Solid Snake Vs Spiderman

Originally posted by Deus Ex
Again, this -has- been matched up in the What If series by Marvel already, over ten years ago. In a straight up beat em up, Spidey would probably beat Solid Snake, easily even. Punisher, if he can get a jump on the guy, and Grey Fox? Not likely. Spider man has had trouble with the Green Goblin, who is a weak Halloween reject on a floating sled with pumpkins. But I disgress. Anyways, in a scenario situation, where Snake is stalking Spidey or vice versa (Something other than them just being in a boxing ring) this could go very close. For example, Punisher used Spidey's spider sense against him, making a dummy of Doc Oc and loading it with explosives, rigging it to blow when the super hero got close enough to notice it was a fake.

That was a What If, by the way. If I remember correctly, Hulk broke Thor's Mjlonir. You know, that unbreakable hammer. So, it's not really anything to base any evidence off of.

...Wouldn't you imagine that his spider sense was going off because of the explosives? I bet he was also worried about any innocents that may be in trouble due to the explosion as well.

And do you really think that Snake has both the time and resources in this fight do something anywhere remotely close to that?

Green Goblin? Weak? If anything, he's either on par or stronger than Spidey. That was another thing (besides his crafty plans) that made him so dangerous. He was almost on par with Spidey in physical ways as well, which made him a difficult opponent to beat.

Snake would get decimated trying to fight Green Goblin.

And this stalking thing. Come on, dude. It's Spiderman. Spider sense and all. I don't care how could he is, Snake can't bypass precog.

Ah, you replied. Nice.

That was a What If, by the way. If I remember correctly, Hulk broke Thor's Mjlonir. You know, that unbreakable hammer. So, it's not really anything to base any evidence off of.

True, but a bit besides the point. When it comes to ridiculous concepts like indestructible adamantium or Thor's hammer, I take the hands off approach. Scientifically it's not possible and you can't argue cross series things like this unless you have a common basis for it. Marvel "law" doesn't cut it. Anyways, the Punisher successfully killed Spiderman, true to his style. He watched, studied, and then acted out a plan. Sure, in a straight fight he'd probably die horribly. But why make a thread like that? Boring. And not worth twenty-four pages. Thing is, Punisher's What-If kill is very believable, and worth considering.

...Wouldn't you imagine that his spider sense was going off because of the explosives? I bet he was also worried about any innocents that may be in trouble due to the explosion as well.

No, this was very obvious. Spider man saw from a distance Doc Oc. His spider sense told him -something- was wrong, but not what. COuld have been Punisher across the way with the detonator, could have been the explosives. Point being, he didn't know what it was that was dangerous until too late. His spider sense is fallible and a possible weakness.

And do you really think that Snake has both the time and resources in this fight do something anywhere remotely close to that?

Depends on the scenario, of course. I won't argue Snake can beat Spiderman on even ground in plain sight. But in certain scenarios, he could. Snake has defeated deadlier opponents on less than favorable ground. You do him no credit to say otherwise.

Green Goblin? Weak? If anything, he's either on par or stronger than Spidey. That was another thing (besides his crafty plans) that made him so dangerous. He was almost on par with Spidey in physical ways as well, which made him a difficult opponent to beat.

Green Goblin -is- weak in the Marvel universe. And he's not the only one who schooled Spidey a couple of times. Cardiac was another. Possibly more I'm forgetting. Anyways, Green Goblin was a lunatic and was sick, dying even, and was still able to give Spiderman the fits. Strength doesn't always equate victory, obviously. If it did, Hulk could pwn anything.

Snake would get decimated trying to fight Green Goblin.

I doubt this, unless Snake was armed with a combat knife and a box. And if you're going to do that, the thread isn't worth the text it's made up of.

And this stalking thing. Come on, dude. It's Spiderman. Spider sense and all. I don't care how could he is, Snake can't bypass precog.

I already argued this point. Spiderman's precog is very fallible, and hasn't stopped him from having problems with multiple enemies over the course of almost thirty years. Most of the enemies, I might add, would be virtually destroyed by rather simple Marvel characters like U.S. Agent or Black Knight.

Originally posted by Deus Ex
Ah, you replied. Nice.

[B]That was a What If, by the way. If I remember correctly, Hulk broke Thor's Mjlonir. You know, that unbreakable hammer. So, it's not really anything to base any evidence off of.

True, but a bit besides the point. When it comes to ridiculous concepts like indestructible adamantium or Thor's hammer, I take the hands off approach. Scientifically it's not possible and you can't argue cross series things like this unless you have a common basis for it. Marvel "law" doesn't cut it. Anyways, the Punisher successfully killed Spiderman, true to his style. He watched, studied, and then acted out a plan. Sure, in a straight fight he'd probably die horribly. But why make a thread like that? Boring. And not worth twenty-four pages. Thing is, Punisher's What-If kill is very believable, and worth considering.

