Posted by ((The Anomaly)) LOL! No, common, I'm very anxious to hear how you think Dooku would even stand a remote change against Yoda. Really, I really wanna hear this one...lol
Ok then. Dooku could beat Yoda because his lightsaber style is better in two ways. Firstly, it is made for lightsaber vs lightsaber combat and secondly, it uses minimum energy. While in the short term Yodas style is extremely effective he will tire himself out pretty quickly. This is shown in AOTC after his duel with Dooku. He is panting like a dog and they were only fighting for about thirty seconds. If Dooku manages to hold Yoda off long enough to get him tired then Yoda is finished. Plus Dooku has a pretty vast knowledge of both sides of the force. While Yoda is extremely good and maybe even the best in the knowledge of the force, his force abilities (apart from push) arent used for combat. Dooku could Force lightning Yoda any time during the duel and finish him off (remember Dooku only duels with one hand so his other can be used for force attacks). So overall it would be an extremely close and spectacular match but the Count would pick up the victory.
Posted by ((The Anomaly)) Dooku is a better swordsman eh? How? I have seen no proof to say that he is better. At the very least, he and Windu are equal, not just in saber skill, but in force power too. While Dooku has more knowledge then Windu, there is nothing to say that he is more powerful. All he really has over Mace is Sith Lightning, and thats a moot point because if Windu can stop Sidious's full lightning at point blank then he could stop any lightning attack Dooku could throw at him.
Can you honestly say that the cocky bastard Windu could beat the great Count Dooku. You must be dreaming. Most of the same factors would apply as what I said about Yodas duel, but then remember that Mace is not as good as Yoda so the Count would win. Mace managed to block Sidious lightning because Sids was on the ground with no lightsaber out. If he had fired the lightning at Mace during the duel I think Mace would have got fried or stabbed by Sidious while trying to block the lightning. Im not saying that Mace is a bad fighter but I dont think he would be able to pick up a victory against the Count.
My comments are probably going to cause a whole heap of discussion and arguing but oh well. 😄
Originally posted by ((The_Anomaly))
LOL! thats why I think your funny, there's no way Dooku could beat Yoda, not a chance in hell. Thats such blatant fanboyism its ludicrous.And Dooku was going all out in the ROTS fight, Lucas said he lost to Anakin fair and square on the ROTS DVD commentary.
Sorry, Dooku is not the best of the PT Jedi/ Sith, hes up in the top 5, but not near the best. That goes to Yoda with Palpatine right behind him and Mace RIGHT behind Palpatine. Then Anakin and Dooku are pretty well tied for the next spot, but overall I'd give it to Dooku just because he has more experience. But Anakin is more agile, stronger and faster then Dooku is, plus he has far more raw Force power. But Dooku's knowledge is what Anakin does not have.
Never the less, Dooku is good, no doubts, but he's not THAT good.
Overall Mace, Anakin and Dooku are pretty even in most respects. At least in terms of Saber combat. Anakin is the weakest in terms of force knowledge but the strongest in terms of raw force power. So its hard to place the 3.
Overall Power (Saber skill, Force power)
1. Yoda
2. Sidious
3. Mace/ Dooku (tied)
4. Anakin
5. Obi-WanSaber Skill
1. Yoda
2. Mace/ Dooku (tied)
3.Anakin/ Sidious (tied)
4. Obi-WanForce knowedge
1. Yoda
2. Sidious
3. Dooku
4. Mace
5. AnakinRaw Force power
1. Anakin
2. Yoda
3. Sidious
4. Mace/ Dooku (tied)
5. Obi-WanThats how I'd order it all.
Good rankings, but you should have Anakin higher in Overall Power.
He can't be below Dooku in terms of "Overall Power" since it combines saber skills and Raw Force, since it is he who defeats Dooku in III.
🙂
Originally posted by Rampant oxPfft,you must be joking.Mace DID beat Sids fair and square,and Sids is more powerful than the Count,again,all of this is said from GL,in this case,what GL says is what is true.Dooku is not 'all powerful' as you claim,and yes,he DID go all out in the lightsaber duel against Anakin,again,as said by GL,and Anakin beat him,fair and square.
Can you honestly say that the cocky bastard Windu could beat the great Count Dooku. You must be dreaming. Most of the same factors would apply as what I said about Yodas duel, but then remember that Mace is not as good as Yoda so the Count would win. Mace managed to block Sidious lightning because Sids was on the ground with no lightsaber out. If he had fired the lightning at Mace during the duel I think Mace would have got fried or stabbed by Sidious while trying to block the lightning. Im not saying that Mace is a bad fighter but I dont think he would be able to pick up a victory against the Count.My comments are probably going to cause a whole heap of discussion and arguing but oh well. 😄
Let me ask you something,did you even bother to researh anything to support your claims?Or did you just tell us your opinion.
If I had to be good, I'd be Obi-Wan. Nothing beats hanging out at Mos Eisley Cantina! I'd also love to pwn those alien thugs who think they're "tough".
Being the Galactic Empire and the most powerful man in the galaxy would be the greatest, though.
And as far as I'm concerned, Palpatine staged his defeat. Nothing George Lucas claims concretely states otherwise.
