OH FOR GODS SAKE!! (sorry) (ted and terry talk)

yes that last scene was very "un jack-ish" like lovelyone said.

1) u never see jack risking his life over a person
2) u cant say he came back for the pearl bc at the end he did say "abandon ship..its only a ship mate"
meanwhile the ****ers from KTTC said he came back exclusively for his precious pearl. how the hell his gonna rescue the pearl by carrying it over his soulder??? put it in a bag????
3) u expect jack to yell ''HELP LIZ HAS GONE PSYCHO AND CHAINED ME UP!!'' but he didnt it was HIS decision to stay and face the kraken its not exactly that liz made him do it it was HIS xhoice to stay and fight for elizabeth.

i guess he wanted her to know that by staying and face the kraken. so that liz could always remember the day she fell in love with CAPTAIN jack sparrow lool

he does face death for other people in movie 1..but the way he does it is usually quite different to how we see it at the end of movie 2..he's usually trying to save them but also has his own safety at the top of his mind..but in movie 2..he comes back..is amazingly mature and brave and very set on what he is doing..he's not worrying about how safe he is in that scene..he's concerned about finding Elzabeth making sure she is ok and he's waiting for Will to fall off of what he's about to shoot at..

I mean usually if he's at risk of dying he doesnt do those kinds of things things. he puts himself first..and THEN makes sure the others are safe..so I could totally imagine the Jack of movie 1 actually shooting the thing whilst Will's still on it if he was scared about dying himself......and he actually decided to die for everyone else afterward...friggin amazing..you gotta love that man.

i already love that man lol

All great points. Other than Barbosa marooning him in the first place, Liz is the only person who's ever really gotten the best of Jack. She outplayed him in the kiss scene and she's the only "worthy opponent" for lack of a better phrase. She's so virginal and, I don't care what you say, she does have a strong sense of what is right and tries to do right most of the time. But she also has her devilish side, and Jack loves both, so much that he wants her in a dress (meaning her innocent side) or nothing (her pirate side).
Really, most of her innocence has already been taken-- being kidnapped by pirates, being marooned by them, participating in sea battles, thrown in jail, being a stowaway, sailing with a pirate crew, and then abandoning a guy on a ship that's about to go down will do that to you. So her sexual innocence is all that's left besides her sense of right and wrong.

wow... that was a great post. very nicely put.

i vote Jack gets her sexual innocence. Will can have her sense of right and wrong.

LOL.

All I'm saying that Jack has in no way, shape, or form taken advantage of her. He hasn't forced her to turn pirate or to play such an active role in defending the Pearl in the first movie. Did you see her barking orders and shooting and fighting with the rest of them? No ordinary high class girl would do that. So he certainly will not force her to lose her virginity.
He didn't force her to kiss him, and even in the curiosity scene where they had the opportune moment (I use that phrase a lot now), he didn't initiate it. She made the first move and he got turned on.

Originally posted by willofthewisp
All I'm saying that Jack has in no way, shape, or form taken advantage of her. He hasn't forced her to turn pirate or to play such an active role in defending the Pearl in the first movie. Did you see her barking orders and shooting and fighting with the rest of them? No ordinary high class girl would do that. So he certainly will not force her to lose her virginity.
He didn't force her to kiss him, and even in the curiosity scene where they had the opportune moment (I use that phrase a lot now), he didn't initiate it. She made the first move and he got turned on.

totally, TOTALLY agree. thats whats so curious and hott about their pairing. you always expect Jack to just get fed up and take what he wants from her... but he never does. its usually her doing it. LOL.
she could totally captain a ship. she's awesome like that. she is a very skilled seaman (er, seawoman), wears pirate clothing nicely, and can handle a sword with the best of them. she's made to be jack's partner.
i think sometimes Jack is bewildered that he is barely doing anything to goad her on, and she still keeps going more and more pirate. 🙂

Yeah, I already think they don't realize how much they're flirting with one another. Look at the scene where he shows her his compass. Now, true he didn't tell her he kind of sweet-talked Will into going on the Flying Dutchman, but he doesn't give it a second thought to tell her about the compass. I bet few people know what it really does. And the way he tells her, like it's this epic legend and only the two of them are in on it. I don't think he realizes how intimate he's making that.

WOAH you are just on fire tonight. i need to go write a paper... but WOW these responses are all soooo good!!!!

"its this epic legend and only the two of them are in on it. I don't think he realizes how intimate he's making that."

thats my favorite thing ever... oh my gosh... seriously... its so true and incredible... thank you for that!

he's making her part of his legend.

just a random thought..

what kind of person says something like "we're not free yet love" after some one says "thank you" to them?

and does he actually say we're..or You're?

and Willofthewisp I agree with you...and you know what freaks me out?? BECKETT KNOWS EXACTLY WHAT IT DOES..he's been talking to Tia before hand who is the one who basically made that compass. IMO she's told him something about Will/Liz that will effect the future of the EITC!

he seems to be hinting quite a lot that he is doing them a favour by spliting them up "wedding stopped or fate intervennes" and if they stay married they will DIE

why would they effect the furutre of the EITC? because LIZ is in a place of high power and if Will marries her he gets that power once Liz's dad dies..and he's not going to let them do ANYTHING to hurt pirates the way he feels about them at the moment!

they need to make him start caring about NO ONE but himself..so he wont give a crap how many people die for what ever cause

and how to do it?

Split them up..make her go with a pirate..and "rip his heart out" by choosing the pirate..

I think Will has the potential to be a very powerful man in the future..so they are controling his fate to make him be that powerful man in their favour..

Tia has her end of some sort of deal before hand..and IMO its to make Jack her equal by offering him immortality AFTER she has made him a man worthy of her..and the only way he will become a champion is if she gives him the chance to be with the woman he cares about so much so that he is willing to die for..and be amazingly brave for..

