The Battle Bar, Our Wretched Hive of Scum and Villainy

Hey guys, lets talk about Incest! 😱

Since theres nothing else really going on I'm creating a topic to amuse us till we give up and just drift apart. Here's the handy link that got me thinking on the subject to get you thinking on it too. As well as 3 stances on the subject: 1, 2 and 3.

Opinions? I know Dr.McB's got one. Personally I'm leaning towards no1, but I can see cases in which a parent could pressure a son/daughter into a relationship, but one partner emotionally blackmailing another isn't exclusive to Incest, so I'm still leaning towards 1.

Note: Pedophillia is always wrong and isn't the same thing, so leave it out.

I also like this guys post, so I'm pointing it out now:

Originally posted by velvet-prosthesis

Definitively #1. I’m all up for adult consensual relationships and am truly disgusted by still prevailing XIX century social prejudices. I say let them be happy, and mind your ****ing business.

Though there’s a lot to be revealed about the taboos in the whole incest taboo…

Taboo #1: Incest is not “normal”.
That would be the theory of imprinting, first developed by the anthropologist Edvard Westermarck. The fact that we grew up in the same house as our family hinders us for feeling sexual attraction for each other. Anthropologists say this occurs in order to favor Exogamy and overall human expansion, since the Genetic Sexual Attraction theory already proved that similar genes cater for mutual attraction.

The Genetic Sexual Attraction theory reveals that indeed we are naturally attracted to those who are similar to us, but co-habituation (and further social taboos regarding cousins) prevent us from develop sexual desires for our siblings (and parents, I guess, though not as relevant since the age gap also plays a role in the sexual attraction). Even though recent, it’s the only theory that explains why there were many cases of siblings separated during childhood that fell in love with each other in adulthood, after so many anthropologists arguing that the “Incest Taboo” was nature’s way of defending against bad genes (talk about asspull theories).

Incest in Nature occurs. Especially within the animal communities whose socio-interaction resembles to us: chimps. Where homosexuality also occurs as well. It’s also not uncommon in the feline community (though in this case homosexuality is not common).

Taboo #2: Inbreeding leads to defective babies.
This whole thing that inbreeding necessarily leads to babies with six fingers and brain tumors started in America, in the 50’s, by a religious jurist that concluded that after studying birds.

(I’m not kidding. Why people still believe and perpetuate this nonsense is beyond me.)

The explanation that inbreeding might pose a probability of congenital diseases in your offspring lies on the needing diversity of the pol gene, whereas similar genes may strengthen defective genes. Somehow many biologists fail to mention that similar genes also strengthen good genes and way too diverse genes pose an equal probability of causing miscarriages and defective babies. A recent Swedish study (I think?) concluded that the most successful pregnancies are between cousins of third degree (which is still technically incest. Last time I was told incest goes till fourth degree).
Truthfully, whenever an incest couple is notice the media will try dig into their sons’ medical reports and link every possible disease to the inbreeding, like the German couple’s son who had epilepsy, and consequently some news reports refer to his condition as a “mental disease possibly caused by inbreeding”. Now incest causes epilepsy

The most recent British study on inbreeding families (Pakistanis incestuous couples, specifically), whose results were confirmed by the National Society of Genetic Counselors, revealed that the risk of birth defect increases only about 3-4% (between cousins) to 4-7% (between close kin). They even admit, it’s considerably lower than what they expected.
Just so you get the picture, it’s the same probability of a +40 year old mother giving birth to a child with Down's Syndrome (and still, 75% of children with Down's Syndrome are born from couples younger than 30). For this and many other reasons I find the penalization of Incest rather pathetic and biased. Which leads to point #3.

Taboo #3: Incest is wrong.
Pure and simple dogmatic reasoning, what else do you need? Incest is listed as a sinful act in the Book of Levictus, and sibling incest is forbidden in almost every active religion today.

the problem with incest is the genetic defects that come about from having kids. incest isnt just a private social matter like race or homosexuality because it has future repercussions.

id pick #3 honestly. i guess the only exception would be same sex relationships since they cant breed.

Velvet-prosthesis' post goes quite a way to dispelling the concept that incest always results in genetic defects. A 4-7% increased chance over regular couples is tiny if I understand it correctly.

Incest is one of those things where you don't need religion to tell you it's wrong. Unfortunately, in the world of secularism or one absent of religion, you'll always have that idiot crying "relativism!"

What if we mumble it? Would that help?

Originally posted by Nephthys
What if we mumble it? Would that help?

No, I'll still make fun of your inability to understand the world we live in.

'Rebilitibism.'

Come on lets hear some arguments against. Unless you're scared I'll whip your ass again.

Originally posted by Nephthys
'Rebilitibism.'

Come on lets hear some arguments against. Unless you're scared I'll whip your ass again.

Seeing as how you've never been able to even get on my level, instead electing to pretty much "strawman" your way onto temporary ignore, I don't know if I'm inclined to continue "Debating" with a simpleton. Also, no idea what Rebilitibism is.

WTF?

Seeing as how you've never been able to even get on my level, instead electing to pretty much "strawman" your way onto temporary ignore, I don't know if I'm inclined to continue "Debating" with a simpleton. Also, no idea what Rebilitibism is.

I was mumbling, you fool!

On a strictly moral scale, I'm with #1. Minors excluded, what anyone does in the bedroom is their own business.

On a strictly scientific scale, I'm with #3. It's gonna create problems for any unfortunate offspring.

On a strictly tolerable scale, I'm with #3. It's Ewww.

I just fired a gun for the first time in my life today.

It was ****ing awesome.

*waits for the gun aficionados to start talking about how much they know about guns*

Originally posted by Lucius
I just fired a gun for the first time in my life today.

It was ****ing awesome.

Aren't you the liberal arts college type that would hate the idea of firearms?

I am okay with incest between two consenting adults. What happens between two adults in their own bedroom is there own business. The government should have NOTHING to do with it. I'm okay with homosexuality for the exact same reason.

Its none of the government's business. I've really never been given a reason why incest is wrong and homosexuality is okay, except "They may have kids" But just make having KIDS illegal instead of the actual sex. Sex is none of the government's business.

Originally posted by Dr McBeefington
Aren't you the liberal arts college type that would hate the idea of firearms?

Originally posted by truejedi
I am okay with incest between two consenting adults. What happens between two adults in their own bedroom is there own business. The government should have NOTHING to do with it. I'm okay with homosexuality for the exact same reason.

Its none of the government's business. I've really never been given a reason why incest is wrong and homosexuality is okay, except "They may have kids" But just make having KIDS illegal instead of the actual sex. Sex is none of the government's business.

You wouldn't believe the gay right's activists who get violently angry at me when I try to equate the two, and join the two causes together though... You would think they would want to work together for equality like blacks and women did in the 50's... Instead they seem to get angry when I equate Incest with Homosexuality. I just don't understand it. Its pretty much the same cause.

Originally posted by truejedi
You wouldn't believe the gay right's activists who get violently angry at me when I try to equate the two, and join the two causes together though... You would think they would want to work together for equality like blacks and women did in the 50's... Instead they seem to get angry when I equate Incest with Homosexuality. I just don't understand it. Its pretty much the same cause.

There's a reason why incest in America is committed by the lower class and it has nothing to do with the "government".

By the lower class only? You must have missed the deep south where they try to keep the South's leading families "Pure".