Really, I don't see any double meanings other than the "I thought I knew you" bit that they do. It seemed like she told the story to Will mainly for his benefit, let him know what he was up against. I agree on most of your theories, and maybe Jack did take his crew there partly to scare the shit out of Will and get rid of him later, but I think the main part was to show Tia his black spot. I don't know.
No it wasnt to scare Will... it was to get the location of the flying dutchman so that he could shove Will on it whist he persues the chest and Liz..who he has an inlking to see...It's Just like he tried to remove Will earlier when he escaped after hearing Liz was in danger..
Tia says to him along the lines of: "the compass I gave you cant show you the chest?" Jack says no and then a wave of realisation comes over her face: "AHHHH jack sparrow does not know what he WANTS..or maybe he DO but loath to claim it for his own" meaning he knows by this point he kinda wants Liz but cant figure out how win her over on his own..so Tia helps him secretly with that AND the more obvious Davy/Black spot issue..
I dont actually know if he knew Tia was helping him with the Liz issue though. I think she might have been helping him without telling him, ...Its just the fact that she says what the problem is out loud to him and he barley raises an eyebrow that makes me think he secretly went there to get the answer to the liz problem aswell as the davy problem..
At Tia's cabin she doesn't come out and name Liz so that's why some people might be confused on this...what she says (you have to read between the lines) is "What the compass you bartered for me cannot help you find this?" and Jack says, "Maybe, Why?" and she says in a teasing manner, "Jack Sparrow don't know what he want, or he knows but is loath to claim it as his own." ....meaning Elizabeth....because the entire movie - until Liz shows up - jack is a mess, really. He is acting very strange and disoriented - even the little midget comments to Gibbs about how strange "er" Jack is acting....because he is confused...I think he finds himself thinking about Liz - wondering what it would be like - that's why his compass isn't working for him...because he (deep down) no longer just longs for the Black Pearl and freedom....or else the compass would have led him to the chest without Will or Liz's help...
"No it wasnt to scare Will... it was to get the location of the flying dutchman so that he could shove Will on it whist he persues the chest and Liz..who he has an inlking to see...It's Just like he tried to remove Will earlier when he escaped after hearing Liz was in danger.."-----LovelyOne
How much time really passes between the first movie and the second? Other than the peas in a pod deleted scene, there is no real indication that Jack regards Liz in any way other than as a respected friend. I don't think he really even considers a romantic relationship with her until he sees her again. He probably expected her to come after them, but when he sees her for the first time, he does look surprised to see her.
I just don't think he had her in mind when he went to see Tia. She did, and I agree that that line is talking about Liz, but I don't think Jack knows it. He answers correctly that woman vexes man more than anything because it's a pretty logical answer and he's heard the story before. I guessed woman, too, and I am definitely not pining over what could have been with anyone.
Tia may have had in mind for Jack and Liz to get closer the whole time, but I don't think he even considers it until she's on the ship with him. He honestly does not seem to know what he really wants in all scenes with the compass beforehand.
I have a feeling that his compass showed him Port Royal on the map and he's like "no no!"...he probably doesn't understand why the hell its pointing there..he's starting to feel new things because the compass isn't showing him the means to save his own skin so something is changing in him..he needs a bit of a wakeup call to figure out what it is..He got irritated at what he saw on the map and went downstairs..
this is where the parallel things starts to happen
He goes down stairs bumps into Bill and is pretty calm until Bill gives him the black spot..Jack now has an urgency to go and find the chest
He's on the Island and Will comes back into his life..he shows little to no care until he mentioned " we need the compass...Liz is in danger" All of a sudden it clicks in his mind...he remembers the compass and what he saw on the map he stops in his tracks...and now the urgency to find Liz occurs..
Liz is the chest...everything that happens after this is parallel too
Will wont let Jack get the key because he wants to go back and be with Liz..so Jack cant get the chest..he needs to remove Will so he can get the chest
Will is standing in the way of Jack becoming the key to Liz's heart. If he goes back to Liz then Jack cant have her..he needs to remove Will so he can get Liz.
Davy's chest is meant to be the obvious thing he's after...but subconsciously its Liz...i think its at the back of his mind..but its not what he thinks should be more important..
yea i have that same feeling too. that the compass showed port royal and is his brain vs heart. I might be wrong bout this but i think that elizabeth loves will but isnt IN love with him.
OO another lil theory im not sure if LovelyOne will agree or anyone.
After liz lost the shot gun and was looking for it(the scene w the krakens second attack) after she looked up who was standing on the shot gun she was like "omg no way is jack-he came back!'' I think at that moment she was thinking that he prob looked at the compass seeing what his heart wants(rescue liz) and that HE KNEW that he was wrong to run off. and that its time to do the RIGHT THING. I think right there she got emotional and fell instantly IN LOVE w jack..and she prob knew what she had to do so she could be fre out of the temptation so that way shell have no other choice than to stay w Will.
YES^^^ thats a perfect way to say it Heart Vs Brain!!...all three characters are doing this..and Jack is the only one who seems to accept what the heart wants at the end..Liz doesnt accept it..and I dont think will is...we'll have to wait and see in movie 3.