...Wouldn't you imagine that his spider sense was going off because of the explosives? I bet he was also worried about any innocents that may be in trouble due to the explosion as well.

No, this was very obvious. Spider man saw from a distance Doc Oc. His spider sense told him -something- was wrong, but not what. COuld have been Punisher across the way with the detonator, could have been the explosives. Point being, he didn't know what it was that was dangerous until too late. His spider sense is fallible and a possible weakness.

And do you really think that Snake has both the time and resources in this fight do something anywhere remotely close to that?

Depends on the scenario, of course. I won't argue Snake can beat Spiderman on even ground in plain sight. But in certain scenarios, he could. Snake has defeated deadlier opponents on less than favorable ground. You do him no credit to say otherwise.

Green Goblin? Weak? If anything, he's either on par or stronger than Spidey. That was another thing (besides his crafty plans) that made him so dangerous. He was almost on par with Spidey in physical ways as well, which made him a difficult opponent to beat.

Green Goblin -is- weak in the Marvel universe. And he's not the only one who schooled Spidey a couple of times. Cardiac was another. Possibly more I'm forgetting. Anyways, Green Goblin was a lunatic and was sick, dying even, and was still able to give Spiderman the fits. Strength doesn't always equate victory, obviously. If it did, Hulk could pwn anything.

Snake would get decimated trying to fight Green Goblin.

I doubt this, unless Snake was armed with a combat knife and a box. And if you're going to do that, the thread isn't worth the text it's made up of.

And this stalking thing. Come on, dude. It's Spiderman. Spider sense and all. I don't care how could he is, Snake can't bypass precog.

I already argued this point. Spiderman's precog is very fallible, and hasn't stopped him from having problems with multiple enemies over the course of almost thirty years. Most of the enemies, I might add, would be virtually destroyed by rather simple Marvel characters like U.S. Agent or Black Knight. [/B]

How do you reckon that Punisher killed certain others? Like the Thing for example? Mr. Fantastic? Wolverine? Actually, bad example, cuz I believe he can die, too. Jean? Cyclops? Xavier? Colossus? Captain America? Black Panther? Iron Man? Hulk? Juggernaut?

I mean, he did take on all of Marvel, right?

That's what I'm trying to say. That comic was written so he would win. You know, I hope at least, that Frank has no way of killing some of these characters.

And I do give Snake credit where it's deserved. I've seen the enemies he's beaten and it was quite impressive, definitely. Just that I don't think that he has what it takes to beat someone who has basically all of those skills of all those enemies in one. Precog and then the agility, strength, speed, reflexes, etc. (Psycho Mantis and Cyber Ninja for example).

I'm sorry if I wrote that wrong, but I didn't mean that Green Goblin was just as strong as him. I mean to say that in almost all the physical-type areas, GG is almost on par with Spidey. And he's no slouch in the intelligence department either. He knows how to fight. And how to strategize.

And onto the Spider sense again, eh? Seems this is a never-ending debate. Tell me. If his Spider sense didn't tell him what was about to hit him, when it's going to hit him, and where it's going to hit...then how did he pull this off?

Facing the other way, mind you.

How do you reckon that Punisher killed certain others? Like the Thing for example? Mr. Fantastic? Wolverine? Actually, bad example, cuz I believe he can die, too. Jean? Cyclops? Xavier? Colossus? Captain America? Black Panther? Iron Man? Hulk? Juggernaut?

I'm not getting this. Where did this come from exactly?

I mean, he did take on all of Marvel, right?

Where?

That's what I'm trying to say. That comic was written so he would win. You know, I hope at least, that Frank has no way of killing some of these characters.

Realistically, Frank probably couldn't kill most of the names mentioned. But Spiderman he can. And saying the comic was written so he would win is a bit flimsy and doesn't do much but undermine the idea that Punisher very well -can- defeat Spiderman and very easily too.

And I do give Snake credit where it's deserved. I've seen the enemies he's beaten and it was quite impressive, definitely. Just that I don't think that he has what it takes to beat someone who has basically all of those skills of all those enemies in one. Precog and then the agility, strength, speed, reflexes, etc. (Psycho Mantis and Cyber Ninja for example).

For being a complete mortal with no real super abilities, his accomplishments are incredible. Again, in something other than an out and out ring battle, Snake has a chance.

