Originally posted by Fieperskaivu
Nothing will ever touch Luke vs. Vader in the 2nd death star.
I think Luke vs. Vader in 2nd death star... has been touched... alot..
Reasons why I like it:
Musical score pwns. Dramatic, epic.. all that. For it's time it was incredible and still is much like the OT itself.
Reasons why I don't like it:
Lukes channeling the darkside at this point, yet you really don't get the feel for it as he's swinging his saber round like an adolecent at his first baseball game. Most people I know never knew that he was actually using the darkside in this part of the fight.
He's so freaking uncoordinated and slow! For lukes first taste of dark side power... I can see why he didn't get conned over. Which is kind of a NT OT contradiction? But that's just me.. 🙄
Woulda been cool to see a freaky yellow eyed luke! Then he turns to badmouth the emporer and the yellow fades... this ofcourse representing the darkside and his temptation of it's use. I wouldn't actually show that.. it'd just be cool to see... 😄
You´re right about EP VI but you have to see that Luke never had a fully professional lightsaber training! He was educated by "Old" Ben who had his best years far behind and we have the same thing with Yoda. Luke had generally only some kind of "Jedi-Training-Crash-Course" absolved. And I guess only a part of that was fighting skills. Luke broke off his training. That explains it to me. What do you think?
Well Blender, I like u're rational... And I've used it myself alot.
But when episode 1 and 2 came out. I look at qui-gon, dooku and now the emporer after his mutilation whom all kick ass. And despite whatever reasoning lucas would hold... it's just old corriography and gay sabers they had to use at the time. I can't see past that.
This whole obi-wan not training on tatooine concept.. all he CAN do on tatooine is train. Focus his skills. That's what he goes to tatooine to do. Learn from qui-gon, hone his skills.. prepair to kick the emporers ass. He doesn't know when lukes gonna be ready. Plus he's always looking out for luke... sandpeople?
I don't think obi just sat around his jedi pad playing his x-box, checking the clock every 10 minutes.
Plus, sure.. luke got a crash course. Jedi learn from the force too though don't they 😉.. What happened between episode 5 and 6? He's the son of skywalker for petes sake.. little anikan was making c-3pos and racing pods before his balls dropped!
The force runs stong, in my family... but I was adopted...
(deleted scene)
Originally posted by ubidoobascooby
What happened between episode 5 and 6? He's the son of skywalker for petes sake.. little anikan was making c-3pos and racing pods before his balls dropped!
Well, obviously Luke was the same then, we just didn't get to see it. Luke was a mechanic himself, and also a great pilot ("I used to bullseye womprats back home...."😉 and then the fact he could jump straight into an X-Wing and pilot one with the skill of the great Anakin Skywalker himself shows a lot about Luke's talent.
It's obvious Luke knew there was something more to his life, he was always trying to realise his potential but his Uncle wouldn't have it.
I mean, why didn't Obi-Wan keep Luke with him and train him? Because he had already failed and knew that Luke needed to turn Anakin, rather than overpower him. That'll be the reason why Luke is given to Beru and Owen, to live a normal life, a non-Jedi life, and teach the boy about attachments, rather than, like they did with his father, discourage it.
Luke had to live that normal life to become the man he was - both Obi-Wan and Yoda realise that Qui-Gons philosophy was right, trust your feelings, feel, don't think.
Luke is the first Jedi that actually gets it all right, because Qui-Gon fully understood the will of the force and taught those who could pass it on to Luke. Luke gets a different kind of training as a result of Qui-Gons findings, and therefore, Luke becomes the first "perfect" Jedi.
what we dont see is that Luke was on Degobah alot longer than what we perceived. He wasnt there for just a week or so. He basically went through the jedi trials, or at least what Yoda could muster up on that planet. But i stand firm that Luke vs Vader on Bespin is the best fight. Maybe not the most visually captivating, but the best. I think that Ani vs OB1 will the be the best as far as choreography and stunnig, jaw-dropping moves. Again thats just IMHO.
Originally posted by Red Superfly
Well, obviously Luke was the same then...and also a great pilot ("I used to bullseye womprats back home...."😉 and then the fact he could jump straight into an X-Wing and pilot one with the skill of the great Anakin Skywalker himself shows a lot about Luke's talent.I mean, why didn't Obi-Wan keep Luke with him and train him? Because he had already failed and knew that Luke needed to turn Anakin, rather than overpower him. That'll be the reason why Luke is given to Beru and Owen, to live a normal life, a non-Jedi life, and teach the boy about attachments
I like the concept of handing him over to owen and beru to recieve "feeling training".
Asking what happened between 5 and 6 was a retorical question 😉 Sort of emphesizing that he was training from the force in that time. Which, even if unofficial starwars material doesn't count, I assume that's what luke would be doing.
What I'M talking about is the fact that the coriography is the only let down. Story good... coriography bad.
