Love is Forbidden...so..........

Originally posted by Darth Koroni
So if George Lucas wrote an EU book would that be non-canonical also? It not your decision as to what happens in the Star Wars universe, if Lucas allows the EU to exist, this means he accepts it as part of the timeline and plot of the galaxy, and nothing you post can change that.

IF George wrote a book it would'nt be considered EU. And acceptance of EU is not like an official mark. He just felt obligated because of the fans. Much like if you post a thread here and its accepted that does'nt make it an 'official' thread. You get my drift?l

The Jedi were falling apart starting at TPM. Their teachings were too strict and less concerned for well being. The Jedi do not encourage love because too much emotional attachment leads to dark side symptoms. But this is not true in all people. If you were strong enough in your mind you could pretty much not follow the jedi code at all and be a good Jedi.(Luke did, was too old, loved, was exposed to great emotion like Obi-Wan and his uncle and aunt's deaths, and never even learned the jedi code for that matter)QGJ was very wise to not obey the code ver bat-um because he knew of its restrictions that were not helpful to someone like Anakin. Luke loved, Anakin loved, Obi-Wan loved, Leia loved, but only Anakin didn't have control over his feelings or his brain for that matter if Palp could get in his head that easily. If the Jedi code had not forbid his love he may have not turned because he would've been able to ask the Jedi council for help and they would've told him Palpatine's story was a load of crap. So the short story is QGJ was smart to be a maverick, the jedi needed to change their teachings and got killed, remaining jedi realized their faults, trained a new jedi with not much constraint, he helped bring peace to the galaxy, teachings change. If you can control your emotions then having attachments and such is fine and the dark side will be struck down at your feet. If anyone here has played through K0T0R then Jolee Bindo is a perfect example of what Jedi should be like and what Luke and the new jedi are like after ROTJ, his philosophies are perfect.

Originally posted by PVS
yoda: the force runs strong in your family...pass on what you have learned

aka find apprentices, not necessarily have children 😉

Originally posted by Eleonora
aka find apprentices, not necessarily have children 😉

but yoda said it in the same breath as "the force runs strong in your family" the two sentences were directly connected. im willing to accept that he was talking about training leia, but those 2 sentences were most certainly connected.

im bumping this thread to see what any newbies think...or perhaps if any old timers have any fresh thoughts on the topic.

dont like it? sue me.

i will restate: i do not think that parenthood is necessarily some unhealthy attatchment which leads to the darkside. i firmly believe that the end of rotj alludes to 2 things:

1-han and leia will marry
2-leia will become a jedi

my belief (and i know im digging beneath the plot for this) is that
the old order was structured as a minimal risk environment. in other
words, jedi were allowed to love, but not on a personal "i love you" kind of
why, but in a way in which they are far removed from society and view everyone with a sort of compassion, but no true one on one connection.

i think it was this lack of connection with society that enabled palps to take over. i believe it was this detachment that prevented them from being able to save anakin, or rather to help anakin save himself.

sure everyone in SW was responsible for their own destiny, but it just seemed to me that the jedi were powerless to see the obvious. in their strict code to prevent the little disasters, they blinded themselves to the world outside their temple and allowed the biggest disaster of all to occur unchecked(but mace fought palps!!!111!!!) yeah, because ANAKIN told him the truth...a failed jedi told the jedi master the truth (but yoda fought palps!!!111) yeah, at the last minute when all the jedi were dead...good job yoda, but the red flags were there all along.

Yet George Lucas is still clear about how it is very genuine that a Jedi must not have attachment and so on that basis, marriage for Leia is impossible.

I also still entirely reject that the Jedi's rules had anything to do with why they lost. GL keeps talking them up- obviously they were important. I cannot actually see how they in absolutely any way or form at all contributed to their defeat.

I also think commentary like that is taking advantage of our situation as viewers and not seeing how things were for the Jedi.

I also note that someone earlier in this thread questions my point that GL makes it clear that Qui-Gon is a reckless man.

Well, here is the quote:

"I think it is obvious that Qui-Gon was wrong in Episode 1 and made a dangerous decision..."

So I think that settles that one. GL goes onto say that QGJ was ultimately correct in his instincts, of course, but he was still taking a very rckless and dangerous decision.

Originally posted by Ushgarak
Yet George Lucas is still clear about how it is very genuine that a Jedi must not have attachment and so on that basis, marriage for Leia is impossible.

Originally posted by Ushgarak

I also still entirely reject that the Jedi's rules had anything to do with why they lost. GL keeps talking them up- obviously they were important. I cannot actually see how they in absolutely any way or form at all contributed to their defeat.

i think their rules lead to detatchment of an unhealthy kind. instead of being above worldy things, they became oblivious.

yoda declared that the jedi were "blind" and mace declared that their ability to use the force had deminished. it was all too easy to pull the wool over their eyes because they were detatched from society...reality in a sense. they did not even consider that a sith lord would attempt to work his way up the political ladder, and could very well be sitting in front of them, smiling and chatting with them. they never considered that the sith could still exist. even after quigon was attacked on tattooine, getting them to accept that the sith had returned was like pulling teeth. its as if they expected everything to just "work out" so long as they stuck to the rules and followed their protocol.

they refused to accept that anakin was not entirely a jedi, and thus needed special attention...by attention i mean simply PAYING attention. instead, they simply passed the buck to poor obiwan and turned their backs. yoda watched luke his whole life as he "looked away into the future...etc", but anakin got married and knocked his wife up and yoda never knew, because he wasnt paying attention. seems like after ep3 he learned his lesson.

Originally posted by Ushgarak
I also think commentary like that is taking advantage of our situation as viewers and not seeing how things were for the Jedi.

not sure i understand where your coming from, as your own commentary on han/leia takes advantage of our situation as viewers since we never get to see what becomes of han and leia...although the story concludes with the two of them in love.

Originally posted by Ushgarak
I also note that someone earlier in this thread questions my point that GL makes it clear that Qui-Gon is a reckless man.

Well, here is the quote:

"I think it is obvious that Qui-Gon was wrong in Episode 1 and made a dangerous decision..."

So I think that settles that one. GL goes onto say that QGJ was ultimately correct in his instincts, of course, but he was still taking a very rckless and dangerous decision.

but thats a vague quote. i wish i could pick GL's brain, but thats all we have to work with....so...

it settles nothing. you just agreed that his instincts were correct. isnt it safe to then assume that mace/yoda's instincts were incorrect? after all, palps would have taken over regardless. remember, he set up his "meeting" with mace using anakin as bait. in a different circumstance he would have had a different plan of attack. perhaps simply by having mace murdered by clones like the rest of them, who knows. its just clear that palps had a plan way before anakin was even a zygote.

the point i'm making is that quigon may have indeed been reckless, and may have made the right choice for the absolute wrong reason (reckless abandon)
but none the less, as you said, it was the right choice in the end, and i would dare say the only right choice.