I'm sorry if I wrote that wrong, but I didn't mean that Green Goblin was just as strong as him. I mean to say that in almost all the physical-type areas, GG is almost on par with Spidey. And he's no slouch in the intelligence department either. He knows how to fight. And how to strategize.

He does. But he was also mentally unstable and in the final comic where he died, he was sweating profusely and unable to focus... and he whupped Spidey's ass. And he's a bit of a wuss in the big scheme of things. If Spiderman whupped Juggernaut and Magneto, I might change my tune. But the Goblin? Pfft.

And onto the Spider sense again, eh? Seems this is a never-ending debate. Tell me. If his Spider sense didn't tell him what was about to hit him, when it's going to hit him, and where it's going to hit...then how did he pull this off?

Obviously, the sense is instinctual. It -is- a supposed animal sense (Which is ridiculous, but still... let's play along) But in the scenario with the Punisher, instincts didn't tell Spiderman that there was a dummy with a bomb on it. So it -is- fallible. Point. It is not infallible, which is usually the concensus with Spiderman fans.

I'm not getting this. Where did this come from exactly?

Where?

I assumed you were referring to the What If "The Punisher kills everyone in Marvel" comic. If you weren't my apologies.

Realistically, Frank probably couldn't kill most of the names mentioned. But Spiderman he can. And saying the comic was written so he would win is a bit flimsy and doesn't do much but undermine the idea that Punisher very well -can- defeat Spiderman and very easily too.

If I undermined Punisher, it was not my intention. I have great respect for him and believe him capable of taking out many, many superpowered opponents.

For being a complete mortal with no real super abilities, his accomplishments are incredible. Again, in something other than an out and out ring battle, Snake has a chance.

From what I'm told repeatedly by TwisterGameX, Snake has many enhanced human abilities actually.

He does. But he was also mentally unstable and in the final comic where he died, he was sweating profusely and unable to focus... and he whupped Spidey's ass. And he's a bit of a wuss in the big scheme of things. If Spiderman whupped Juggernaut and Magneto, I might change my tune. But the Goblin? Pfft.

Spiderman has "defeated" Juggernaut, just not beat him in a straight fight. So, I do somewhat agree with you here. Still shouldn't downplay GG's abilities. He gave Spidey a run for his money because he was quite similar in terms of physical abilities and was dastardly as hell.

Obviously, the sense is instinctual. It -is- a supposed animal sense (Which is ridiculous, but still... let's play along) But in the scenario with the Punisher, instincts didn't tell Spiderman that there was a dummy with a bomb on it. So it -is- fallible. Point. It is not infallible, which is usually the concensus with Spiderman fans.

I am not so narrow-minded that I won't admit that it can be fallible at times. But he has also fought enemies using solely his spider sense. He didn't make a conscious decision at all, and his Spider sense allowed him to know where the attack was coming from, or he would've never dodged them.

I forget her name, but there was this character that was very much like Spiderman (this around the time of Spider Girl in her purple outfit) that had hypnotizing abilities if you made any sort of eye contact. Keeping his head turned the entire fight with her, Spidey relied solely on his Spider sense and was dodging ever attack and beating her down at the same time.

So yes, it has been shown to be fallible. But it has also been shown to be 100% dependable as well.

It's really hard to debate such an idea, since there is so much evidence against the Spider sense as there is for it.

I assumed you were referring to the What If "The Punisher kills everyone in Marvel" comic. If you weren't my apologies.

No problem. Thought it might be something like that. No, I do draw the line at Ridiculous.

If I undermined Punisher, it was not my intention. I have great respect for him and believe him capable of taking out many, many superpowered opponents.

Don't forget the attitude. But yes, Punisher is good. I meant you were trying to undermine the argument that he -could- take out Spidey. If you weren't, then I was off base. No big deal.

From what I'm told repeatedly by TwisterGameX, Snake has many enhanced human abilities actually.

It's entirely possible. I haven't played any games past MGS II, but even if he does have a few abilities, they don't compare to Spiderman's, really. This would be easier to go over if either of us knew better.

Spiderman has "defeated" Juggernaut, just not beat him in a straight fight. So, I do somewhat agree with you here. Still shouldn't downplay GG's abilities. He gave Spidey a run for his money because he was quite similar in terms of physical abilities and was dastardly as hell.

True, and there was friend-enemy confliction. I was a little surprised they knocked him off. But then they jumped right on the ball with Carnage.

I am not so narrow-minded that I won't admit that it can be fallible at times. But he has also fought enemies using solely his spider sense. He didn't make a conscious decision at all, and his Spider sense allowed him to know where the attack was coming from, or he would've never dodged them.