Here's the other thing. If luke was trained to confront vader, not kill him, then why did yoda and obi not reveal that he's anikan. They tought him to fight because they wanted to kill vader.. they didn't know he could be turned.
"once you start down the dark path... forever will it dominate your destiny."
"I can't kill my father." "then the emporer has already won.. you were our last hope."
and luke = perfect jedi? Lucas's own perspective is that lukes training is incomplete, and that he learned from 2 ancient jedi so.. not his exact words but "luke wasn't too great".
Originally posted by ubidoobascooby
Well Blender, I like u're rational... And I've used it myself alot.But when episode 1 and 2 came out. I look at qui-gon, dooku and now the emporer after his mutilation whom all kick ass. And despite whatever reasoning lucas would hold... it's just old corriography and gay sabers they had to use at the time. I can't see past that.
This whole obi-wan not training on tatooine concept.. all he CAN do on tatooine is train. Focus his skills. That's what he goes to tatooine to do. Learn from qui-gon, hone his skills.. prepair to kick the emporers ass. He doesn't know when lukes gonna be ready. Plus he's always looking out for luke... sandpeople?
I don't think obi just sat around his jedi pad playing his x-box, checking the clock every 10 minutes.Plus, sure.. luke got a crash course. Jedi learn from the force too though don't they 😉.. What happened between episode 5 and 6? He's the son of skywalker for petes sake.. little anikan was making c-3pos and racing pods before his balls dropped!
The force runs stong, in my family... but I was adopted...
(deleted scene)
Of course you are right! I just want to keep things up for myself! 😉
But one thing: I don´t think that Obi trained. I think he stopped using the force to stay undetected by Vader and The Emperor. He just watched.
A sentence you can interprete to that is "I WAS once a Jedi Knight same as your father."
My opinion is not so because of that sentence but Obi staying quiet makes sense to me. And it explains why he stayed undiscovered by the Empire... 😎
Originally posted by Darth Blender
Of course you are right! I just want to keep things up for myself! 😉
But one thing: I don´t think that Obi trained. I think he stopped using the force to stay undetected by Vader and The Emperor. He just watched.
A sentence you can interprete to that is "I WAS once a Jedi Knight same as your father."
My opinion is not so because of that sentence but Obi staying quiet makes sense to me. And it explains why he stayed undiscovered by the Empire... 😎
😉 totally true. I'm just waiting for episode 3 to see if it gets contradicted. Alot of what I said in the obi training circumstanse is based on ep 3. I always took his past tense sentance as "back in the day when the jedi were around, I was one." I mean.. He can't say.. I'm a jedi knight like your father.. 😕 In lukes time no one knows much about the jedi. Their only heard of as sort of ancient myths. Hence the past tense.
But good point 🙂
Originally posted by ubidoobascoobyand luke = perfect jedi? Lucas's own perspective is that lukes training is incomplete, and that he learned from 2 ancient jedi so.. not his exact words but "luke wasn't too great".
I meant in a spiritual sense. Luke recieves the best sort of training, because he gets trained AFTER Qui Gon reveals that he was right.
Remember, Qui Gons methods were unorthodox, he didn't get on the council because the Jedi thought he was reckless - but Qui Gon was right all along. Once Ben and Yoda learn the truth, they train Luke accordingly. This will be made clearer after Episode III.
Therefore, Luke is the perfect Jedi. He gets trained based on FACT, not on what the Jedi believed - unlike Anakin. This again demonstrates Obi-Wan and Yodas failure with Anakin. He kept his feelings locked up, and in the end he exploded.
Originally posted by Red Superfly
I meant in a spiritual sense. Luke recieves the best sort of training, because he gets trained AFTER Qui Gon reveals that he was right.Remember, Qui Gons methods were unorthodox, he didn't get on the council because the Jedi thought he was reckless - but Qui Gon was right all along. Once Ben and Yoda learn the truth, they train Luke accordingly. This will be made clearer after Episode III.
Therefore, Luke is the perfect Jedi. He gets trained based on FACT, not on what the Jedi believed - unlike Anakin. This again demonstrates Obi-Wan and Yodas failure with Anakin. He kept his feelings locked up, and in the end he exploded.
You got the point exept one thing: Luke wasn´t the perfect Jedi at the end of ROTJ but he is going to be. The new Jedi Order he founded had different well, rules. No one was forced into something because of fear.
They could be as they wanted to. Families, friends, etc ...
And in some way the Old Jedi Order had it´s strong rules because of fear. The Jedi were afraid of the darkness. So much that they had forbidden everything that could awake some kind of emotion. Which is our greatest possesion. Well I got off topic again, 😉
but think about it! 👆
Originally posted by brendy
i think that this film will be over-dualed. so to speak. i mean how will the characters be developed when all they do is fight.
The characters are already known and established! EP I & EP II only prepared and led for/to this movie. Everything was pointed on this film. Even Qiu-Gonn. He will become one of the most important characters in the entire saga! You will see! 😉