Lord Urizen. Hi. May I interrupt for one minute? *smiles*
Uh, I am most interesting in asking you a few questions if you don't mind. Try not to get too defensive when I tell you that I am a Christian here BUT I am having this very debate on another board about whether people are born gay or not. I myself believe that most (not all) gays or lesbians are born with the desire. That they cannot help their feelings. So could you tell me just a little bit about how old you were when you realized it? Did you try to stop it? If so, how? If you are not comfortable doing that then I will most certainly understand. *smiles*
Marcu
Originally posted by marcu
Lord Urizen. Hi. May I interrupt for one minute? *smiles*Uh, I am most interesting in asking you a few questions if you don't mind. Try not to get too defensive when I tell you that I am a Christian here BUT I am having this very debate on another board about whether people are born gay or not. I myself believe that most (not all) gays or lesbians are born with the desire. That they cannot help their feelings. So could you tell me just a little bit about how old you were when you realized it? Did you try to stop it? If so, how? If you are not comfortable doing that then I will most certainly understand. *smiles*
Marcu
Marcu, I'd certainly be happy to answer you're question. Which thread would you like me to answer, on this one or another thread ?
Originally posted by ADarksideJedi
I will if you stop with the insulting.I am going to bed but will be back.jm
Done...
Don't rush, actually I'd prefer if you'd take your time with a response, because the more thought goes into your response, the better it will be.
I would really appreciate if you dissected my previous argument by every point I made, and counter it as best you can. Give me a challenge, not a reason to disregard a debate all together.
Thanks
(oh, and sorry for the insults, but in this topic I tend to get touchy since so many people are poorly misinformed on this topic)
Marcu....
This may be a long post...I apologize If it sounds wordy and too long, but I will try to organize my information as best as possible...Here it goes:
When I was very young, between age 10-11, I seriously thought that everyone was bisexual, because I was...now keep in mind, I didn't even know there was a word bisexual. I didn't even know what "straight" or "gay" meant. All I knew was that I thought both men and women were attractive.
Now this part may seem graphic, but please excuse it...I am just going to say as much as possible, because it may give you better insight into the mentality behind someone who is not "straight". Around Age 10 I never had any romantic feelings for other boys...I had a huge crush on this girl named Anna, but it wasn't a sexual type attraction...it was more like a "gushy mushy" feeling, like i thought she was beautiful, she was my best freind, i thought she was a great person, etc.
At age 10, I did masturbate over the thought of naked girls...but I also masturbated over the thought of naked guys. It felt good to think about both, not just one or the other. I thought it was normal....over time, I learned what the words "gay" and "straight" meant. I also learned that being "straight" was the accepted way to be, and being "gay" was "wrong"...i learned how hated Gay people were, and how disgusting everyone thought it was.
I felt horrible....I was taught that the way I was was screwed up...i seriously beleived there was something wrong with me.
Now, i went to Catholic School at this time. It was 6th grade, and I was taught how "homosexuality" was a sin, and how it is a choice that "God disapproves of". So I figured....if homosexuality is a choice, then I can choose to be straight. I figured If I wanted to be straight, i would just "stop being gay"...
Now the problem was, how do I acheive that? I never had sex with a guy at this age, nor did I ahve sex with a girl yet either at this age....so how could i stop "being gay" when i never did anything that was gay ?
I came to the conclusion that EVERYONE was attracted to both men and women, but that you CHOOSE ONE GENDER to stick with....you choose one gender to pay attention to, and you REJECT the other...
So i was like "okay....i am going to be straight...i will ignore men, and only pay attention to women"
Now....this didn't work lol.....From age 12-14 i only dated girls, but whenver i masturbated, i still thought of guys...i couldn't help it. It felt better, i was much more aroused by the thought of guys then the thought of girls...i didnt know why.
I thought I was going to Hell.....i used to feel miserable at this time, not just because of my sexuality, but for other reasons. All of this made me have very little self esteem.