No, I didn't mean you specifically. You strike me as knowing quite a bit and being able to use it too. But I was trying to get at the idea that Spiderman's greatest advantage can work as a disadvantage too. I can't think of any instances besides the Punisher what-if, but it has put him in danger before. And don't forget Spiderman's moral inflexibility. If Snake strapped TNT to a nun and set her loose, Spiderman would be compelled to save her.

I forget her name, but there was this character that was very much like Spiderman (this around the time of Spider Girl in her purple outfit) that had hypnotizing abilities if you made any sort of eye contact. Keeping his head turned the entire fight with her, Spidey relied solely on his Spider sense and was dodging ever attack and beating her down at the same time.

I don't doubt it. But this is a straight fight scenario, right? I'm more or less arguing in a less than straight fight. I'll admit that Snake would get served in, say, a boxing ring or a flat open plain with minimal weaponry, but in a nice intriguing little battle scenario (Say, Snake versus Spiderman in a populated, busy bazaar district, etc.) This would be much closer. And Spiderman's spidersense isn't clairvoyance so much as it is an instinctual reflex at times.

So yes, it has been shown to be fallible. But it has also been shown to be 100% dependable as well.

Knowing comics, there's probably an exception to this, like some bizarre rock nullifies it or something. lol... Just noting.

It's really hard to debate such an idea, since there is so much evidence against the Spider sense as there is for it.

True.

Originally posted by Deus Ex
[B]
I assumed you were referring to the What If "The Punisher kills everyone in Marvel" comic. If you weren't my apologies.

No problem. Thought it might be something like that. No, I do draw the line at Ridiculous.

If I undermined Punisher, it was not my intention. I have great respect for him and believe him capable of taking out many, many superpowered opponents.

Don't forget the attitude. But yes, Punisher is good. I meant you were trying to undermine the argument that he -could- take out Spidey. If you weren't, then I was off base. No big deal.

From what I'm told repeatedly by TwisterGameX, Snake has many enhanced human abilities actually.

It's entirely possible. I haven't played any games past MGS II, but even if he does have a few abilities, they don't compare to Spiderman's, really. This would be easier to go over if either of us knew better.

Spiderman has "defeated" Juggernaut, just not beat him in a straight fight. So, I do somewhat agree with you here. Still shouldn't downplay GG's abilities. He gave Spidey a run for his money because he was quite similar in terms of physical abilities and was dastardly as hell.

True, and there was friend-enemy confliction. I was a little surprised they knocked him off. But then they jumped right on the ball with Carnage.

I am not so narrow-minded that I won't admit that it can be fallible at times. But he has also fought enemies using solely his spider sense. He didn't make a conscious decision at all, and his Spider sense allowed him to know where the attack was coming from, or he would've never dodged them.

No, I didn't mean you specifically. You strike me as knowing quite a bit and being able to use it too. But I was trying to get at the idea that Spiderman's greatest advantage can work as a disadvantage too. I can't think of any instances besides the Punisher what-if, but it has put him in danger before. And don't forget Spiderman's moral inflexibility. If Snake strapped TNT to a nun and set her loose, Spiderman would be compelled to save her.

I forget her name, but there was this character that was very much like Spiderman (this around the time of Spider Girl in her purple outfit) that had hypnotizing abilities if you made any sort of eye contact. Keeping his head turned the entire fight with her, Spidey relied solely on his Spider sense and was dodging ever attack and beating her down at the same time.

I don't doubt it. But this is a straight fight scenario, right? I'm more or less arguing in a less than straight fight. I'll admit that Snake would get served in, say, a boxing ring or a flat open plain with minimal weaponry, but in a nice intriguing little battle scenario (Say, Snake versus Spiderman in a populated, busy bazaar district, etc.) This would be much closer. And Spiderman's spidersense isn't clairvoyance so much as it is an instinctual reflex at times.

So yes, it has been shown to be fallible. But it has also been shown to be 100% dependable as well.

Knowing comics, there's probably an exception to this, like some bizarre rock nullifies it or something. lol... Just noting.

It's really hard to debate such an idea, since there is so much evidence against the Spider sense as there is for it.

True. [/B]

I just have to say that I laughed pretty hard at the thought of a nun strapped with TNT. That was the clencher of my night.

Especially if this is a random fight with just these two. Like if Snake just pulled her out of his pocket, TNT already strapped to her. That would be priceless.

And I agree that normally this would get in the way. Though, through the great and wonderful rules of KMC, this is a bloodlust fight. Spidey has no moral inflexibilities to get anywhere near his way in this fight.

Basically, as hard as it is to say, he would let the nun blow up.

Heh. Sorry, funny again.