Originally posted by Mysterious Man
Pfft,you must be joking.Mace DID beat Sids fair and square,and Sids is more powerful than the Count,again,all of this is said from GL,in this case,what GL says is what is true.Dooku is not 'all powerful' as you claim,and yes,he DID go all out in the lightsaber duel against Anakin,again,as said by GL,and Anakin beat him,fair and square.Let me ask you something,did you even bother to researh anything to support your claims?Or did you just tell us your opinion.
What you are presenting is an A>B>C argument and those are shitty. If that is the best argument you can come up with then dont both arguing at all. Sidious lightsaber style is completely differnt to Dookus. Mace won that fight because he went all out and overwhelmed Sids. If he tried that against Dooku, Dooku would block his attacks and wait for him to tire out. Then its merely a matter for him to go in for the killing blow. Im not saying that Mace is a bad fighter and he did win fair and square against Sidious but I dont think he could pick up a victory against Dooku.
And yes what George Lucas says is true, so in theory Dooku was going all out against Anakin in ROTS but that is a load of crap to me. But you can clearly see in the film that Dooku had the upper hand right up until the end and spent most of the duel provoking Anakin instead of finishing him off. So either George Lucas doesnt know what he is talking about or he cant direct lightsaber duels properly.
Nevertheless,what GL says is TRUE,your own opinion doesn't matter.And Dooku would be overwelmed by Mace,it doesn't matter what you think or what form he is using,Mace has brought down more powerful foes than Dooku,he would overwelm Dooku just as he did Sids,again,Sids is more powerful than Dooku,and remember,Dooku is old and most likely would tire quickly just like he did against Anakin(from the novel),and also, GL said Palpy was the most powerful Sith of that time,if Mace can overwelm him,than Dooku would be much easier to take down.Again,you are using your opinions as facts.
These are the facts:
-Dookus age is irrelevant. Dookus age makes no difference to his fighting abilities or performance.
-Dooku wouldnt tire quickly because his fighting style uses minimum energy. It would be more likely that Mace would tire first.
-You are going back to the A>B>C argument which means nothing.It makes no difference if Sids is the most powerful sith or not. Maces fight with Sidious doesnt effect Maces fight with Dooku at all.
Dooku spent his whole life mastering his lightsaber style. This style is used for lightsaber vs lightsaber combat. Yes Mace has mastered his respective style but in a fight it means nothing vs Dooku.
Dooku's age is RELEVANT,it says in the novel that he was tiring quickly from Anakin,and Anakin isn't even as strong as Mace at that time.And even so,his style still requires energy,if Dooku was younger,then yes,he would win,if he was tiring under Anakin's assaults that early in the duel,then what chance does he have against Mace?He may have mastered the style,but age catches on quickly.Mace would tire yes,but not that early like Dooku would,an age is everything,you can master a form and be 80 years old but still tire easily since you're old and not like you were when you were younger.And it does make a difference if Sids was the most powerful,if Sids can be beaten by him(and Sids is the most powerful at that time),what chance do you think Dooku has?And Mace's assualts aren't countered lightly, or as easily as you say.no matter what form Dooku is using,in the novel(during the near-ending of the duel),Sids was having a hard time defending himself against Mace,again,Dooku is not the most powerful,Sids is.And I really don't care if I'm giving you A-B-C facts,atleast they're facts and not an opinion,like yours are.And you haven't even listed ONE reference material as to where you are getting this info from.Show me some proof to back up your claims,like I did mine.
Im not saying that Sids isnt the most powerful sith lord at the time, because he was and did get pwned by Mace. Mace is probably the best duelist in the order - bested only by Yoda. That means nothing. This information could have been taken after Dooku left. When Dooku went into hiding he was being trained by Sidious and you yourself say Sids is the most powerful sith of the time. Dooku learnt the dark side of the force then and learnt how to use his anger in a fight. This is forbidden for Mace to do which gives Dooku the upperhand. I will change what I said before and say that age is relevant but not by much. You could go out for a 20 mile run and be tired by the 2nd mile but still be able to keep going. The only way Mace would win by tiring out Dooku would be if he killed him in the first couple of minutes. Any time after that and Mace would be tiring out himself. And hopefully we can both agree that Dooku is skilled enough to keep Mace off for more than a couple of minutes.
It now comes down to a duel by to men, both of whom are tiring out. One of them is influenced by the dark side which gives him bonus skills and uses a lightsaber style which is made for lightsaber vs lightsaber duelling. It also uses minimal energy.
The other fighter is the top (possibly second) fighter in the jedi order. He uses a style that uses a fair amount of energy and doesnt have knowledge of the dark side.
With all these factors in play I think Dooku has the advantage. As good of a fighter as Mace is Dooku would outclass him but only just. Dooku would win maybe 55-60% of the time.
Originally posted by Rampant oxYes in the anger department,he also knows Darkside powers,and says so in Shatterpoint,the only time we see him use Darkside power is Force Crush in Clone Wars on Grevious,probably the most dangerous Dark power,next to Force Lightning, there is.
Apologies but I havent read it. Does Mace use dark side abilities like choke/lightning. And does he use his anger in a duel??
OK then this significantly changes the outcome of the duel. With Mace having knowledge of the darkside and think that the duel could go either way but only if he decided to use the darkside moves.If he doesnt use them I would say Dooku wins 55-60% of the time. If Mace does use dark side abilities it would be a 50/50 battle.