But politics is an essential part of religion...all religions use it.
Government should be spiritual. Thats what gives the US constitution and the Dec. of Independance so much power. They are written with extreme spiritual overtones, wheather you believe these overtones are provided by gods, spirits, forces, or intellectualism.
the declaration of independence was written with spiritual overtones yes, so was the constitution, however morals are not tied to religion in society the way they were then. if the founding fathers were here today they would not be christians nor muslims. the only thing close to what they were are agnostics. spiritualism is not what gives those documents their power, we give them that power. we the people. and i am a christian so there you have it. i see god where i see god and spiritualism, government is not one of those places.
Originally posted by BuzzKiller
the declaration of independence was written with spiritual overtones yes, so was the constitution, however morals are not tied to religion in society the way they were then. if the founding fathers were here today they would not be christians nor muslims. the only thing close to what they were are agnostics. spiritualism is not what gives those documents their power, we give them that power. we the people. and i am a christian so there you have it. i see god where i see god and spiritualism, government is not one of those places.
I agree with you that the founding fathers were not be Christians today...but the power remains. spiritualism, (a concept of higher authority, not associated with any sepecific religious or non-religious dogma) is a great powerful tool. Jefferson used it, as did Lincoln, TR, and FDR. I'd like to see more of that back in governent.
Presidents who use relgion (*ahem* Bush) suck.
I'm athiest and I see god no where, but I'm spiritual and would like to see more of it in government.
Re: Religion in Government.
Originally posted by Alliance
Personally, I think government needs to be less religious and way more spiritual.What role should religion play in government.?
I believe that religion shapes a persons opinions. Given this, I do not believe that it can be separated from those in government. I believe that these men need to be capable of seeing and acknowledging other perspectives and opinions, and make decisions that compromise between the various beliefs. Given this, religion should play some role in government in that the desires of people that are religious deserve as much acknowledgement and consideration as the desires of those that are not religious. A balance needs to be maintained.
It is my opinion that there is no balance on the scale of religion. Those that make governmental decisions swing too far either in favor of absence of religion or too far in favor of a specific religion that they prescribe to. Religion should have some influence, but it should not be the deciding factor.
The problem with U.S. government today is that politicians are narrow minded and seem to view their opinions as right and they believe that those opinions are why they were elected, and so they do not compromise on their opinions when they should.
I believe that G.W. Bush is an excellent example of this. His decisions are based in Christian ideology and it is difficult for him to compromise because he lacks the understanding that even though a strong Christian support put him in office, he still represents everyone else as well. In short he's an idiot.
Originally posted by lord xyz
If by religion you mean Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Hinduism, Sihkism and all the rest, than no, it shouldn't be in politics. If by religion you mean organised beliefs, then the answer is still no, anything that associated with the word religion should stand clear of polotics. 😐
I do not remember your religious stance, what is it?
Originally posted by Deus Venèficus
He's Atheist... and incredibly aggravating.
If that is true, then he is only stating that his religious view should be the one accepted by government. It is the same as the fundamentalist Christian pushing for prayer, he is just the opposite side of the religious spectrum. His arguments are just as suspect as the fundamentalist as far as motivation for his decisions.
Originally posted by Storm
I don' t think that religion has a lot to offer government, and can help improve the way government works.
Honestly, people hear "religion" and "government" in the sentance and spaz out.
Religion and government have a lot to offer eachoter. We've seen what religion does when it co-opts a political system. The Vatican is a good example of this.
I dont believe the government should endorse andy religoin or religoin at all.
But i think that government desperately needs more spirituality, a sense of a moral higer authority behind it. Some source of passion and vigor that it is massively lacking.
Originally posted by Storm
I don' t think that religion has a lot to offer government, and can help improve the way government works.
The U.S. government examined the LDS churches welfare system to look for methods of improvement in the governmental welfare system.
I think that organizationally some religions can be of great aid to governments.
While I disagree with the doctrines of the Catholic church has maintained itself longer than many nations have, some of their methods of organization must work well and may aid in governmental institutions.
Religions are organized by definition, any government should understand the methods and systems employed in any successful religion.
I don't believe belief systems should be adopted by governments, but religions have other aspects that may be worth understanding and perhaps some areas in government should adapt forms of these other aspects.
Re: Re: Religion in Government.
Originally posted by Regret
I believe that religion shapes a persons opinions. Given this, I do not believe that it can be separated from those in government. I believe that these men need to be capable of seeing and acknowledging other perspectives and opinions, and make decisions that compromise between the various beliefs. Given this, religion should play some role in government in that the desires of people that are religious deserve as much acknowledgement and consideration as the desires of those that are not religious. A balance needs to be maintained.
I am fine with Religion playing a role in the Government. I think it's beneficial when Religious Services such as Christian Childrens Fund and services that provide food and shelters for the poor are present.
I am not fine with Religion dominating Government. I am very much against Laws being made to favor one religion's dogma. This country is not a "Christian" country, nor it is an "Athiest" country. We are a nation of Diversity, and that diversity needs to be maintained and respected.
For Religion to press that Laws forbid homosexuals from marrying each other, or attempt to destroy the pornography industry, to attack magazines such as Playboy and Playgirl, and to attempt to control media content is severely.....crossing the line.
Some people who are anti-religious go as far as to argue that Religion itself should be outlawed and have NO say whatsoever....that's completely wrong to propose something like that, as it would be just as hypocritical to do so as when Fundamentalist Christians attempt to suppress the idealogies and influence of non-Biblical sources.
Originally posted by Regret
It is my opinion that there is no balance on the scale of religion. Those that make governmental decisions swing too far either in favor of absence of religion or too far in favor of a specific religion that they prescribe to. Religion should have some influence, but it should not be the deciding factor.