Between age 14-15, I had sex with a woman (a grown woman) and I enjoyed it very much...she said "she'd turn me straight" sort of as a joke...i told her i liked guys too, because i trusted her.
She was a gorgeous woman, but somehow that didn't "cure" anything...i still liked guys. But I kept it a secret...
As I got older, i faced more negative stigma about homosexuality....I pretended I was straight, always condeming gay people, saying how "disgusting" gay people were, even though I was the SAME as them. ME and my freinds would always talk shit about gay people, as if being gay was the worst thing to be...
Now, you may ask..how did you know you were bisexual though? Well....the simple fact that every time i masturbated, the thought of guys worked much better than the thought of girls, not only for me to feel orgasm, but for me to feel emotionally happy.
I didn't have sex with another guy until age 17....I loved it. Did i stop liking girls? NO...but this somehow felt different....so refreshing, so fulfilling, so much fun....that guy and I never really clicked though, so no relationship occured..but the encounter was one i never forget.
Ever since, I have experimented with both sexes, and enjoyed almost every experience.
I took me until age 18 to realize that there was nothing wrong with me....i wasn't hurting anybody, i didn't catch any STD's, I wasn't hurting myself, none of that bullshit....I finally began to develop my self esteem.
At age 19, was when I started telling everybody that i was "bisexual"...i didnt learn that term until age 16, and finally realized that that is what I am....i do like girls, but i like guys better..i am not straight or gay, im both...
It was scary telling people, and many people cut of me off because of my sexuality...a lot of "close" freinds stopped talking to me. But my REAL freinds stuck around, and still hang with me until today.
This description is as simple as I could make it....There's so much more to my story, but i cannot fit it in one post...I am hoping this was enough....feel free to ask me any more questions if you wish.
LU, that is quite an interesting thing for me to read. Thank you for sharing that. Must not always be easy to rehash everything. I do have a few questions of you don't mind. If they are too hard to answer or you just simply don't want to answer, I will respect that.
How was your upbringing up until the age of 10? Was it happy? ANy tramatic things happen? I ask this because some say that your upbringing or abuse and such can cause this to happen to people. I am not saying that I agree with this. I am just curious as to your view point. I am sure that some abused boys or girls do end up gay/lesbian if they had a tramatic childhood.
Again, I will understand if that is too private. Or a simple yes/no would do as well.
marcu
Originally posted by marcu
LU, that is quite an interesting thing for me to read. Thank you for sharing that. Must not always be easy to rehash everything. I do have a few questions of you don't mind. If they are too hard to answer or you just simply don't want to answer, I will respect that.How was your upbringing up until the age of 10? Was it happy? ANy tramatic things happen? I ask this because some say that your upbringing or abuse and such can cause this to happen to people. I am not saying that I agree with this. I am just curious as to your view point. I am sure that some abused boys or girls do end up gay/lesbian if they had a tramatic childhood.
Again, I will understand if that is too private. Or a simple yes/no would do as well.
marcu
I was pretty happy..but no where as happy as I am now. However, my father did beat my mother around this time...but i do not see how that would make me "gay" or "bisexual"
By thoery, wouldn't seeing my mom get beat up, make me HATE men ? Not get horny over them ?
Also, I was always teased for being skinny and dark, etc. But, again i do not see how that would alter my sexuality in any way...again if it did, it would make me dislike men, not like them.
The theory that homosexuals are spawned from abuse is bullshit, since the majority of people who were abused as children happen to be straight. There are many homosexuals and bisexuals who had happy childhoods, and many heterosexuals who had horrible childhoods.
Thank you LU. I appreciate your posting. I really do. ANd yes, I agree that physical abuse by the hands of a man would make a boy dislike rather than love men. I am sure that at some time I will have another question for you, If you don't mind that is. I appreciate it. I don't personally know any gays or lesbians so I can't find answers very easily.
marcu