Liz does this with Jack..she's following her brain at the moment..thinks she should be with Will when her heart wants Jack
and Jack does this with Liz and the chest..his brain is telling him to get the chest..but his heart is telling him he wants Liz..he knows that he does as soon as Will says she's in danger during the cannibal Island scene.
Now dear old William. His heart is telling him he wants his father..but his brain probably tells him he wants Liz..
and you are very right about that theory below the heart vs Brain thing.
lol thanx. and yeah ur absolutely right!
jack finally took that step to accept his heart but liz is going w her brain bc shes supposely a person w a moral center and she believes that it isnt right to dump will whos a gentleman to go w jack whos a pirate.
Jack knows she did bc he won her over and hes proud of that. He prob knows that she was sorry for leaving him there-Jack is very smart hes like always 10 steps ahead.
I don't think Liz has realized yet, though, that it's love. I don't think she's labeled it that yet.
You've convinced me Jack's been thinking about her quite a bit. I always thought it pointed back at Point Royal at the end of the first movie, plus he's singing the song she taught him, so that was what stuck out in his mind. He probably just thought of her as the "one who got away" until Will showed back up and Jack knew he had a chance of seeing her again.
Originally posted by willofthewisp
I don't think Liz has realized yet, though, that it's love. I don't think she's labeled it that yet.
You've convinced me Jack's been thinking about her quite a bit. I always thought it pointed back at Point Royal at the end of the first movie, plus he's singing the song she taught him, so that was what stuck out in his mind. He probably just thought of her as the "one who got away" until Will showed back up and Jack knew he had a chance of seeing her again.
Liz knows its love..jack wins the hert because he protected it from the baddie(shell head) He saved Liz when she was in dire need from the kraken..so he wins her heart over..
reine mik, in the deleted scenes, it shows Liz with Jack on the island and she says a line from the song. He's never heard it and asks her how it goes and she refuses, saying she'd have to be really drunk to be able to sing it for him. It then cuts to the part left in the movie, where they both sing it around the fire. He's pretty insistent she sing it and you can tell he's never heard it before then.
I still am not sure Liz knows it's love. I think she still has it in her mind that this attraction will pass and she'll come to her senses. She won't, and we the audience know what it is, but I just don't think she's there yet.
hey i'm new here 😮
I found this thread interesting as the theories were quite decisive, and therefore gave a good insight into the characters.
LovelyOne i do agree with some of the things you seem to be saying here within your theories, but i also seem to think that willofthewisp is also right when he/she says that Elizabeth is not inlove with Jack. Not yet, anyway.
The simple reason being that in the first film when she was not even engaged to Norrington at the time, she still did not exactly know how she felt about Will (atleast she never truly showed it)...not until the very end of the film anyway.
Yes, she wanted to save the boy; he was special to her and she obviously felt an attraction to him, but it was him who knew exactly how he felt about her.
The same could be said about Jack and Elizabeth. She had an incling that there are feelings there for Jack...but she is not completely sure what they are yet.
In both films Elizabeth also ends up being the one spending the time with Jack;
POTC1: The Island scene
POTC2: The whole Black Pearl moments
The Island where they find the heart
I believe this is no coincidence, as the scenes they share together seem to incline towards the fact that these two particular characters are obviously heading towards something (either that or Gore could not resist putting some sexual chemistry in there for us J/E shippers!) that will not be resolved until the third film
The audience know her fascination with Pirates since she was a small child, and this could indicate that she is intregued by Jack, afterall; she was very un-nerved when she found that the stories about him were not completely true (on the island). This leads me to believe that there were indeed stories about Jack Sparrow, and she had indeed heard about them and wondered...
she kissed him out of curiosity... and the fact that she had to get him tied to that ship. They say that a Captain always goes down with his ship, and Jack was no exception here.
However, i do think that upon actually kissing Jack she realised there really was something there that she hoped would not be, because then she was faced with another dilemma.
She meant it when she called him a good man; in her eyes she saw that he had done exactly what she said he would do;
"The right thing".
Notice; she said this line within the curiosity scene, and ALMOST kissed him... now within the actual 'KISS' scene she TELLS him he is a good man and actually DOES kiss him...could it be a reward?
I DO want to believe that they are all inlove and will live happily ever after...but i have a feeling that this part of the storyline is for character developement; Elizabeth was a black and white character throughout the first film and only really came into herself at the end of the Curse of the black pearl. (As also stated by Keira Knightley and Gore Verbinski)
So within the second film they needed to make Elizabeth's sexuality come to life...and the only character to match that sexuality was Jack....he oozes it.
And as for her chaining him to the ship...
it was to further the story (obviously lol 😄 ) and also to get the audience thinking (like we obviously have been doing) and pondering upon the turn that events will take, and also the reactions from characters throughout the next film.
This does not rule out the next meeting with Jack and Elizabeth, however. I have a feeling that within the next film Jack and Elizabeth will have alot to say to eachother...and I for one cannot wait!!
Thanks for listening to me moan on, and if anyone disagrees then feel free...its just my opinion and no one has to take it on board 🙂
Shellie
xxx