used as personification or grammatically figurative like “Fathers of Waters” to refer to the Mississippi River, “Father Time” where time is personified as a very old man carrying a scythe and an hourglass, a phrase “gathered into one’s fathers” which means to die.
These meanings are NOT in the statement of Christ’s prohibition.
2. How is God a “Father”?
In an all-embracing sense, He is the Father because He is the Creator of all things. Isaiah stated:
“But now, O LORD, thou art our Father,
we are the clay, and thou our potter;
and we all are the work of thy hand”
Isaiah 64:8The Prophet Malachi also said:
“Have we not all one father?
Hath not one God created us?…”
Malachi 2:10God is also our spiritual Father or “Father of spirits”:
“Furthermore, we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us,
and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be
in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?”
Hebrews 12:9In a narrower sense, God is Father to His chosen people who are specifically referred to as the children of God. He is “a Father to Israel” (Jeremiah 31:9). We know that Israel was God’s chosen people in the Old Testament of the Bible.
God is Father to the Christians in the New Testament. Christians are those who receive Christ and are given the power to become sons of God:
“But as many as received him,
to them gave the power to become the sons of God,
even to them that believe on his name”
John 1:12Catholic priests, on the other hand, who are called “fathers” by their followers, justify this by saying that since Apostle Paul called Timothy “my own son” (I Timothy 1:2) and the Christians of Galatia “my little children” (Galatians 4:19), then he must have been called by them “father’. This is mere assumption, without basis of fact. Nowhere in the New Testament does it say that the apostles were called by the title “father” as that of the Catholic sense. What is evident in the Bible is that their role was likened to that of a father, or of a mother, or of a parent who is taking care of his or her children (I Thessalonians 2:7, 11, TEV).
The fatherhood of the Apostles is considered as “fatherhood in the faith”. And the Gentile converts were considered as “children in the faith”. This fatherhood is not the same as the Fatherhood of God.
3. What fatherhood did Jesus mean when He prohibited the use of the term “father” as a reference to any man?
Matthew 23:9 reads:
“And call no man your father upon the earth:
for one is your Father, which is in heaven.”This was part of Christ’s discourse to the Jews on their religious functions (Matthew 23). Our Lord Jesus Christ was referring to the Fatherhood of God when He said: “for one is your Father, which is in heaven.” And we all know that God our Father is the only one “Father in spirit”.
The fatherhood of the Catholic priest
Again:
“Catholics rightly, therefore call the priest ‘father’, not to the exclusion of their Father in heaven, but as a manifestation on earth of the supreme Fatherhood of God in the spiritual order, even as an earthly parent is a similar manifestation of that same Fatherhood in the natural order.”
- Rev. Leslie Rumble
Another Thousand Radio Replies
p. 75The fatherhood of the Catholic priests stipulates the concept that the priests are called:
“parents of Jesus Christ,” and the “words of the priest create Jesus”
- St. Alphonsus De Liguori
Dignity and Duties of the Priests
pp. 32-33But the Fatherhood of God to Jesus is reserved for God alone for God is the Creator who created Jesus Christ and is the Father of Jesus Christ… not the priests.
The Pope at Rome, on the other hand, is also called “Holy Father”. But the title “Holy Father” was used by Jesus Christ to refer to our God.
“And now I am no more in the world,
but these are in the world, and I come to thee.
Holy Father, keep through thine own name
those whom thou hast given me,
that they may be one as we are.”
John 17:11And finally, what is really the fatherhood of the Catholic priests being referred to? At the same book by the Catholic Saint himself, Alphonsus De Liguori, it proclaims:
“St. Clement, then, had reason to say that the priest is,
as it were, a God on earth”
- St. Alphonsus De Liguori
Dignity and Duties of the Priests
pp. 36The use of the term “father” to refer to any man in the meanings of our Lord Jesus Christ in Matthew 23;9 is a usurpation of the honors that belong to God alone. The meanings of the term “father” as “Creator of all,” as “Father of spirits,” as “Father of Jesus Christ,” and as “Holy Father” refer to God alone. Using those meanings to refer to a man is what our Lord Jesus Christ prohibited.
