Only Noobaris would use a sock to bump a 2 year old thread.
On topic, The GE wins hands down. The Executor could take Revan's entire fleet by itelf, and the rest of the GE's 25,000 ISD's, thousands of smaller capital ships, millions of fighters, and handful of superweapons would make the rest easy pickin's.
Revan's ships are too much out of date and this has been bothering me a for a while. How can Revan have an "infinite" fleet. I mean sure he could have an infinite number of ships but that wont do no good if you don't have the manpower to operate them. Plus they would run out of fighter pilots faster than the empire. I would say the real greatest challenge would be the Vong still.
Originally posted by MutantMessiah
The Star Forge would also provide a potentially unlimited amount of droid pilots though, no?
I don't think they were droid pilots. There is no mention of them being droids anywhere.
http://www.starwars.com/databank/starship/sithfighter/
Little concern appears to have been given to the to the comfort of the Sith fighter pilot, and only the most essential subsystems were included A droid doesn't need comfort like humans and if they were droid pilots I think the databank would have said so instead of calling them fighter pilots.
It's really not too difficult of a battle. The Ultimate Visual Guide confirms that Palpatine's seizure of power preceded the largest and greatest build up of military hardware in galactic history; I would recommend reading some of Domus Publica's literature on the Imperial Navy's statistics (with documented material from the cited sourcebooks) or Glentract's debates on the issue. Furthermore, one should really take into account the superweapons that the Empire has at its disposal; the Death Stars I and II are enough to destroy a planet a piece, capable of hyperdrive. The Galaxy Gun just needs coordinates and it can shoot a planet-destroying-missile-of-doom at any given target. The Tarkin (see: Death Star). Eclipse I and II are both the most powerful naval vessels in galactic history, vastly outmassing and outgunning a Super Star Destroyer - able to obliterate planetary shields and sear continents. The World Devastaters themselves would be a match for the Star Forge; for every piece of raw material consumed, the station rearms itself. It's virtually indestructable (only the Master Control Signal would shut it down). And, lastly, the Emperor's own Force Storm can consume any of the opposition's fleet.
No one and nothing compares.
I don't understand why people are saying the Empire would definitely win. Militarily speaking, yes, they have the greatest army by far, but if the Rebels figured out a way to stop the Empire's reign, together it would be easier. It's not as if the Empire knows its opponents from head to toe, you know. They also have to find out about their weaknesses and strengths, what's effective and what's not against them, their weapons, advantages, disadvantages, etc... If the Rebels alone were able to think out a masterplan to blow up the Empire's greatest weapon, adding the others would widen the tactical and military intelligence to choose from.
The Empire is not anywere near invincible. It has weaknesses that can be exploited, as seen in the movies, and I find no reason why these combined fleets wouldn't do the same.
Edit: Which Sidious is in command of the Empire? OT Sids, ROTS Sidos, DE Sids?
Originally posted by 0°Mandalore°0
I don't understand why people are saying the Empire would definitely win.
I expected better than this.
Militarily speaking, yes, they have the greatest army by far, but if the Rebels figured out a way to stop the Empire's reign, together it would be easier.
Your diatribe is brimming with faulty logic and flawed conclusions. First, let me make it explicitly clear that the Alliance to Restore the Republic did not "stop the Empire's reign" directly. One can credit them with that victory only if we agree that it was indirect and idealogical in nature. The true death to the Empire was brought about by sheer warlordism following Emperor Palpatine's demise at the Battle of Endor (which the Rebellion was responsible for). The Grand Admirals, Grand Moffs, and other naval personnel began to divide the fleets and armies since the Emperor was no longer around to maintain his iron grip over all of the Imperial State's agencies and organizations. Furthermore, when reckless fools like Admiral Daala came along, the Empire's resources were further drained. In no way did the New Republic ever truly best a unified Empire; they relied on hit-and-run tactics. Palpatine's subsequent resurrection six years was enough to send the Republic spinning away to its own near-destruction. Palpatine reconquered the galaxy in roughly a year's time. The Yuuzhan Vong fiasco is further testament to the fact that the New Republic was woefully undermilitarized and equipped.
It's not as if the Empire knows its opponents from head to toe, you know. They also have to find out about their weaknesses and strengths, what's effective and what's not against them, their weapons, advantages, disadvantages, etc...
You make it sound as though each of these factions possess special weaknesses; some version of kryptonite. It's not so. Their weaknesses aren't exactly unnoticeable. They are smaller, weaker, and equipped with inferior technology.
If the Rebels alone were able to think out a masterplan to blow up the Empire's greatest weapon, adding the others would widen the tactical and military intelligence to choose from.
The Rebellion was able to exploit a fatal flaw in the superstructure of the Death Star, true. But, once again, you can credit Moff Tarkin's practical (though, in retrospect, highly arrogant) decision to not unleash the full might of the Death Star's complement fighters and escorts on the surgical strike force. Tarkin is as just responsible for the Death Star's destruction as Luke is.