Even if this fight were to take place in a crowded area, and say Snake was attempting to snipe Spidey, still wouldn't work. There have been numerous times when his Spider sense has gone off a second before the trigger is pulled from a sniper rifle, allowing him to dodge it in the knick of time. To me, that's quite impressive. Especially because the danger originates very far from him, yet he is still able to react in time.

So really, this fight would pretty much have to end in close quarters. Or at least medium quarters.

Man, and I haven't even brought up Spidey's webbing once yet. If Spidey uses it (which if he didn't it would bring the entire world crashing down on everyone) and even barely tags Snake (which I'm being generous about), then he can still yank him around and basically knock him out that way. He can, and always has been shown to, web up Snake's guns as well, rendering them useless. Or he could just wrap him up, and then there is nothing Snake could do.

I'm just saying.

Besides. A crab beat Snake. http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/239227

I, too, draw the line at Ridiculous. 😛

lmao!

Gotcha!

Alright, it would take very specialized conditions, probably requiring many forenights of planning on Snake's part (And maybe the Punisher's diary from an alternate dimension, an extradimensional pocket, a willing nun, and some anti-web solution)

But it COULD happen man! It could!

Originally posted by Deus Ex
lmao!

Gotcha!

Alright, it would take very specialized conditions, probably requiring many forenights of planning on Snake's part (And maybe the Punisher's diary from an alternate dimension, an extradimensional pocket, a willing nun, and some anti-web solution)

But it COULD happen man! It could!

Haha...okay, okay. It could very well happen. That's some freakin extensive planning though. That's beyond Batman prep even.

Batman would never in a million years deduce the one weakness of Spiderman: TNT-strapped Nuns.

CRAB BATTLE!

hang on... Deus Ex

now your arguing that with prep time he snake could win.... thats not in the conditions....

most people could beat others with prep-time.....

I could beat batman with prep time!!

enough of it...

Originally posted by Hit_and_Miss
hang on... Deus Ex

now your arguing that with prep time he snake could win.... thats not in the conditions....

most people could beat others with prep-time.....

No, I wasn't. I was making sure the other party knew that the possiblity for winning existed with prep time, but I thought better of it. Read, don't skim, and you'll notice that.

Originally posted by Deus Ex
lmao!

Gotcha!

Alright, it would take very specialized conditions, probably requiring many forenights of planning on Snake's part (And maybe the Punisher's diary from an alternate dimension, an extradimensional pocket, a willing nun, and some anti-web solution)

But it COULD happen man! It could!

If you two didn't catch the dripping sarcasm in this post, I don't know how else to reach you.

so your just arguing for the sake of it now.... trying to point out that the only win is a prep time only comfirms I don't need to read... Just skim...

No...he means he is on your side hit, and was being sarcastic, about him winning, so xx looks bad, and turn it into a joke...well thats how I translated it.

Originally posted by Deus Ex
When it comes to ridiculous concepts like indestructible adamantium or Thor's hammer, I take the hands off approach. Scientifically it's not possible

ADamantium is not actually indestructable. Sym the demon for one thing snapped the substance like a twig. . .

Originally posted by Creshosk
Thor's hammer is made out of uru. . a magically enchnced material.

ADamantium is not actually indestructable. Sym the demon for one thing snapped the substance like a twig. . .

Can't say I recall that. Not calling you a liar in the slighest though. When did that happen? And in what issue? The adamantium snapping, I mean.

Well, the point is that when you cross over series, that always equals out to being invincible (Such as people arguing that lightsabers can't distort adamantium despite that fact that Magneto crumpled it up like tin foil) because you either want to try and find a common ground or you just pick a side and start spouting things.

At least, that's what I see a lot of.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Can't say I recall that. Not calling you a liar in the slighest though. When did that happen? And in what issue? The adamantium snapping, I mean.

Most of them were dead, Ecept for Nightcrawler who was a major pervert, and storm who had magical powers.

Colossus was a corpse on the wall and had his chest caved in. Wolverine was a skeleton (still intact) and when Belasco summons Sym, he walks over and snaps a claw off like it was nothing and then uses it as a toothpick.

Originally posted by Creshosk
It was when Illyana first became a teenager, when Belasco lured her away into limbo, the x-men followed after her. And they encountered alternate future X-Men in Belasco's limbo.

Most of them were dead, Ecept for Nightcrawler who was a major pervert, and storm who had magical powers.

Colossus was a corpse on the wall and had his chest caved in. Wolverine was a skeleton (still intact) and when Belasco summons Sym, he walks over and snaps a claw off like it was nothing and then uses it as a toothpick.

Huh. I was not aware of this.

I wish you would post this story for the rest of the Comic vs. people. So they don't die believing that adamantium is unbreakable.