The Catholic priests usurp this title. They are the personification of that:
“son of perdition; who opposeth and exalteth himself
above all that is called God, or that is worshipped;
so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God,
showing himself that he is God”
II Thessalonians 2:3-4Again, as to our Lord Jesus Christ’s prohibition, He said:
“And call no man your father upon the earth:
for one is your Father, which is in heaven.”
Matthew 23:9 [/B]
Originally posted by debbiejo
^ The priest says he is God on earth...speaking for Jesus..For him..
only the priest can speak for Jesus...that's what they think.
WOAH what are you smoking? Im Catholic and not only have I never heard this, I dont follow that. I get the biggest kick out of people trying to explain Catholic doctrine when they have absolutely no clue what they are talking about. 🙄 When I call a priest Father so & so I use it as a title much the same as Mr. or Mrs. or Doctor. Thats it. Some of you people tend to read entirely too much into this stuff.
When I call a priest Father so & so I use it as a title much the same as Mr. or Mrs. or Doctor.guess thats what the question was about why they do have father as a title, in Norwegian father has one meaning and one meaning only and that is of the biological kind. They adress catholic priest with the non Norwegian word Pater(kind of avoid the confusion with not using the Norwegian word for father) and then their last name, example the for our local one is Pater Pollestad (probably one of the few married catholich priest, he was a Luteran Evangelic priest and a married one too before he converted to be a catholic, he applied for the posititon and Rome accepted him)
Originally posted by Jedi Priestess
WOAH what are you smoking? Im Catholic and not only have I never heard this, I dont follow that. I get the biggest kick out of people trying to explain Catholic doctrine when they have absolutely no clue what they are talking about. 🙄 When I call a priest Father so & so I use it as a title much the same as Mr. or Mrs. or Doctor. Thats it. Some of you people tend to read entirely too much into this stuff.
When Jesus prohibited the use of "Father" to any man. Then, we must respect and obey. It is a commandment of Christ. Christians must follow.
This "Fatherhood" Christ has prohibited is not the "fatherhood" of our biological father. It is the spiritual "Fatherhood" of God in heaven. And the "Fatherhood" of the Catholic priests is also the spiritual "Fatherhood of God in heaven. This is what Christ has prohibited.
“And call no man your Father…”
Matthew 23:9
🙂
For a true Christian, it matters.a follower of christ is as much true as any other followers, only arrogance from those so self righteous who thinks so highly of themselves that their way are a more true and right than the way of others, .............to those self righteous ones get your head out of your own ass and smell reality instead of the crap thats has filled the nostrils and stop putting yourself above other christians
Originally posted by Jedi Priestess
WOAH what are you smoking? Im Catholic and not only have I never heard this, I dont follow that. I get the biggest kick out of people trying to explain Catholic doctrine when they have absolutely no clue what they are talking about. 🙄 When I call a priest Father so & so I use it as a title much the same as Mr. or Mrs. or Doctor. Thats it. Some of you people tend to read entirely too much into this stuff.
Sorry, I meant the Pope is speaking as god on earth...And the priests are doing the popes (gods) will...
Originally posted by Jury
🙄
Whats with the eye rolling? You post that alot when you are backed into a corner dont you? Finti hit the nail on the head, you seem to think you are the definitive be all, end all when it comes to religion. I wasnt aware I was in the presence of greatness. Perhaps they should have elected you Pope?
🙄 🙄 🙄 🙄
Originally posted by Jedi Priestess
And you are of course GOD I assume? Since you profess to be the judge and jury here.
Let's face it. The Pope claims to be God on earth. That's why they call themselves "Father". "Fatherhood" of God.... which was prohibited by our Lord Jesus Christ to call for any man.
🙂
Originally posted by Jedi Priestess
^ ^ ^ ^ ^hysterical hysterical
here's my final word on your comments dearie.......you arent old enough to know what reality is....go live some of your life...and them come back and read the things you babble on about, you really are clueless. 🙄
That is REALITY. 🙄
You cannot rebuke it, instead, you made side comments... which are useless in this discussion.
And here's my final words for you, too.
Let's face it, Jedi PRIESTess... you call your priests "Father" as the "Fatherhood of God in heaven"... I am certain to say, with sound biblical, that you disobey Christ's prohibition of not calling any man your "Father".
🙂