The Empire is not anywere near invincible. It has weaknesses that can be exploited, as seen in the movies, and I find no reason why these combined fleets wouldn't do the same.
The Empire is, militarily speaking, the closest to invincible that Star Wars has. The other factions possess a plethora of weaknesses. I could just as easily point out that Palpatine would logically be aware of both Darth Revan's pitiful empire and the Republic's armies and be able to deal with them accordingly.
Edit: Which Sidious is in command of the Empire? OT Sids, ROTS Sidos, DE Sids?
No idea.
Originally posted by Gideon
I expected better than this.
Doesn't surprise me. Someone as good as you should always expect better from others.
"Your diatribe is brimming with faulty logic and flawed conclusions. First, let me make it explicitly clear that the Alliance to Restore the Republic did not "stop the Empire's reign" directly. One can credit them with that victory only if we agree that it was indirect and idealogical in nature. The true death to the Empire was brought about by sheer warlordism following Emperor Palpatine's demise at the Battle of Endor (which the Rebellion was responsible for). The Grand Admirals, Grand Moffs, and other naval personnel began to divide the fleets and armies since the Emperor was no longer around to maintain his iron grip over all of the Imperial State's agencies and organizations. Furthermore, when reckless fools like Admiral Daala came along, the Empire's resources were further drained. In no way did the New Republic ever truly best a unified Empire; they relied on hit-and-run tactics. Palpatine's subsequent resurrection six years was enough to send the Republic spinning away to its own near-destruction. Palpatine reconquered the galaxy in roughly a year's time. The Yuuzhan Vong fiasco is further testament to the fact that the New Republic was woefully undermilitarized and equipped."
Fair enough, you've made your point. I won't argue.
"You make it sound as though each of these factions possess special weaknesses; some version of kryptonite. It's not so. Their weaknesses aren't exactly unnoticeable. They are smaller, weaker, and equipped with inferior technology."
I didn't quite mean superficial weaknesses, but I guess they're enough.
"The Rebellion was able to exploit a fatal flaw in the superstructure of the Death Star, true. But, once again, you can credit Moff Tarkin's practical (though, in retrospect, highly arrogant) decision to not unleash the full might of the Death Star's complement fighters and escorts on the surgical strike force. Tarkin is as just responsible for the Death Star's destruction as Luke is."
Yes, I guess you can count on that. But, do you think that if the 'combined fleets' discover the fatal flaw and blow up the Death Star, the Empire would still take on them? I do believe so, but it will make things a little bit less difficult.
"The Empire is, militarily speaking, the closest to invincible that Star Wars has. The other factions possess a plethora of weaknesses. I could just as easily point out that Palpatine would logically be aware of both Darth Revan's pitiful empire and the Republic's armies and be able to deal with them accordingly."
Yes, I exaggerated on the 'nowere near invincible', true. But still: they are not invincible. That's what I tried to point out.
A breakdown of the Empire's pwning of these guys...
ROTS Republic: Death Star + Star Destroyers ravage the Republic fleet, and while the Senate and Jedi are whining about it the Galaxy Gun blows up their worlds.
ROTJ Rebels: Two ways in one battle they could die: Thrawn finds a tactical weakness and kills them all or Palps' Force Storm destroys them all (wonder why he didn't use that at Endor...)
CIS: Death Star/Galaxy Gun blow up droid-building worlds. Stormtroopers, Vader, Emperor's Hands destroy rest of droids. No contest.
Revan's Sith: The Star Forge cannot move and is located always above the Rakata system's sun. It cannot move from there and the Sith Navy stays with it and protects it. Note the fact that it is above a star. Now that you know that, I say two words: Sun Crusher.
Rest of the Imperial Fleet destroys the survivors, and we're done with a clear Empire victory!
To really make such a battle feasible, the only appropriate situation would be take the full military power of each faction and set the battle up in some remote empty piece of space. Logically, speaking, if we literally meant take the whole faction itself, we're gonna be dealing with like 3 Coruscants, and duplicate people.
Squaring off:
A technologically advanced Imperial Fleet of a generalized 25 000 ISDs, a Death Star, two Executors, and an uncountable host of support ships
vs.
Technologically inferior everyone in the form of an unknown sized, yet doubtless smaller host of Revan's Fleet; the numerically-challenged Rebel Fleet; the entirely droid and Neimodian-operated (and thus lacking in nerve, resolve or creativity) CIS Fleet; and the much, much smaller version of the Empire in the shape of the Republic.
In a scenario such as this, it comes down to numbers and technological advancement, something the Empire holds in abundance. They suffer moderate to possibly even heavy losses, yet still trump the rest of the players.
There's a reason Poland was defeated the way it was, kinda the same idea as this.