Tia.Calypso thinks he will accept but just like Calypso in the odyssey when she thought she was making Odysseus her champion..totally underestimated how much the woman in the equation meant to Odysseus

im pretty sure its we're

I am more sure than ever now that Jack is indeed the true hero in this story....I was just reading some research - to help a friend - with a paper on the six elements of a quest adventure...and it says that a hero always faces and slews the dragon...well, in DMC...the dragon is the Kracken..and Jack takes out his sword all prepared to slew the Kracken/Dragon...and that a hero goes through several character developments on his way to becoming the true hero and overcoming and facing his fears..and we all know Jack was running scared from the kracken the entire movie...until his character grew into realizing and facing what he really feared the most, loving a woman.....truly and deeply caring for a woman..that was what Jack feared most and once he faced this fear and aknowledge it (the compass pointing to Liz from the Longboat) he was able to slew the dragon....the smile, IMO, says that at that moment Jack realizes that Liz wants/loves him too - but she is not ready to face it yet...LovelyOne is right...Jack is ahead of Liz in everything...and she decides to chain Jack because it is a selfish impulse to save the man she thinks she loves...It says that a hero has the traditional task of killing the dragon (Kracken in this case), his adventures prepare him for this task: he has grown in judgment, resourcefulness and bravery....all of which apply to Jack in DMC...he has grown in judgment...he realizes that People and relationships matter over material objects..(she's only a ship, mate)...he returns the longboat so Elizabeth and the crew can escape...he is resourceful, we all know Jack is resourceful, and in bravery...he returns and fires the rifle and faces the Kracken. Jack definitely was planning to stay on the Pearl, cuz as we've said many times before over these past 2 months (can ya'll believe it's been 2 months) - Jack didn't call out for help which he easily could have and he didn't plead or beg Liz to free him or go crazy in front of her like the "Jackish" character ususally does in this situation...everything about Jack in that Last scene is different...he is so serious, the crazy Jack is not there...he is showing his brave, mature side. I love this Jack that returns to the Pearl...he is hotter than ever. Especially in that sexy coat..
okay I'm done for now.

LOL iyay..me theories are right 😄..

and yah the kraken is basically Liz..his biggest fear..the kraken has killed many men who face it...and many men including Jack think that a woman will be the death of them! lol

once the kraken faces him and burps in his face..he says "not so bad"

LOL NOT SO BAD!..it wasnt so bad facing the Kraken and it wasnt so bad facing up to loving Elizabeth either..

heck he even wants to jump right into that kraken "hello beastie"

just like he wants a relationship with Elizabeth now..

I had to learn about those stages of a hero in college 😂

theres always the "false hero" who makes his appearence too...in these kinds of adventures..and I think its obvious who THATS going to be lmao. Someone you think is going to be the main hero of the narritive..but OH NO..he's not..he's the most sinister man imaginable in most movies when he reveals HIS true colors

think..we have seen Jack reveal HIS true colors..and its totally different to the man we thought he was

Elizabeth has shown hers..but she actually showed them in movie 1! at it was completley different to the woman she appeared to be at first in movie 1

and Will still hasn't shown them..and whats he gonna be that is oh so differnt to how we see him right now?

wow i never have even thought about Liz being like the kracken...i mean its hard to put them together...a beautiful woman and an ugly disgusting sea monster....i wouldnt even think of comparing them....but oddly enough that is so true! they rae exactly alike!

lol ^^^ I always thought of them being basically the same thing to Jack...he's running away from it and he's also running away from her in the movie..if he faces up to the kraken he will die..and if he allowed him self to be tied down by liz..it would mean he would have to die protecting her in dangerous situations..and when you put these 2 things together in the movie what do we see? 😂

come to think of it and to add on to my earlier post:

we see Liz's true fiesty piratelike colours as SOON AS JACK frees her from her corset.the first movie..the first moment he touches her he FREES HER!..she can breathe..she can be who she really is underneath that kind of stuck up life..

LOL in a way that last part of your post seemes amost poetic in away....but anwyays...yea you are right. As soon as she meets Jack and he sets her free and saves her form her dreadful boring life, she isnt afraid to be more non ladylike...she suddenly becomes more independent! why? oh umm i duno...mabe becaus of JACK! it makes perfect sense

i love this discussion. beautiful.

love the stuff about the hero. so true. and the hero wins the lady.

quote of the day:

"faint heart never won fair lady"

faint heart ends up losing his heart to a sea man... LOL... 😉

this is so cool! i agree!

oh yeah and there is always the um..whats it."supplier" (If i remember correctly) in these kinds of hero adventures ..the one who always helps the hero learn how to be a hero on his journey..they often GIVE the hero something that will come in handy later..that will help them become the hero..I think the "supplier" is Tia..the person is usually all mysterious and all knowing..

and the Jar of dirt appears to be his folly..but its not..its his strength..once he realizes that he stupidly put all his faith INTO that Jar of dirt..he pretty much learns that material possessions NOW officially SUCK in his books..and this prompts him to actually embrace who he really is..someone who doesn't love material possessions he loves a woman...and then he's brave for this woman and saves her from the "other beast" he was afraid to face 😂

the supplier in Lord of the rings was that elvish lady who gave each character something that would help them be strong later..and she didnt tell them how it would..because they need to learn for themselves

the supplier inthe lion king???? RAFIKI!..he gives simba the REASON to be the hero..and pretends that he didnt.

yeah, Tia is the "supplier". She is the one who gave him the jar of dirt....if she hadnt given it to him he never would have FULLY comprehended that he needed somehintg..someone...a woman! to make him happy. That was probably Tia's intention. She didnt give him the jar of dirt to make him safe but only to realize it wont. But it will help him figure out what it IS he needs.