I agree 100 % with you here Regret.
Originally posted by Regret
The problem with U.S. government today is that politicians are narrow minded and seem to view their opinions as right and they believe that those opinions are why they were elected, and so they do not compromise on their opinions when they should.
👆 That's oh so right !
Originally posted by Regret
I believe that G.W. Bush is an excellent example of this. His decisions are based in Christian ideology and it is difficult for him to compromise because he lacks the understanding that even though a strong Christian support put him in office, he still represents everyone else as well. In short he's an idiot.
I couldn't agree with you more 👆 ✅
That's 3 in a row ! 😄
Re: Re: Re: Religion in Government.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
I am fine with Religion playing a role in the Government. I think it's beneficial when Religious Services such as Christian Childrens Fund and services that provide food and shelters for the poor are present.I am not fine with Religion dominating Government. I am very much against Laws being made to favor one religion's dogma. This country is not a "Christian" country, nor it is an "Athiest" country. We are a nation of Diversity, and that diversity needs to be maintained and respected.
For Religion to press that Laws forbid homosexuals from marrying each other, or attempt to destroy the pornography industry, to attack magazines such as Playboy and Playgirl, and to attempt to control media content is severely.....crossing the line.
Some people who are anti-religious go as far as to argue that Religion itself should be outlawed and have NO say whatsoever....that's completely wrong to propose something like that, as it would be just as hypocritical to do so as when Fundamentalist Christians attempt to suppress the idealogies and influence of non-Biblical sources.
I think we agree on this. I have issue with children not being allowed to pray in school or read their holy texts there, I believe this is similar in concept to the disallowing of legal homosexual marriage, just not on as large a scale as the marriage issue. My stance on homosexual marriage is that I disagree with it, but it shouldn't be denied by government. My arguments in the past are based on a hypothetical if I were to attack it, I don't believe it is the governments right to disallow something that does not impact others. But if I'm going to argue the topic I will argue it from my personal stance and not my political stance, unless of course I am arguing on a platform that will actually be a tool of change, then it must be an argument based on everyone's rights 😉
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
I agree 100 % with you here Regret.
👆 That's oh so right !
I couldn't agree with you more 👆 ✅
That's 3 in a row ! 😄
💃
Re: Re: Re: Re: Religion in Government.
Originally posted by Regret
I think we agree on this. I have issue with children not being allowed to pray in school or read their holy texts there, I believe this is similar in concept to the disallowing of legal homosexual marriage, just not on as large a scale as the marriage issue. My stance on homosexual marriage is that I disagree with it, but it shouldn't be denied by government. My arguments in the past are based on a hypothetical if I were to attack it, I don't believe it is the governments right to disallow something that does not impact others. But if I'm going to argue the topic I will argue it from my personal stance and not my political stance, unless of course I am arguing on a platform that will actually be a tool of change, then it must be an argument based on everyone's rights 😉
I totally understand.
My personal stances are also very different from my political stances. For example...When it comes to Abortion I am personally against it, but not politically against it. Meaning I think Abortion is cruel, but I don't think it's so horrid that we should ban it. We should just leave more options open.
Originally posted by Regret
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For Immediate Release - Office of the Press Secretary - August 14, 2006 - 11:34 A.M. (EST)Remarks by the President
THE PRESIDENT: Welcome. Today, in a completely non-election-year-related panderfest to lilly-white temple merchant McJesus fanatics – AKA "my base" – I am pleased to sign H.R. 5683, a bill of sale which transfers ownership of San Diego's Mt. Soledad Veterans Memorial to the United States Government.
(Applause.)
By taking legal possession of this site, H.R. 5683's backers and me hope to provide federal protection to this ginormous eyesore of a Jesusgasm, which for 17 years now has been under legal attack by atheists and their shyster ACL-Jew lawyers. And shockingly enough, a whole parade of activist judges, with their faggish "legal reasoning" and unAmerican "adherence to law," have consistently ruled that it's unconstitutional for this here cross to be on taxpayer-maintained property.
(Boos.)
Fortunately, finding loopholes in that stupid Constitution thing is what I – or I should say YOU – pay my crackerjack legal department to do! And according to them, religious displays can stand on public property so long as they have a secular meaning. So what we did was have the US Department of Faith take a look at this here monument, and they concluded that it's just coincidentally shaped exactly like that thingamabob to which the Jews nailed America's favorite magically powered undead hippy some 2000 odd years ago.
That's right, it's just a giant, ultra-secular "T". And "T" stands for lots of positive things: like terrorism, terrorists, terror, tinkle-your-pants-acuz-of-the-terrorists-under-your-bed. This "T" serves as a constant reminder to the good folks of San Diego that they are not safe anywhere, at any time – unless conservatives maintain a stranglehold on every branch of the U.S. government. "T" is also the 20th letter in the alphabet, a mere holy trinity of three letters away from Dubya – the most awesomest letter.
Indeed, the San Diego "T" is a 1000% secular symbol that God favors this giant landmass over any other in the world. And as a war memorial, it is a tribute to the military industrial complex which has made the Bush family the proud war profiteering plutocrat chickenhawks we are today.
(Applause.)
But most importantly, this here "T" extolls several simple, totally-completely secular truths: Jesus is the Master of the Universe AND FITS AMERICA TO A "T", only dead Christian soldiers deserve to be honored, and no matter what the law or the constitution says, the Bushman gets to do whatever the **** he wants. (Thumbs up.)
(Applause.)
Thank you, and May Jesus H. Christ, The One-And-Only-Accurate-Version-Of-The-Invisible-Cloud-Dwelling-Superman, continue to bless the Red States of America. Amen.
(Applause.)