ROTJ Luke Skywalker vs. ROTS Serra Keto

You're right about that Fishy; but in ROTJ, Luke is almost as emotionally volatile as Anakin/ He goes into those random fits. He controls them, but still allows the Force to flow through him and power his strikes. Good counter though. 🙂

According to GL, who out ranks the movies, Luke soundly defeated Vader in ep6. That alone makes him WAY more powerful than Serra.

Well if what GL says contradicts the movies, then I don't know what to make of it. Towards the end of the duel, as is visible, Luke absolutely destroys Vader, and it is obvious that throughout the duel, before his initial loss of control at the duel's end, that he is holding back against his father

It doesnt contradict the movie. He wastes Vader during the movie. Its in the commentary.

Ah, yes. I don't know what that was. But anyway, I think that gives Luke some credit; he defeated a Sith. I know all the details about why and how (I heard most of them from people on this forum), but I'd say that that is rather significant for his age and experience.

luke wud do really well at the begining but with keto having the cin dralling training and 2 light sabers she wud end up winning

Cin Drallig's legendary training makes her legendary in no sense. His great training is what helped her fight Darth Vader so well; seeing her getting strangled by his left, organic hand while he slew her master with his other really showed me her legendary skill. Now, Luke is no Anakin, but I don't know if Cin Drallig's training can save her here.

Luke has Yoda's training. Yoda could beat the SH!T out od Cin!

How did this reach 6 pages? This isnt even a contest luke wins easily.

Originally posted by Fishy
1.) Obviously he wouldn't have, Obi Wan didn't do it. He just told Luke to go to Yoda. Its probably harder to do then they thought was possible. And Yoda would surely have liked to train Luke more. He just knew he couldn't.

2.) Its not impressive and it does not show any mastery of the technique.

3.) What would you call the droids in AOTC, or in ROTS. Plenty of droids there. They just don't focus on much more then the Jedi because the droids are not important in the least, to weak just like the clones.

4.) Lifting a rock and throwing it is not quicker then quickly moving your hand or finger. And the chance of succes is lower. Luke couldn't do it, thats why he didn't do it. And if he could it sure as hell wasn't an instinct. Using the force would be like a second nature to Serra not to Luke, obviously.

5.) Okay.

6.) He did not read Vader his mind, he did not know what he was thinking he could just feel his conflict and drew conclusions from that. He never read anybody else his mind in ROTJ for as far as we know.

7.) I know he wasn't lying, he was still wrong though.

1) there's nothing to even suggest that.

4) he had to destroy it, not press a button. You never see someone destroying a machine with just the Force. Why not throw a rock guided with the Force instead?

6) Okay, so when does Obi from AOTC for instance read minds? Not often because he doesn't need to. You're just guessing when you say he can't read minds, just emotions. He only needed to do it once, so even if he was lying, then it still doesn't mean he can't do it.

I'm saying Luke's powers are shown just as good as AOTC Obi's. Obviously not the lightsaber technique, but we know why. Obi doesn't read minds yet you think he can do it. He barely used telekinesis yet you think it's stronger than Luke's. I will admit his blaster deflection is better, but he also uses form 3 whereas Luke uses Form 5 and fought organic beings which are tougher.

Luke uses all his powers including Mind trick, Force choke, telekinesis, Force jump, mind read (He specifically says thoughts and there is nothing official to contradict it), just as well as what Obi does in AOTC and Luke has Force choke unlike Obi.

Luke is resourceful, clever, and he defeated Darth Vader with ease. Again, look at how long he resisted the Emperor's two handed lightning compared to Anakin resisting Dooku's (weaker) one handed lightning for less time.

Oh and Janus: Of course I still like you, disagreeing is what this whole forum's about anyway.

1.) Except for spirits becoming weaker over time, its not like real life. And they only showed up at a few times. There has to be a reason for that.

2.) Glad you agree.

3.) Glad you agree.

4.) If he had to destroy it I could be mistaken I thought he just pressed the close the door button.

5.) Okay.

6.) Vader ia a powerful Sith Lord right. Its harder to read the minds of those with a strong mind. Obviously Luke was not skilled like some of the greatest Jedi and he could not do it. Either Vader was so conflicted that his thoughts just showed to everybody except for Palpatine. Or Luke didn't read his mind, its a simple conclusion to draw

Luke is just not powerful enough yet to read the mind of somebody like Vader.

And again, see the difference between what Dooku does in AOTC and Sidious and Rots. Dooku put more effort into it and threw him away.

You have to give Luke credit. He was trusted to defeat Vader and bring down the Emperor who Yoda couldn't defeat.

I give him credit, I think he did a great job. Better then anybody else weaker then both of them could have ever hoped to do. Something that was impossible for most others to do. However defeating somebody does not make you all powerful, not if you defeat them like Luke did. He did great really, but it does not show to me that he is suddenly more powerful then the Jedi that came before him that actually had some good training.

The fact is that after the fall of the Empire Luke had to go through a lot more then any other Jedi. Dark Jedi, Vongs, and whatnots.

Any other? Or most? With most I agree, he had to go through a lot but are we talking about that? No we are not. So why bring it up what does it have to do with this?

Oh come on, Dooku isn't trying to kill Anakin, he just simply one handed blasts him and does throw him against the wall. but he really doesn't throw him hard, and even when Anakin fell off of a speeding speeder, he got right back up. Now when Anakin was hit by lightning, it took a minute or more for him to get back up.

Luke on the other hand, took lightning from the Emperor (who probably got weaker in 19 years) who was using both hands. Luke took probably a minute of lightning or more whereas Anakin took about 3 seconds. Sure the Emperor would talk a bit, but each of those blasts was longer than Anakin's. Luke could still speak even. Then the Emperor says "Now young Skywalker, you will die." and increases his blast's power trying to kill him. Luke takes it for a good 15 seconds or so before Vader killed the Emperor. Luke gets right up, and goes to his father. In the next scene we see he has already dragged his father's body (which would be kinda heavy) all the way to a shuttle.

^^^ Yeah you have to give him credit for that.

Originally posted by Emperor Revan
Oh come on, Dooku isn't trying to kill Anakin, he just simply one handed blasts him and does throw him against the wall. but he really doesn't throw him hard, and even when Anakin fell off of a speeding speeder, he got right back up. Now when Anakin was hit by lightning, it took a minute or more for him to get back up.

Luke on the other hand, took lightning from the Emperor (who probably got weaker in 19 years) who was using both hands. Luke took probably a minute of lightning or more whereas Anakin took about 3 seconds. Sure the Emperor would talk a bit, but each of those blasts was longer than Anakin's. Luke could still speak even. Then the Emperor says "Now young Skywalker, you will die." and increases his blast's power trying to kill him. Luke takes it for a good 15 seconds or so before Vader killed the Emperor. Luke gets right up, and goes to his father. In the next scene we see he has already dragged his father's body (which would be kinda heavy) all the way to a shuttle.

Yoda didn't get weaker and Luke was taking more lighting. I'm pretty sure you don't get weaker in the force through time.